Neighbour and noise. Where do I legally stand?

[Witchtower]

Firstly I am going to apologise to anyone who has already read this. A helpful MN opened my eyes to the legal section, hopefully I will have more luck here.

I will try my hardest not to drip feed.

I live in a period conversion that was divided into 6 flats. I think it was converted in the 80’s. We are all share of freeholders and all have exactly the same lease, which was written in 84.

Neighbour directly below uses her property as a second home and tends to come by every 2-3 weeks, sometimes more often and mainly on weekends.

I moved into my property 6 years ago. On the day we were moving in our neighbour directly beneath us explained that the neighbours before were quite loud and if we could be aware of noise. At this point it was myself, my partner and my 3mo daughter.
The complaints began very quickly. But at this point there really was no noise. My daughter slept 23 hours a day and I sat on my bum tbh. If she wasn’t sleeping she was BF.

The property had underlay and laminate flooring when we moved in. I checked my lease and it said ‘floors need to be covers with carpet felt it adequate flooring.’ I did a bit of research and discovered that carpet felt was a term used for underlay back in the 80’s. We explained this to the neighbour but she continued to complain. Constant complaining.

I became pregnant with DC3 and DD1 was 3 and DC2 was 1. At this point we received a solicitors letter. I emailed the solicitor with the reasons why we didn’t think we needed to get s carpet. Nothing came from this but a few months later we received another letter from another solicitor. I contacted them with the same reasons. At this point I went through the lease with a fine toothcomb and right at the back of a 50 page lease was a clause stating we needed carpet. So I sat down with my partner and discussed our options.

I called quite a few companies relating to noise pollution. All said the noise transmitted from our flat does not constitute as noise pollution. They advised that installing a carpet but have a minimal effect in blocking the noise. I explained to neighbour and asked if we could soundproof floorboards and get laminate. She refused and demanded that we install carpet. So we installed carpet. We opted for the thickest underlay and one of the most expensive carpets. But 18 months without complaints she has now started complaining again. She apparently doesn’t believe that we have installed carpet.

Where do I legally stand regarding my flooring and the noise? If she did get another solicitor involved could they enforce anything? It was her choice to get a carpet, against the advice given to her.

Just to add she is a very difficult neighbour and refuses to support the freehold e.g. allowing access to builders etc

Even if she sees it, it won’t make a difference. She’s not happy with the level of noise.

Her first email in 18months and she threatened me with legal action.

Aslong as you have met your requirements legally your fine.
Do your kids run around the place? That can be incredibly loud.

@Fundays12 yes they do but not when she’s at home. We are extremely conscious about it and try and leave if she’s home.

I totally agree, it can’t be easy living below 3DC under 6, and that’s why we offered the soundproofing. But she refused it.

You could cover your floor in mattresses and only communicate in sign language and she would still complain, people like this always do.

You are legally in line with what the lease states so all she can do is complain to the other leaseholders in an attempt to get them on side to request you to make further changes, but that seems like it would be incredibly unlikely to work if she is as difficult with everyone else.

Just tell her you have installed carpets as she requested and in line with the lease, general day to day noise in normal in flats and not legally considered noise pollution so you will not be making any changes to your flat or the way you live your lives.
Repeat the same script to any communication from her and any solicitors she gets to contact you.
Hopefully she will eventually get bored if she realises you won’t engage any further.

I would ignore her if she sends more solicitor letters take photos of the carpets and include a copy of the type of carpets you have bought. She doesn’t need to stay there she can move it it’s such an issue.

Oh she will not get bored. We’re talking 6 years now. I just want it to stop. I feel so anxious with every email/text. But you post did make me smile.

Freeholders on my side as she complains about absolutely everything!!! She also accuses me of the craziest things. She implied that I had entered her flat without permission, she’s put a dead pigeon wing on my stairs, accused freeholders if stealing her post. Accused me of killing her plants.

I’ve just had enough of it all. After 18 months without complaint of noise I thought it was over but I feel like it’s going to start all over again. I love my home but she’s making me so uncomfortable.

“We are extremely conscious about it and try and leave if she’s home.”

You need to stop doing this.
You are playing her twisted game and she’s clearly unhinged and enjoying screwing with your family,
Tiptoeing around and leaving when she is there is exactly what she wants, but it won’t change her behaviour.
In fact I suspect the quieter to try to be the more she will listen to try to find things to complain about.
She will not be happy until she’s makes your lives so miserable you are afraid to go to the toilet or make a cup of tea without her complaining.

Stop worrying about it, live your lives, make noise in your own home.
Run around and play with your children.
As long as you aren’t having raves or playing hopscotch at 2am her complaining is irrelevant and should be ignored.

She shouldn't really be living in a flat. You're doing nothing wrong. Ignore her. Smile, nod, ignore.

As you're compliant with the lease, her continual complaining sounds like harassment to me. It's stopping you enjoying your home.

Funnily enough one of the reasons we initially refused to instal carpet was because her complaints of where the noise was coming from was actually from the communal hallway. After we pointed that out, it is now a different area causing the noise.

I forgot to mention that she had told the freehold that she no longer uses her garden as I use mine. So now I have to feel uncomfortable when using my garden.

You are entitled to enjoyment of your home and garden. See a solicitor, sounds like harrasment.

I agree that you need to seek your own legal advise regarding harassment.

I think solicitor would be the best option but want to sell in the bext few years so I’m not sure if that is something I want to declare. But if she sends me another letter then I will have no choice. Such a waste of money.

My old neighbour was a similar level of unhinged. We lived in a semi and she genuinely believed she had full control over my property, including the garden, the drive, how often I cleaned, what pets I kept.

She would climb a 6ft fence into my garden to ‘fix’ things.

I went along with it all, scared to make things worse but actually going along with it all just gave her more fuel.

In the end, after years of this, I put a note through her door to tell her if she stepped on my land again I would sue her for trespassing and if she spoke to me ever again I would contact the police over her harassment.

She moved her attention to the neighbours on the other side.

I don't understand? /for 3 years you DIDN'T comply and she had to put up with it?

How long did it take you to comply with your lease? That has a large baring on the situation.

How often she uses her property is irrelevant.

op, i feel or you, but with 3 kids under 3 you wont be able to contain any noise and will feel uncomfortable. is there a way for you to move somewhere with no one below?

I think you were unreasonable in taking so long to put carpet in.

However she clearly just enjoys complaining now so I'd block all means of communication (text/email etc) and if she wants to contact you if must be via a solicitors letter. She can't take any legal action so just let her get on with the moaning and ignore it.

I've just checked as this thread rang a bell and you have posted several times all with slightly but significantly different stories

30 page lease/50 page lease/don't need carpets/do need carpets/she is preventing you from selling and moving out? All odd. I just skimread, sounds like all neighbourly relations have broken down.

If I complained for 3/4/5/6? years about my upstairs neighbours with 3 DC's under 6, making a racket and not complying with the lease then any goodwill would have long gone.

Of course she has harassed you, you took years and years to do anything, which to me points to you having an unreasonable attitude.

I think there is a lot more to this than meets the eye.

Relevance of her going on a Brexit march?

You want to sell and so have now complied, but it is hard to work out what is going on the more I read your various threads on the subject.

I'm a stubborn so and so. If she's still not happy with the carpets I would simply tell her ' go to court' and I would enjoy my day in court and hope the judge would see it in my favour that I have done all i can and she is being a silly old moo .its not the answer you want but it's what I'd do.

@WendyCope I clearly started the thread with apologising as I’ve reposted. Lease length is irrelevant. It’s long. I can tell you exactly how many pages if you want?

I’ve already explained why it took so long. Mainly because when it initially started there was no noise and mainly because I hadn’t noticed the last clause. For 2/3 years no one noticed that section so we didn’t realise we weren’t complying. My neighbour downstairs still hasn’t noticed that section in the lease. Not to mention that only 3 out of 6 flats are complying but she hasn’t mentioned that. If I wanted to be an arse I could demand that she gets carpet in her basement flat as it is in her lease.

Like I’ve already explained I offered soundproofing and she refused. What more can I do?

Yes protesting is relevant as she uses her flat as a doss house for her and her friends to visit only when a protest is on.

I can’t see any differences in stories, please let me know and I can explain.

I think it’s also pretty obvious to say that 5 years ago my eldest wasn’t 6. So complaints started when DD1 was 3months old and slept all day or BF.

@7circlemats carpet with children is not the greatest option so we wanted to avoid. As far as I knew and the freehold knew I was fully compliant with the lease.

I bought the property like this, she never demanded that old neighbours put in carpet. In fact she only asked for carpet when I told her we were selling.

@WendyCope I’ll be waiting for the significant differences on my stories.

Living under a flat with laminate is hell, you hear every foot fall ime. I imagine it really helped putting down the carpet. You are a family ,you will be noisy regardless of how quiet you think you are but that's the downside of living in flats so she needs to accept this. Let her take you to court and ignore all other contact she makes?