Internal relocation case after separation - advice please

[jaeno76]

Keen to hear from anyone with a view on relocation or who may have been through it in the courts. I am primary carer for two very young kids. Currently live in the south east. Gave up my demanding professional job last year as couldn't get childcare that covered work pattern. V difficult ex (narcissistic, bullying) also works antisocial shifts with long commute. He refused to move so i could be nearer family (400 miles away) to help me get back to work.

I have no mortgage potential atm. Ex has been so unreasonable and ungenerous despite being very wealthy. Refusing to stay on mortgage, or move out, refusing to contribute to childcare. We are not married so I have limited claims on him but he seems to be using the opportunity to punish me without seeing that the children need to be housed. Mediation hasn't helped and I am now considering going to court to relocate but I'm terrified of any court process and what it could throw up.

Does anyone have any experience of having gone through an internal relocation case in the courts - was it totally harrowing or was it OK? And any experience of CAFCASS and what they look for when deciding whether to recommend a move or not.

Thanks x

Roughly how old are the children and what contact do they currently have with their dad?

One is preschool age the other is aged 1.
He sees them on tuesdays.
On other days he sometimes sees them for bathtime/bedtime as we are all in same house at the mo. He is often away for 3-4 days at a time. The plan for contact after he moves out is one day per week and every other weekend...

Family court's position is: It's beneficial for children's development to have deep and meaningful relationships with both parents. This should continue unless it's unsafe or impractical.

Basically, the burden is on you to prove to the court why the children should spend less time with their father. In this case, they have regular and meaningful contact. Therefore you chances of a successful claim are extremely unlikely.

Valid reasons could for example have been:
-You have 4 young children and the father has minimal presence in their lives.

Disagree with the previous poster.

Firstly, you don't have to go to court at all. You don't need your ex's consent or a court order to move. In the absence of any court orders, you can just go ahead and move. Your ex needs to get a Prohibited Steps Order if he wants to stop you. You can, of course, apply for a Specific Issue Order before moving to ensure that he can't disrupt your plans by applying for a Prohibited Steps Order, but it is not essential.

Secondly, it isn't just about contact (and I'm not clear that your proposals would mean the children spending less time with their father). Contact will, however, be a factor. The court will want to see that you have thought through how contact will work to ensure that the children get enough quality time with their father. This could include both direct and indirect contact. You also need to think about transport costs for contact. They will be significant if you are moving 400 miles and you can't expect your ex to pay for it all. The court will also want to establish that your plans for moving are reasonable and practical. Moving closer to family and/or moving for a job opportunity are valid reasons for wanting to move.

How can travelling 800 miles every other weekend ever be beneficial for kids that young?

Just because you can doesn't mean that you should.

Unilaterally moving the children 400 Miles away from their other parent, risks making the OP look obstructive, impulsive and not child focused.

Believe it or not but the court does instruct some parents to move children back close to the other parent. If you are vexcious, the court might even make the the other party resident parent.

The right way to approach this is to put a proposal forward to the other parent, if contested then seek the courts view by applying for a specific issues order.

Does their DF show any inclination of wishing to become the resident parent?

I’d get the house sold so you’ve got a nice lump sum and make him think you’re moving into rented nearby.

In the meantime get as much email/text evidence offering him 50:50 for the pre-schooler, something like for three days he’s solely responsible, then you, and you won’t be providing free childcare on the days he’s at work.

This will be a good indication of whether he’s going to step up to the plate and parent or not. It will also give lots of evidence when you move back so you can show you encouraged 50:50 and a great relationship but he was unable/refused to do it.

If the parent has good reasons for the move, has thought it through carefully and ensured that the children will still get adequate quality time with their father, they will not look obstructive or impulsive, or not child focused.

I am well aware that sometimes permission to move children is refused and very occasionally an order is made requiring the children to move back, but that is usually where the parent's motive in moving is to frustrate contact. Scaremongering and suggesting that a well-planned move could result in her losing her children does not help the OP.

The OP tells us she has already attempted mediation. That has failed. Her choices now are to apply for an SIO or to inform her ex that she will be moving, forcing him to apply for a PSO if he wants to stop her. I would go for the latter route. If he doesn't apply for a PSO, that will be the end of the matter and the OP won't need to spend money on court fees, nor will she have the stress of a court case.

I am not scaremongering.

In the context or family court proceedings "good reasons" by parents can be partial and sometimes not child led. Moving 400 Miles away is life changing for a parties and has implications on education and a wide range of other matters.

My overarching advice is to go through the appropriate process of a specific issues order. This will allow the court to validate the OP's reasons and hear the perspective of the ex and any relevant 3rd party.

The court also grants parents permission go move children out of the country but this can require the children to be brought to the UK to spend 4-6 weeks with the other parent during the summer or two weeks every other Christmas.

Going through the court process is more pragmatic and considerate than going ahead with what could potentially be considered abduction.

Mediation hasn't helped and I am now considering going to court to relocate but I'm terrified of any court process and what it could throw up

Has your Ex specifically rejected your suggestions for contact and said he will not support the children moving? If he has communicated formally then there is a risk you are seen as unilaterally moving the children. It just depends on how a judge views your approach. Is there a contact order?

Courts generally support parties move on and that might include a move, as long as contact is maintained. 400 miles will obviously be a challenge, what was your proposal?

Your case will be that a move is essential to support your life going forwards. Your ex will state that the move isn't essential and that it will be detrimental to his relationship with the children. Do you have a job in the new location yet?

Given the quality of your "advice" on other threads, where you have claimed that "outcomes of family courts are pre-determined" (clearly untrue) and wrongly advised someone that they may face prosecution for malicious communication, I would take your "advice" with a large pinch of salt. The suggestion that the OP may lose her children just because she wants to move to be near her family and improve her job prospects is clearly scaremongering however you try to twist it. Suggesting that a well-planned move within the UK could be considered abduction is further scaremongering.

Op, just in case you are wondering.. in the face of conflicting advice - prh47bridge. is the one to follow. V experienced family lawyer with many years of service to MN !

I don't want my overraching message to be overlooked which is to apply for a SIO to secure permission by the court and move with peace of mind, rather than going ahead without consent and entering avoidable ligitation and uncertainty

For anyone who wants impartial insights, appeals in family court are public and provide a wealth of examples with great detail on outcomes of CAO and specific issues :)

"Advice@ on a forum or through different solicitors will always vary. It's up to the individual to consider actions available and choose the route that meets their preference for risk/reward.