Vendor has never paid council tax!

[sunmorning72]

I'm not sure if I'm being unreasonable. NC for obvious reasons!

We are buying a house and have just figured out that the vendor has avoided council tax for a large number of years by never registering for council tax.

This really bugs me, in part as it's just wrong but also very inconvenient! The house hasn't been graded into a band and this will take ages so can't start paying ourselves yet and we don't even have bins as they didn't officially exist! We will sort all of this out of course but AIBU to be very irritated to the extent that a tiny bit of me hopes they get caught?!

I started off all outraged but tbh, if they’re bankrupt it’s really no surprise.

My in laws didn’t declare there house and managed 6 years before having to fess up because they put their children into the local school who needed proof of address. You couldn’t make up the cheek of it really

God knows what they were doing with food waste

Probably flushed it down the loo - and if so, you might want to get the drains checked

Another one here who can't understand why nothing odd came up in the searches; if they've tried to avoid one thing I'd expect there to be others

Our full survey surveyor said 'you aren't mad to buy it but it WILL be a project'

Considering it didn't even have hot water, I'd say he has a point

Good luck sorting out the building regs with the Council, though. Hopefully it'll go smoothly, but that's not necessarily a given ...

Getting rid of waste would be easy surely? Put it all in black bags and take it to the refuse centre. We take all our recycling to the refuse centre. A black bag of waste at the same time would be no issue.

“Proceed very carefully.. It's actually hard to have a house that is unregistered - mail from banks can't be delivered, online delivery doesn't work, utility bills don't work.”

The house is registered with land registry and there was a house on the land before so I don’t see there would be any issue with online shops deliveries etc- it’s presumably not a new road?

They mustn’t have been able to vote either, or been on the census. Unless they claimed to be living at a family members house.
The complete audacity of some people 😠

The main fault lies with the local council who I presume having granted planning permission for the house to be built then failed to have the property banded for Council Tax (CT). Or the current owner had the original property delisted from the CT list if an original property was derelict and being torn down and then never requested it be rebanded once the new build was finished and occupied. There are several reasons for this happening but it normally comes back to the local authority having not realised or done their job. It is rare that an individual can 'hide' a property for so long but I've seen it happen.

The past issue is not your problem to deal with as you are only liable for CT once your purchase is complete and you own the property. The previous occupier is 100% liable for any arrears of CT and the council should pursue only them and not you . You are only responsible from the day you own the property.

If the local council have now requested a CT band been allocated they will ask The Valuation Office Agency (VOA) to assess the property and decide which band the property falls into. If the VOA have already done this then you can look up the band on the VOA website by road name or post code. If there is no trace of your property then contact them - all the contact details are on their website and easy to follow.

The important thing to remember is that you have the right to appeal your banding for the first 6 months of ownership. Check the VOA website for your road and see what bands have been allocated to similar properties in your road and the surrounding roads. If the bands are the same then you have probably been banded correctly. Look at similar properties in your parish/district area which is where Zoopla and a map are helpful. It is worth spending a few hours checking as it can mean saving on your CT bill going forward. If you have even just a little bit of doubt then appeal your CT band. It's very easy and an appeal form can be downloaded and it explains everything you need to do.

Hope that helps and sets your mind at rest a bit.

I'm amazed that your solicitor hasn't asked for copies of council tax and water bills at least. We've had to provide them and received them in moves. I wonder if you should be claiming against the solicitor's insurance.
Have you been able to insure the house? And do your mortgage company know?

I work in Council Tax. Provide their full names to the Council Tax office, and the details of the solicitor they used to handle the sale and the details of the estate agents they used. If you know where they've moved to, tell the Council that as well. The Council will try to trace them and bill them, they might not get anywhere but they will definitely try!

Also, if they’ve removed items that were part of the fixtures and fittings form then you should get your solicitor to insist that these are reinstated before completion (and discuss suitable penalties if this isn’t done).

I agree with @MothralovesGojira this situation is annoying for OP but not something that really affects her now the house has been council tax registered and Op is paying hers. It’s not really anything to do with her that the previous occupier didn’t pay

I have a relative who rented a new build flat for a few years and didn't pay CT. When they moved, the new tenants registered for CT and were asked by the council for the details of the owner/previous tenants. The new tenants provided these and my relative received a letter from the council asking if thy were the previous occupants. They ignored the letter and didn't hear from council again. So I don't think councils are very proactive about chasing as it's perhaps a small proportion of residents who do this.

You've registered I presume.

Don't worry about the previous occupants, not really your business.

It’s bloody cheeky to use council services if you’re avoiding council tax though, the dump gets paid for by the rest of us who do.
Our local council makes you show a sticker which gets issued with your bill.
I do hope they get pursued for the payment. Sadly it will cost the rest of the CT payers to do it though.

Definitely check the situation with water provision/disposal - if the waste water isn’t being managed properly and is causing pollution, then you become liable under the polluter pays principle.
Don’t let them wriggle out of anything they are financially liable for - you’re giving them a lot of money for the property!

Will you be doing an extension or loft conversion as part of your project?

Any increase of number of rooms / capacity that you do during your ownership do not incur higher band payments. So get it assessed before you do any extensions etc.

Ah, just seen the other details you written. Yes, they have been very naughty haven't they? The local council should actually prosecute in these circumstances as this isn't oops the council forgot but a willful avoidance of tax and registration. The loss of CT alone will be at least £20,000 but probably more. I saw a case like this at the VOA and it ended up with a fine of thousands , a backdated bill and a jail sentence.
Anyway, the CT situation is very straightforward to sort out. I would suggest you contact them by phone and ask to speak to the banding officer at your local Valuation Office who deals with your particular district and discuss from there. You do not have to go through the local council (very slow in my experience) because the sooner the property is listed then the better. This happened to my son when he moved into a flat in a newly converted building and he couldn't get insurance, phone/wifi or utilities sorted out until the VOA had done their banding and the local council had put the flat on to their CT records. Contact the VOA asap to start the ball rolling - do not wait for your council to do it. Good luck with the other stuff after that.

Has it got a water meter?
Anything built or subdivided since 1989 should be metered (unless it's only supplied by a well or spring).
If it is mains water and there's no meter then it's likely to be shared with another property.

Yes we've given the council are move in date. That's how we discovered there is no band assigned.

We will do everything 100% above board so I can sleep at night!

@MothralovesGojira - thanks so much, that is really useful information. Yes they de-registered when the previous property was knocked down and then just never re-registered.

Yes, house insured from exchange and we are buying indemnity insurance to cover the lack of building regs so that's fine with the mortgage company.

Yes it was a lot of money, over 800k!

Oops 'our' not are!

If they've avoided council tax I'd wonder what else they've been cutting corners with .

It’s not really anything to do with her that the previous occupier didn’t pay

It's absolutely nothing to do with her except for how it now impacts upon her own bill. She only becomes liable for the Council Tax from her sale completion date, and she can easily prove that if needed so the Council definitely won't be chasing her for a bill that isn't hers.

We always advise customers to put money aside each month if their property is not yet banded, as it can take a long time so avoids a sudden large bill you can't afford. Some Councils can set up a provisional account so you get an account number and can pay something in to offset the actual bill when it arrives.

Am not sure if Mothraloves made it entirely clear; the Council doesn't band your property, the Valuation Office Agency does. OP can chase up the VOA directly as well as the Council.

I don't think councils are very proactive about chasing Some are, it depends on their resources and how much of a priority it is for their management to collect all that is owed. Council budgets have been slashed in half in the last ten years so every penny collected counts.

It is actually written into the legislation that relevant parties should provide information regarding Council Tax liability within 21 days, and they can be fined for not doing so. Most Councils don't enforce this but they could, and might start doing so if budgets continue to be so stretched.

Sorry but I think you're a fool for buying it. They dodged council tax for 18 years, and are most likely about to disappear if bankrupt. Knowing how shit the councils are these days, they may just decide to chase you for the back payment. Hopefully not but I wouldnt put it past them.

Also, as others have said, God knows what else they've done. Flushing food down drains, dodgy repair jobs, have they even had the boiler serviced ever? And you're somehow linked to a family member through the house?

You're in for a lot of hassle I would imagine. More than you can maybe imagine. Hopefully not, but there's no way I'd have bought that house. How did your solicitor not notice this either?

Look for evidence of any unauthorised landfilling too, if they’ve just buried their waste which you don’t want to be growing any veggies in.
As others have said, just how far has their corner-cutting gone? Make sure a carbon monoxide alarm is the first thing you unpack!

It sounds extremely dodgy there are probably lots of other things that have been done 'not by the book'
If they're blase about something like this imagine what goes on behind the scenes!