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Original poster

Question about getting permission to travel abroad with child when divorced.

35 replies

Schoolirons · 16/10/2018 20:10

DS is now 16 and we want to travel next year while he is still 16 on a mini cruise from the UK to Southern Ireland.

DS Dad is a complete nightmare and Ds cut contact when he was 16 completely.
DS Dad has chosen not to see him since he was 8 and has never paid.

Do I really have to still go to court or risk our holiday being ruined to get permission to take my nearly 17 year old by then out of the country? :(

OP posts:
Aprilislonggone · 16/10/2018 20:14

I would presume at 16 he can come and go as he wishes.

Ffsnosexallowed · 16/10/2018 20:15

No you don't.

NotANotMan · 16/10/2018 20:17

No.
This law is only invoked if needed. So if one party with PR has a prohibited steps order for example.
There is no procedure for checking permission for every single child travelling with one adult. It would be impossible for that to happen; it isn't possible to know how many people have PR for any given child, and no way to evidence it if asked. People can get PR by court order, either a birth parent, step parent or other relative. Up to 5 people could conceivably have PR for one child, and that doesn't even consider local authority care orders.

Original poster
Schoolirons · 16/10/2018 20:50

Thank you.
I have been stopped previously when he was younger and asked for a letter of father's permission and I know last year someone on the same flight was stopped with a 17 year old but border control were concerned as neither parent was there.

OP posts:
prh47bridge · 17/10/2018 00:46

NotANotMan's answer is wrong. Regardless of whether or not there is a prohibited steps order in place you need the consent of everyone with PR to take a child out of the country legally. If you take the child without consent you are committing a criminal offence, although it is unlikely you would be prosecuted. You also risk being refused entry at your destination. In reality there is a good chance you would not have any problems but every year a few parents miss out on the holiday they have booked because they are refused entry.

However, the other posters are correct. The relevant legislation only applies to children under the age of 16. Now that your son is 16 you do not need the father's consent to travel abroad.

MissedTheBoatAgain · 17/10/2018 07:44

Now that your son is 16 you do not need the father's consent to travel abroad

Good to hear as I may be able to get my son on holidays in a few year's time.

Odd though that Maintenance continues to 18, but child can travel without NRP consent at 16?

prh47bridge · 17/10/2018 08:25

Child Maintenance usually stops when the child is 16 unless they remain in full time education up to A-level or equivalent.

Original poster
Schoolirons · 17/10/2018 09:58

'However, the other posters are correct. The relevant legislation only applies to children under the age of 16. Now that your son is 16 you do not need the father's consent to travel abroad.'

Thanks PRH
Do you have any idea where I would find the legislation info that says only till 16 please. I might print it to take!

OP posts:
prh47bridge · 17/10/2018 10:17

The relevant legislation is the Child Abduction Act 1984. You can find it on legislation.gov.uk.

Original poster
Schoolirons · 17/10/2018 10:20

Thank you massively appreciated.

OP posts:
NotANotMan · 17/10/2018 14:02

NotANotMan's answer is wrong. Regardless of whether or not there is a prohibited steps order in place you need the consent of everyone with PR to take a child out of the country legally

Can you tell us how the border control check that everyone with PR has consented to every single child being taken out of the country?
In fact how do they confirm that every adult travelling with a child has PR for that child?

prh47bridge · 17/10/2018 14:08

I am talking about the law. This is, after all, "legal matters". I also said in my post that many parents ignore the law and get away with it. But every year some single parents miss out on the holiday they have booked because they are refused boarding at the airport or refused entry at their destination because they cannot prove they have the necessary consent to take their child abroad.

Collaborate · 17/10/2018 14:55

Come on @prh47bridge - you just need to get behind it! If people do get stopped at the airport it's because you didn't believe enough!!

prh47bridge · 17/10/2018 15:01
Grin
BookMeOnTheSudExpress · 17/10/2018 15:02

They don't check everybody. But they check some.

My daughter is now 15 and I live with her Dad. We also have 2 different nationalities and surnames. I also used to work for Border Control.

I won't be travelling without a consent letter any time soon.

Doyoumind · 17/10/2018 15:05

I thought if you had a court order that stated residence, the RP didn't need permission anyway. Am I wrong?

minionsragirlsbestfriend · 17/10/2018 15:12

Sorry to jump on thread... I'm planning on taking under 16's out of country on a day trip for sports competition in a few weeks

Not yet divorced but divorcing...he's yet to apply to court for access

Do I need his permission????

prh47bridge · 17/10/2018 15:33

I thought if you had a court order that stated residence, the RP didn't need permission anyway

Correct. If you have a court order saying that the child lives with you, you can take the child out of the country for up to 28 days without needing the consent of the other parent.

Do I need his permission

If you want to take your children out of the country legally I'm afraid you need his consent. Whether you are married or not is irrelevant. The law says that everyone with PR must consent to a child under the age of 16 leaving the UK unless the person taking the child out of the country has a court order saying the child lives with them.

Original poster
Schoolirons · 17/10/2018 16:35

Prh if we were to change the destination to Spain rather than Cork would the age still stand or would I need to check with Spanish Embassy do you know ?

NotaNot just because you haven't been stopped doesn't mean they won't. In our case it would be obvious ex has PR. He's on birth cert and also we had the same surname at the time.

I've been questioned entering another country once.
Leaving another country once (which was actually horrendous) and am asked almost every time re-entering the UK.

OP posts:
BananaBonanza · 17/10/2018 16:57

@prh47bridge

Can I hijack ask a question? I have an old contact order. It gives joint residency but at the time my understanding from the solicitor was that I didn't need permission to leave the country. If I had I would have had it written in at the time. The order says between..... the kids live with mum.... and between..... the kids live with dad.

Of course since then he's shown himself to be an utter shit and the kids have had no contact for a few years now. It didn't go back to court because despite violence there was a risk the kids would still have to go so I didn't take it and he never bothered. There's no way I'm reminding him we exist to ask permission.

I still travel (with a brick of paperwork documenting everything). But I'm wondering whether the wording above puts me in the clear anyway. It would be nice not to break into a cold sweat everytime we go through customs. Although so far they've always let us go...Grin

blackcat86 · 17/10/2018 16:58

In fairness I'm not sure how often people actually get stopped. My DSS is 14 but has been taken out of the country several times by BM without DHs written permission. She doesn't ask, she just does what she wants. It's great that he experiences time abroad but it's often during term time which I don't think is appropriate now he's doing GCSEs. She's taking him away regardless and hasn't had any issues in the past.

prh47bridge · 17/10/2018 17:00

The age is determined by the Hague Convention on Child Abduction (which is reflected in the UK's Child Abduction Act) and is 16 across all countries signed up to that convention. So it makes no difference whether you are going to Spain or Cork.

prh47bridge · 17/10/2018 17:03

BananaBonanza

You are fine. That order means that you can take your children out of the country for up to one month without needing to get consent from your ex. Your ex also has the right to take your children out of the country without your consent, although that clearly isn't going to happen if he has no contact with them.

minionsragirlsbestfriend · 17/10/2018 17:04

I guess I'd better try and get a court order fast then... how quickly can you do that?

BlackAmericanoNoSugar · 17/10/2018 17:05

Are you flying to Ireland or boarding and disembarking the mini cruise in the UK? The most I've had to show flying in and out of Ireland or the UK was the CD's adoption cert (birth cert in your case) and I think that was mostly because they have a different surname to me. DH has the same surname as them and very rarely has to show the cert. Neither of us have been asked if we have the permission of the other parent. I've never had to show anything, not even a passport, when travelling between the two countries by sea.

I'm not sure what the requirement would be for Spain.