International custody: part 2

[Mammalhama]

Hello! Me again….regarding my ex coming to visit our daughter after 2 years away….

The solicitor I spoke to told me to write up an agreement for the week he’s here. It simply said the dates he’s coming, and what things she needs to go to while she’s here.

He’s refusing to sign it - and says he won’t come if I require an agreement “to see my daughter”.

He’s asked me to tell him how to proceed.

Obviously I shouldn’t roll over and say “Ok” but I also feel like a horrible mother because insisting on an agreement is why he won’t come see her. Am I really doing what’s best for her, or am I letting my fears get the best of me?

He can decide to do what he wants with her on his time, surely? Short of long-awaited medical appointments I can't think of anything that can't be postponed in favour of seeing her dad for the first time in 2 years.

What are you expecting him to do with her when he's here?

Do you have a residency order, or some legal documents to confirm she is resident with you, in the UK?

Depends on the things you've said she needs to go to surely? Hospital appointment - absolutely yes. Toddler group - totally unreasonable.

He is clearly a horrible father if he'd rather not see your daughter than sign a document.

Don't back down.

Answer reiterating that he is welcome to access if he signs the temporary agreement and then do not engage.

do not back down.

I would be very worried about him taking her abroad, you would just sign it wouldnt you if you had nothing to hide?

I honestly would not let this visit go ahead unsupervised....!

Why do you need an agreement? Are you concerned that he will try to take her out of the country?

If he won’t sign it he doesn’t get to visit. You paid the solicitor for their advice, listen to them.

@RestingPandaFace

If he won’t sign it he doesn’t get to visit. You paid the solicitor for their advice, listen to them.

Depends - my ex wouldn't agree to travel 50 miles to see the dc if I insisted on him taking them to activity A on Mondays, swimming on Tuesdays, soft play on Wednesdays etc, never mind the time and expense of international travel.

If OP is concerned about him removing the dc then she needs to put measures in place to prevent that. At present the ex is making an attempt to see the dc, her rules and restrictions could be seen as 'frustrating contact' - there is no legal obligation for him to take dc anywhere op demands on HIS contact time. The dc has a legal right to a relationship with both parents, and mum has a responsibility to support that - she has not given any reasons to object to contact but is trying to insist he does x, y and z whilst he is here.

Can you imagine saying to your dc - oh yeah, daddy tried to see you but because he wouldn't take you to tumble tots on Thursday morning I wouldn't let him?

Or from his perspective (in a few years, cos kids are curious and will likely seek him out) - I attempted to see you, to make and pay for international travel, and accommodation to see you, but mum refused to let me see you because I wouldn't agree to take you to gym class on one of the days.

Flight risk = legal steps to ensure safe return to mum's care. She can't insist on anything else.

Activities: School, sports practices and matches she already had planned. She also had a 2 night 3 day school trip while he is here. And a dentist appointment for a cavity. He didn’t ask to come visit, he booked the trip and then TOLD me when he was picking her up. I emailed 5 times to tell him about things she has going on that week and he ignored each ever every single one of them. So….hence the visitation agreement being devised and send. The solicitor actually advised supervised visitation as their relationship has completely broken down. She has been so hurt by him.

Oh so she's secondary age? Entirely up to her then. Use the list of activities to inform him of what she has decided she will be doing and it's up to him if he wants to fit in around her. Agree that school, the trip, the dentist are definitely non-negotiable, the match probably non-negotiable, the practice she could miss though as a one-off.

Frustrating contact is the very worry I have…in terms of enforcing visitation parameters. This is why I come to ask these questions to get a different perspective.

Yep, these are all her activities that she wants to do. He also said I scheduled the dentist appointment to spite him and control his visitation. Nevermind the fact that it takes months to get an appointment here and she’s got a hole in her tooth. He could simply have asked me to reschedule. I asked him if there was anything in particular he was concerned about in the agreement, and if so we could discuss it. And he just replied that he will 100% not sign an agreement to see His daughter, and if I require it, he won’t be coming.

if I require it, he won’t be coming

Well that's a win then. He won't be coming.

Sorry you and your DD have to put up with this selfish man OP.

@HundredMilesAnHour

if I require it, he won’t be coming

Well that's a win then. He won't be coming.

Sorry you and your DD have to put up with this selfish man OP.

Ridiculous comment.

OP How long have you known about the visit and when did you book the dentist appointment? My dentist has seen me twice at a day’s notice for an emergency appointment, so I really can’t see why this couldn’t be rearranged.
Yes, she should obviously be going to school, and if the school trip was booked and paid for before he booked his visit then that should continue.
Sports practices can be missed for a one off, but he can go watch her match if she’s playing.

It sounds like you’re just trying to control him, but he’s not having any of it. Both as bad as each other.

@Mammalhama

Frustrating contact is the very worry I have…in terms of enforcing visitation parameters. This is why I come to ask these questions to get a different perspective.

And yet fail to include any of the pertinent information in the op.

Of course, secondary age, school is very important (though school trips are not compulsory they can be very beneficial), but sports practices and games are not essential.

He would be unlikely to be granted permission to take her out of school (say for a holiday) if he took you to court unless exceptional circumstances, which don't seem apparent from your post. As he has not had contact at all for some time, it does not seem that you would be deemed to be obstructive as he should be considering how to work around school and existing plans.

THIS is the direction I would go - that you do not authorise - and will not facilitate - contact during term time.

The rest of it isn't relevant at all as he can
do as he pleases during contact.

Incidentally, unless contact is imminent, get her to the dentist ASAP!

@Mammalhama

Frustrating contact is the very worry I have…in terms of enforcing visitation parameters. This is why I come to ask these questions to get a different perspective.

If your daughter is of secondary school age, it is likely that her views would carry a lot of weight if this ends up in court. From the description you give, it doesn't sound like your restrictions could be classed as "frustrating contact", particularly if you are simply setting out the things she wants and/or needs to do.

If you are at al worried that he might try and take her out of the country against her will you could make her aware of this.

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/girls-escape-forced-marriage-concealing-spoons-clothing-set-metal-detectors-airport-8764404.html%3famp

Appreciate it’s a different situation but it would get the same response from the airport staff.