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Legal matters

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you have any legal concerns we suggest you consult a solicitor.

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Original poster

Road traffic offence - advice needed

25 replies

mumontherun14 · 27/10/2020 14:18

Hi there
Looking for some advice of possible.

I bumped my car into a parked car in a supermarket car park (Scotland). The car was parked across a trolley bay not in a space behind me and as I reversed I had some small garden fencing on the back seat of my car which fell giving me a fright and caused me to hit the accellerator instead of the brake and I bumped into the car which was parked long ways across the back of me leaving me less than normal room to reverse. I checked for damage but looked ok and my car was ok. I didn't have a pen to leave my details so I waited a while but as there was no one there I had to leave to collect my daughter and have now been charged with leaving the site of an accident and not reporting it to the police. My mum was really ill at the time with Covid so I didn't think about it much as had so much else going on.

I have now got a citation for court next week. I was visited by the police about it 3 days after my mother sadly passed away from Corona virus and at the time I admitted it was me and offered to pay via the insurance.

Now I have the option to plead guilty myself via the form they have sent me out and possibly get 6 points on my licence and around £1000 fine. Or I have spoken to a solicitor and they have advised it would cost me £1200 +vat for their representation and they would be aiming for me to plead not guilty to be able to get more information, negotiate with the procurator and hopefully mitigate the punishment and get more information on the cost of the damage so I could pay it.

What should I do - plead guilty and get the points and fine up to £5k or pay the solicitors fees as they have advised they would be going for an absolute discharge i.e no points on my licence

Any advice welcome Thanks xxx

OP posts:

Plussizejumpsuit · 27/10/2020 14:23

I'd ask what the success rate was for the solicitor. But I think if you were in a supermarket car park they won't fall for not having a pen as you could have bought one or borrowed one from customer service. You could have also asked the shop to do a tannoy announcement for the reg. I understand if your mum was dying of covid why this wasn't in your head to do. But I'm not sure if a magistrate would see it like this.

FelicityPike · 27/10/2020 14:24

Plead guilty and pay the points.
You were to blame, you hit a stationary vehicle while reversing and you fled the scene.
Sorry.

Original poster

mumontherun14 · 27/10/2020 14:58

Hi
I think the solicitor has very good success rate they are road traffic experts.
I am ready to plead guilty I know it was my fault. I have offered several times to pay for the damage.
I think the solicitor would only be able possibly to lessen the punishment

OP posts:

ProfessorSlocombe · 27/10/2020 16:30

Presumably ("Procurator") This is Scotland ? Might be an idea to make that obvious in your OP or clarify here - advice can vary dramatically depending on jurisdiction.

With that being said, you are on a hiding to nothing even thinking of challenging the penalty. As PPs have noted you have no reasonable excuse - and to try and push it much further could lead to you admitting you were unfit to drive in the first place. Not really a result.

Personally I'd pay, take the points, and make any pleas for mitigation myself rather than hiring someone in a suit to do it for me.

Quite aside from the pen/tannoy suggestion upthread, there was the option of leaving your details with the customer services desk too. So 3 missed opportunities to avoid what the police have clearly determined was "doing a runner".

Spaghettio · 27/10/2020 16:35

@ProfessorSlocombe

Presumably ("Procurator") This is Scotland ? Might be an idea to make that obvious in your OP or clarify here - advice can vary dramatically depending on jurisdiction.

Personally I'd pay, take the points, and make any pleas for mitigation myself rather than hiring someone in a suit to do it for me.

Ummmm it says in the first sentence that she's in Scotland.

Original poster

mumontherun14 · 27/10/2020 16:37

Thanks for the advice. In hindsight I could have borrowed a pen. It was a small supermarket (co op) so no tannoy system. I’m happy to plead guilty & take the points & pay for the damage as I’ve said. That just wasn’t the advice the lawyer gave me today xx

OP posts:

ProfessorSlocombe · 27/10/2020 16:38

OP + Spaghettio

you are of course right !

SourMilkGhyll · 27/10/2020 16:58

Obviously the lawyer will give you that advice because then you're going to pay them to represent you.
I would have thought you won't get off and you are best just representing yourself and paying the fine.

Original poster

mumontherun14 · 27/10/2020 18:58

Hi I am not trying to "get off". I have already said it was me who did it and I am happy to pay any damages. I have never been in the court process before so was fully ready to put guilty on the form then the solicitor suggested otherwise today

OP posts:

Lineofconcepcion · 27/10/2020 19:09

I think you should take the advice of the solicitor you are paying. There are very strong mitigating factors here, and my experience of the legal system in England (solicitor non practising) is the majority of judges and magistrates are very aware life gets in the way of making good decisions sometimes, and your mother being very ill (and subsequently dying) is a very good reason you didn't make the right decision.

Take no notice of the perfect people on here who lack compassion and understanding. Thankfully the law tends to see things more realistically. You do not need a solicitor to appear for you, but if 5k is easily affordable, use them to help you. You could try negotiating the fee downward.

dontdisturbmenow · 27/10/2020 19:19

I am ready to plead guilty I know it was my fault. I have offered several times to pay for the damage
You said in your OP that you checked and so no damage. If that's the case, why wouldn't you want to challenge it?

Lineofconcepcion · 27/10/2020 19:34

Where did I get 5k from. £1200 is a bargain.

peteneras · 27/10/2020 20:19

Somehow I'm not totally convinced with your story about the nature of the accident; that aside, I'd plead guilty and mitigate your case re your mum (sorry to hear that), etc. I've always found taking responsibilities about traffic offences to be the best option and is currently awaiting a decision re a supposed speeding of 24 mph on a 20 mph stretch. Utterly ridiculous, I know, but there you go.

Batshittery · 27/10/2020 20:26

As you have admitted OP, the offence is complete. The solicitor is looking to offer mitigating circumstances to lessen the punishment but you could do that yourself. Put a letter in with the form offering your explanation to the court as to why you didn't leave your details or report it to the police when you got home. Your reasons are pretty weak tbh.

Original poster

mumontherun14 · 27/10/2020 20:28

I checked and couldn’t see any damage but I know I did bump it as i felt it. The lawyer said there is no detail on the damage or how much it cost & if we go to the next stage we will get more detailed information

OP posts:

Batshittery · 27/10/2020 20:39

In England, it's not considered an accident if there is no damage to any other vehicle or street furniture. If the police have been they must have seen the damage to take it further.

FelicityPike · 27/10/2020 20:44

@Batshittery

In England, it's not considered an accident if there is no damage to any other vehicle or street furniture. If the police have been they must have seen the damage to take it further.

But the OP is not in England.....

Batshittery · 27/10/2020 20:51

Yes I know. That's why I said in England. I don't know if it's the same in Scotland

Original poster

mumontherun14 · 28/10/2020 18:12

Thanks all for the advice I have pleaded guilty & sent in via the form with a written statement rather than use the solicitor. Thanks again

OP posts:

RedHelenB · 29/10/2020 18:47

I think you've done the right thing.

wishywashywoowoo70 · 30/10/2020 07:53

@Batshittery

In England, it's not considered an accident if there is no damage to any other vehicle or street furniture. If the police have been they must have seen the damage to take it further.

It absolutely is still an accident. There could be damage the average person can't see or behind the bumper. If you hit something with your car it's an accident

FairfaxAikman · 30/10/2020 08:06

Caveat: I am not a lawyer.

I am in Scotland and my work takes me into the courts on a near daily basis.

If you choose to plead guilty, the sheriff (or JP, if you've ended up there) will apply a discount to the sentence to account for that.

The 6pts and £1,000 is the maximum available to him but it may not be his starting point for any deductions. If you are a first offender the starting point will be lower than for someone who's a repeat traffic offender.

Even if you plead not guilty, he will likely go from a lower starting point if you are a first offender.

Batshittery · 30/10/2020 21:43

You are wrong wishywashy it does not not fall within the legal definition

wishywashywoowoo70 · 30/10/2020 23:07

@Batshittery

You are wrong wishywashy it does not not fall within the legal definition

Insurance companies deal with accidents everyday where there's no visible damage on the car. They don't just say no mate sorry not dealing with this is not an accident. People still get injured whether there is damage or not

Original poster

mumontherun14 · 06/11/2020 17:53

Hi there. Just an update on this. I got a letter this morning to say my case was being continued and I need to attend in person on the 17th. What does this mean when I have already pleaded guilty?

OP posts:

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