12 points on license

[itsureis]

Over the last 18m, I have been caught speeding 3 times and now I have been caught again. Always on cameras and always just over the speed limit.

I'm a single mum and need my car for dropping the kids with their farther and for other things. I'm currently not working, due to COVID lockdowns but would need a car for work.

I'm not excusing it but I'm now so incredibly worried about losing my licence and the expense of it all.

Had anyone else been in this situation and what was the outcome ?

Awww OP, just wanted to offer my sympathies. I found out today that I’ve been convicted of two driving offences in my absence and currently have 12 points so am presumably also banned (court wasn’t able to tell me so I will try to find out from DVLA tomorrow). Mine relates to notices sent to my old address so I was totally unaware but the fact that there were two doesn’t look too great does it? In my defence, had I known about the first one, I would have been ultra careful with the second one but no excuse.

It seems I can ask for the prosecution to be reopened so I may be able to get away with 6 points rather than 12 in the end if they accept a guilty plea for speeding. But at the moment it’s a big fat 12. 😢

If I have been banned, does anyone know when the ban begins? So will it have been when the court made the ruling or does it kick in when I became aware of it (ie today)? I have resigned myself to the bus as I think I’m cursed as a driver (had a no-fault accident the other day that shook me up so might be quite nice to take a break from it for a bit). But I still just feel like an idiot because I normally try to be careful. Ugh. Anyway, as someone else said, your ban will be for 6 months, not 2 years so hopefully not too bad.

I think the ban starts when the court makes the ruling x

Thank you doughnut100 that’s really helpful. Presumably this means I’ve been breaking the law even more by driving around while disqualified because I had no idea I was. On my understanding though, once I file my statutory declaration to say I didn’t know about the case, it sets the original conviction aside and starts from the beginning so hopefully I won’t be in more trouble than I’m already in. I will never ever forget to update my DVLA details again (lesson learned). Or go over any speed limit ever again.

As you said, you're a mum. You have a responsibly to keep your kids safe, therefore you should not be speeding with them in the car OR when they're not in the car as you're risking leaving them without a mum.

That's a lot of times to be caught speeding in a relatively short space of time. You need to think about why the fuck you feel the need to speed so much. Sort out your schedule so you have time for journeys.

There is no excuse for putting lives at risk just because you seem to think speed limits don't apply to you, and if you lose your license it's tough shit.

Even being caught once would be enough to shake me up and be on guard and super careful forever.

Thoughts for the future

• cruise control (good for 20, 30, 40 mph limit areas)
• stay in 3rd for a 30 mph area
• put speed limiter on car
• see if you can go on a speed awareness course to refresh your knowledge about speed limits e.g. built up areas with street lamps always being 30 unless repeater signs say otherwise
• have a real think about what the underlying triggers are - e.g. getting caught up in something the previous night => wake up late => leave late ... Maybe get into the habit of actively and realistically planning the next day's journeys the previous day, so you do have enough time.

Take a wider look at life - speed signs are pretty big - if you're not noticing them, why is that? Are you not getting to bed early enough, or... What?
I mean cars are really heavy things. Nobody even wants a toe run over at 1mph on a driveway. So it is important to be alert and in control.

IdiotDriver123
If you have received a court summons if it’s for not answering the NIP ( notice of intended prosecution) then it can be a lot more serious than what people think )
The courts assume that you have received the letters it’s down to you to prove you didn’t get the letter which is really hard to do .
If it’s because you didn’t update the your log book with the address it’s rare they will accept this as a an excuse ,they basically say it’s your fault For not updating the log book
You can on the day often do a deal to accept the original points and fine but that would depend on if doing that will still put you over but you want to make sure that they don’t get you to agree and then still ban you

The not replying to the letter is the really serious bit as you can get a Penalty code called MS90 If found guilty which puts insurance through the roof as insurers don’t know exactly what you did .😂
Best advice would be to get the statutory declaration done ASAP and work from there
The speeding points will start from the date you were caught on camera

There is a really good website / forum called
Pepipoo FightBack forums
They are experts on all types of motoring speeding & bans problems

OP- please do not listen to some of the more judgemental posts on here. Even if you have 12 points on your licence you can make an application to the court not to disqualify you on the grounds that to do would cause exceptional hardship to you and your children. Courts are very sympathetic to these arguments as they recognise that speeding is often easily done, particularly if people drive a lot.

I make these applications in court all the time. You will need to email the court advising them that you will be pleading guilty but that you would like to attend to make an exceptional hardship argument.

Idiotdriver I didn’t update straight away my logbook and this happened to me ( only 1 ms90 though so not banned. Go on peepipoo for better advice. Since it went to the wrong address regardless if it’s your fault or not you can get the ms90 wiped, you will have to go to court though and usually they will let you have the speeding charges instead. It happens all the time as people are moving about so often. Don’t feel too bad.

Thanks @Mollyboom and @IdiotDriver123, and a few others that have given constructive advice.

I had actually hidden the thread as I was already a complete wreak and comments like "good !" were not helping with my state of mind.

I have no excuse as I was caught on camera, so think of me as you will .... Probably that I was doing 120/30, sexting my married lover, my children in the back without their belts on ....

Your heartless comments have made me realise though that any plea for a lesser ban is in complete discretion of the judge so what will be will be, and I thank you for that 🙏🏻

Hi OP

You can avoid a ban completely if you are able to show the court that the effect of a ban would cause exceptional hardship and effect the welfareof others such as your children if it caused the loss of your employment. Honestly just email the court and advise them that you will be pleading guilty but would like the court to consider an argument on the grounds of exceptional hardship so as not to disqualify. To prove exceptional hardhsip you would need to show the following

the impact that the loss of your licence would have on your employment

if there was any alternative means of getting to your place of work

the impact the loss of employment would have on you and your children- ie are you the sole breadwinner.

I hope this helps. Speeding isn't great but the courts allow for human error.

Thank you @Mollyboom that is really good to know. I’m hoping that if they restart the prosecution and let me plead guilty to speeding rather than failing to give information that I can avoid a ban altogether as it would then be 6 points rather than 12. But it’s good to know that I can plead exceptional hardship if they decide to ban me after all.
I have well and truly learned my lesson. I think part of the problem is that my car always flashes a sign on the dashboard at me to go up a gear whereas I should stick to 3rd gear in a 30 as it’s so easy to creep over if you’re in 4th or 5th. Not an excuse but I realised this when I was thinking about it all.

They may well let you plead to the speeding as an alternative to the failing to give information. A good tip is to keep your car in 3rd in 30 zones as it helps you keep within the limit- they told me that on a speed awareness course. Good Luck

Can you not ask to attend a speed awareness course?

@Mollyboom

They may well let you plead to the speeding as an alternative to the failing to give information. A good tip is to keep your car in 3rd in 30 zones as it helps you keep within the limit- they told me that on a speed awareness course. Good Luck

Thanks, fingers crossed they will. And will def do the 3rd gear thing in the future too.

@BarryWhiteIsMyBrother

Can you not ask to attend a speed awareness course?

I’m not sure. I thought that was just when you got the initial speeding ticket. Because I’d moved house I never responded to the initial notice so I presumed I’d lost my chance to opt for a speed awareness course. Obviously I’d be happy to do one but I’ve accepted that it will be a fine and points at this stage.

Lol at the advert on this thread

I managed to clock up 12 points I think just within 5 years. My fault. All just over the limit and 2 occasions were early hours of the morning on completely empty roads but no excuse.

I didn’t get a ban as I pleaded exceptional hardship as I just been diagnosed with a life threatening disease and needed loads of hospital treatment. Public transport not viable where I live.

Even so I will never forget the shame of being in court. This was over 7 years ago.

I am so conscious of speed limits now and even set my satnav to warn me.

@Handsnotwands that’s hilarious! Maybe I should take an advanced driving course.
@foofooyeah sorry to hear about your illness and I am glad the court took pity. I also feel ashamed about the court thing. It’s my fault for not changing my address (and speeding obv) so I have to face the consequences but it still feels really shameful.

You sound like you've learned your lesson and you're very repentant OP. I think you should forgive yourself, luckily in this case nobody was injured and justice will be done as you will get a ban/fines. People are really laying in to you, which I can understand given the seriousness of your actions, but this isn't especially helpful as you already realise your mistakes. How do we ever expect anybody to reform if we don't first forgive? Step away from Mumsnet for the sake of your mental health, you will have enough stress to deal with without the pressures of social media. Take up the suggestion further up the thread and visit the forum devoted to the more technical side of the legal aspects and use this as a trigger to change your life (and driving) for the better. I wish you luck!

[quote IdiotDriver123]@Handsnotwands that’s hilarious! Maybe I should take an advanced driving course.
@foofooyeah sorry to hear about your illness and I am glad the court took pity. I also feel ashamed about the court thing. It’s my fault for not changing my address (and speeding obv) so I have to face the consequences but it still feels really shameful.[/quote]
We all make mistakes, try not to carry that shame with you as it doesn't help you to hold on to it. As I said to OP, practice forgiving yourself as you would forgive others.

Thank you MrsMigginsMate that’s really kind of you.

Have you engaged a specialist motoring lawyer OP as I previously recommended?

Evening ...

I haven't appointed a specialist motoring lawyer but have spoken to a criminal lawyer, with years of experience. He talked me through the process and explained that a lesser ban is solely at the discretion of the judge. So I'll prepare my statement, expect a 6 month ban and be extremely grateful for anything less.

I consider myself to be a very careful driver and these are my only speeding offences in my 30yrs of driving. I have never made any claims on my insurance and I've been fortunate to drive in Europe, America and Canada.

But I've been careless which is where accidents can happen. I know exactly how I was feeling on two occasions as I was panicking because I was lost, on my own, in the middle of nowhere 🤦‍♀️. No excuse though.

I hate driving now and the car stays on the drive as much as possible, one less idiot on the road I can hear you say 🙄 but when I do use it, I'm consciously going slightly under the speed limit.

I am finding that everyone overtakes me, which will mean they are exceeding the limit, but I'm keeping my cool .... I almost got over taken by a tractor last week !!!

Anyway - I got a letter today saying they have registered that I'm approaching 12 points and they are processing the court paperwork. The emotion has gone from the situation, which is good, as there is no point in worrying about something you have no control over.

I'll probably disappear for a while as I get my shit together but I will pop back on for any updates soon.

Thanks for posting and for the advice 😊

You may have a case for exceptional hardship but you would be well advised to consult a solicitor. For example if your children would be unable to see their father, that might be considered. However the magistrates would question why their father could not collect them, or public transport would be unsuitable. A solicitor should be able to advise.
The following is an extract from the sentencing guidelines.

'Where it is asserted that hardship would be caused, the court must be satisfied that it is not merely inconvenience, or hardship, but exceptional hardship for which the court must have evidence;
Almost every disqualification entails hardship for the person disqualified and their immediate family. This is part of the deterrent objective of the provisions combined with the preventative effect of the order not to drive.
If a motorist continues to offend after becoming aware of the risk to their licence of further penalty points, the court can take this circumstance into account.
Courts should be cautious before accepting assertions of exceptional hardship without evidence that alternatives (including alternative means of transport) for avoiding exceptional hardship are not viable;'

Link:
www.sentencingcouncil.org.uk/explanatory-material/magistrates-court/item/road-traffic-offences-disqualification/3-totting-up-disqualification/