power of attorney

[POAPITA]

I don't know if anyone remembers my old thread on this and I can't find it.

I'm one of 4 adult children. I do all the day to day care and financial management for my fully with it mum.

I'd been added aa a back up attorney for health and welfare without my knowledge and refused to sign the forms. Mum abandoned the whole thing then so no
POA in place.

Now she's done the forms with my older siblings and they have been paid for sent off etc.

The laughable and worrying thing is is that she still doesn't know what these forms are for exactly. She believes they are only for after her death which makes no sense for health and welfare. I've told her I won't be able to liaise with the GP for her if my siblings are POA but maybe that's only if she looses capacity? I don't know and neither does she. They didn't consult a solicitor in the end either.

The sibling who has POA sees her about 6 times a year and wouldn't have a clue when it comes to mums health. It's a joke. When anything happens to mum they will expect me to provide them with all the information and will get angry and say I'm unreasonable if I don't. I've been unreasonable my whole life according to them but I'm good enough to provide daily care. Once mum is gone I'll not need to have any contact with them and won't d

If your siblings are only interested in the house sale then POA for Finance is meaningless. As soon as the person dies all money is frozen and the executor(s) take over. I think this is what happens. Who are the executors?

All 4 of us are executors.

I think you are doing your best but it might help solve any disputes if you keep more records.
I helped my mum manage her affairs before she died. We set up LPA and registered it but never activated it because she always had capacity.
I kept a notebook with everything I did, dates, amounts etc.
I put banking apps on mums phone and did banking with her for bills etc. Online shopping was done with her as the account holder and using her debit card.
So that left small shopping and cash. She would give me her debit card and I would draw cash out for her. Then she could pay the cleaner / gardener cash. If I bought shopping for her she paid me cash.

Is having her debit card a risky position if I don't have LPA?

If I refuse to do any future banking and management if every day expenses because it leaves me in a vulnerable situation then I will be deemed extremely difficult and unreasonable by my siblings and probably by my mother too. I will always be the one in the wrong here. I wish to hell she'd got legal advice like I told her to do but siblings said it was a waste of money and not necessary.

As long as your Mum has capacity she can make any decisions she likes about her own finances or health. Power of attorney makes no difference to that. So she can transfer money to you for doing some shopping for her if she chooses.

Power of attorney does not remove a person with capacity rights to make their own choices. That would be bonkers.

Completely separate. For anyone, with or without POA banks don't like it much if you share your bank details so they might object if they found out your Mum had given you her bank details and you were accessing her account. You would be better with your Mum speaking to the bank and having you added as a card holder if possible so you were officially allowed access. You don't need POA to do this.

Health and welfare POA can only be used if a person has lost capacity so no need to think about this at the moment.

Finance and affairs POA can be used from the time it is registered which means your siblings could use it to get in touch with the bank or the electricity company and speak to them on your Mum's behalf, say if bills needed paying. They could use your Mum's account in the same way she would. However, as she has capacity, she could at any point say to the bank she wasn't happy with anything they did and wanted it stopped and could request the office of the public guardian rescind the power of attorney if she felt it was being misused. So it would be stupid for them to start messing with stuff they don't need to.

I'm going to phone the OPG today for advice because I'm not happy continuing to do the financial stuff like I have been doing. My siblings could get very difficult about it although they will be more difficult if I refuse to do it anymore. I need to be clear on things like third party access to her account when I don't have LPA. It also messes up my own bank account and looks like I have more money coming in than I do.

Bloody hell confirmed as 20 weeks to register! That's a long time. I don't think my mum has any idea that it will take so long.

Just to update and say thank you to everyone who posted to help me understand.
Mum is going to speak to her bank and get me added to her account officially as a third party and/or get me a debit card for her account so that everything comes out of her account rather than bouncing around between mine and hers. I did her online shop with her yesterday and paid using her card.
She's been really understanding about it although she's still quite confused as to what she's signed and doesn't understand things. For example that the LPA ends with her death and the house sake would fall to the executors. Dear god I do not want to have to deal with my siblings on that emotive task. Once mum has gone I'm unlikely to ever have contact with them again sad as that is. The sibling with LPA is now quite ill and mum says neither LPA would want to deal with her day to day finances. What a farce!
Thank you again, it's been a difficult one to get my head round and of course it's emotive so extra difficult.

Lots of bad advice on this thread. If your mum still has capacity then the poa won't override any permission she gives you to act on her behalf.

Surely this arrangement would help?
Have you thought of contacting Age UK. I believe they give advice on how to help elderly relatives

This is still unresolved and it's transpired that mum had no concept of what she had signed. She's not spoken to the bank but I no longer have access to her account unless I'm with her. Siblings are rarely available and are busy with various stresses at the moment.
My name is still on the submitted forms but I've not signed them-will that be an issue? I have not consented to being a replacement attorney or even been asked.
We discussed this at length a week ago and she has already forgotten most of what we discussed which is a worry. She's definitely not understanding and I don't think my siblings do either. Mum has some ideas jotted in a note book that she thought would suffice for her wishes should anything happen and she was unable to make decisions. The preferences and instruction boxes are both empty on both forms yet she has a lot of preferences just jotted down.
It's driving me crazy and ages getting annoyed, siblings are getting annoyed but it's because she doesn't understand. She wasn't given the booklet that accompanied the forms and just thinks I'll continue to do everything but when she dies my siblings will sort her finances. That's the very loose conceit she has but if you ask her to explain what the LPA is for she can't tell me. It's very worrying and I'm just venting here really.

Just to update that the LPAs are now active having been registered last week. There were no issues with all the preferences stated or anything else. Nobody was contacted for further information and it was extremely simple once I took responsibility for it. It's taken since July for the OPG to process them but absolutely no issues. Such a lot of fuss from my siblings for nothing! Big thanks to those on this thread

To add that a new will was drawn up slimlining the executors from 4 to 2 and it includes funeral cost arrangements and there's nothing to worry about there. Bloody siblings

Glad every thing worked out in the end! X

@POAPITA It’s sounding better for you. Just discovered DM doesn’t have the health one in place. I thought it was. She’s nearly 100 so it’s a nightmare. She’s ok at the moment but doesn’t understand everything financial. She now wants to change her will too. Calling solicitor soon. At least siblings aren’t arguing - yet!