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Original poster

I need legal help - they want to scaffold my garden

51 replies

lidlstory · 17/06/2015 10:48

We moved into a rented house a couple of months ago. Not long after we moved in we got an email from the managing agent to say that our LL (who usually lives at the property) had agreed to allow the next door neighbours (a college) to erect scaffolding in our garden so they could carry out maintenance work on their roof. It would 'only' be up for 11 weeks from June to August. Apparently he had forgotten he had agreed to it.

Our house is quite special because, in an area where noone has a garden, we have a big front courtyard behind high gates. The front of the house opens out completely so in the summer you can use the whole space and it's private and safe, with high walls all round. We have young children and a dog. It's also right by the sea.

We pay the highest rent available in this area. He really took top dollar.

So the agent has come back to me to say the neighbours are going for a court order to force us to allow the scaffolding which will be inside our courtyard on the party wall. They have quoted various legislation (party wall, essential maintenance) and the agent thinks they have a strong case and is suggesting we get legal advice unless we want to take their compensation of £250. We don't need the money, we just want our summer.

I am so livid. We rented this place for a peaceful summer by the sea and it's going to turn into a noisy nightmare and I won't even be able to relax because the children will have an instant climbing frame to amuse them, plus we won't be able to eat outside, etc.

I am torn between telling them to go for the court order in the hope this will at least take the summer to come through and demanding a very high compensation from the LL (2 months rent at least) on the grounds that we will go away for at least a month. Or requesting to surrender the lease.

I would love some legal advice on how long a court order would take to come through and whether they are likely to win.

Sorry for the essay Smile

OP posts:
Original poster
lidlstory · 17/06/2015 18:46

DH has agreed to go ahead with the lawyer, so three blistering letters will be winging their way within 24 hours. It will cost us 600 quid but it should get us results: the letter to him will set out our very strong case and suggest he lets us out of our contract, which will be just fine by us - we have a viewing on Monday.

I think the letter will show all parties that we are serious

OP posts:
tyto · 22/06/2015 09:17

Can you go on to claim the £600 back from the LL in the small claims court?

FiftyShadesOfSporn · 22/06/2015 17:50

I wonder if a subject access request to the letting agent would move things along at all?

RepeatAdNauseum · 22/06/2015 17:51

£600 for three letters Shock

Have you had any reply yet? I hope it's going well.

Original poster
lidlstory · 22/06/2015 17:56

Thanks for your interest everyone Smile

The neighbour (it's a college, so it was the principal) came round the other day on a huge charm offensive, was very apologetic etc, and told me my LL had signed a series of documents with their solicitor, including agreeing to a time schedule for the works! Plot thickens!

My lawyer had sent out the letters to everyone except the LL because I wanted to speak to him first (we have mutual friends so wanted to tread carefully). I spoke to him before the weekend and he said he definitely hasn't signed anything. So I called back the principal and said she would need to produce the docs so I could advise my lawyer but strangely their phone went out of range. No docs have appeared. I think I believe my LL.

So, I'm waiting to hear more news. The works are due to start next monday. College have said if I don't allow it they will lose hundreds of thousands of pounds as this is the only tiny time window they have.

OP posts:
Collaborate · 22/06/2015 22:03

Well then, I think your co-operation now has a price!!!!!

DorisLessingsCat · 23/06/2015 10:25

So you think the head of college was bluffing when they said they have a legal agreement in place? Sounds dodgy.

Original poster
lidlstory · 23/06/2015 10:57

I don't know Doris, but either my LL or the college head is lying. My LL says they came round and talked to him about it and he agreed in principle and they said they would go ahead and apply for planning permission. That was October last year.

According to the legislation they are quoting they need to give two month's notice, and I think it has to be written notice as I can't imagine verbal notice would work.

However, he did give them permission so I don't really know what's going to happen.

OP posts:
gallicgirl · 23/06/2015 11:10

I wonder if the college agreed to compensate your LL and therefore don't want to produce the documents?

Or like you say, they didn't bother with written notice as they thought it wouldn't matter?

I'd be concerned about privacy. Never mind the inconvenience of scaffolding in your yard, I wouldn't want builders watching me.

RepeatAdNauseum · 23/06/2015 11:19

I think they are sucking you into a battle that isn't yours to fight, so that it's too late for you to do anything.

From your POV, it doesn't matter if your LL didn't sign documents, he doesn't seem to deny giving permission and the work is now scheduled. Will he release you from your contract?

If the work starts on Monday, you don't have very long to arrange moving elsewhere.

On Monday, a scaffolding company will turn up wanting to use your garden. You'd probably want some water-tight legal advice on whether you can refuse them, because you wouldn't want to be liable for costs arising from not having access. That advice will be difficult to get without knowing what has been agreed, which nobody seems to want to tell to you.

if you let them set up the scaffolding, it doesn't really matter if they pause works while they sort this out or not, because the garden is scaffolded.

TensionWheelsCoolHeels · 23/06/2015 11:19

You would think that someone responsible for this work's budget would have ensured everything was signed in triplicate & was watertight before getting the 'hundreds of thousands of pounds' worth of work booked & signed off for this so-called narrow window of opportunity Hmm

OP good luck - I hope you get an outcome that works for you - I'm not a lawyer so have nothing useful to add Smile

Original poster
lidlstory · 23/06/2015 11:31

Hi repeat. I'm waiting to hear back from the college head today so she can provide the 'paper trail' she claims exists.

My solicitor has sent letters denying access to the agent and the contractor.

I too believe they are hoping to push it to the wire so that we have no choice but to succumb. My LL suggested paying us 1k (he suggested it to the agency not to us) before he spoke to me on the phone. I told the agency we couldn't care less about 1k. LL is apply for some major planning permission next year (building up a floor) so I don't suppose he will want his neighbour (the college) to object...

I think that if we refuse them access on monday (which will be easy because we will have to let them in the gate) then I would be worried they would sue us for expenses. I'm going to speak to the lawyer again today.

OP posts:
Enidblytonrules · 23/06/2015 12:03

Sorry to be a cynic - either your ll is a liar or has selective memory syndrome - cannot believe he forgot all about the work particularly as they discussed it with him last October - which he does remember!!

My gut reaction is that he planned his travelling to coincide with the work and left you to pick up the pieces - some friend!!

Is he reimbursing you legal costs?

Collaborate · 23/06/2015 13:18

The maintenance work is to the roof, so the Party Wall Act won't apply.

What makes you think it's a party wall anyway? Often such walls are the property of the building owner, built up to, but not straddling, the boundary.

They can force access by applying to court under the Access to Neighbouring Land Act 1992. The court can only make an access order if it is satisfied that the works are reasonably necessary for the preservation of the whole or any part of the neighbour's land and that they cannot be carried out, or would be substantially more difficult to carry out, without entry upon the your land.

Section 2 of the Act provides a list of what can be contained in an access order: www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1992/23/section/2

Note in particular the provisions in sub-sections 5&6 that say how compensation may be calculated.

Sub-section 9 says how the court can order the neighbour to pay your costs. Nothing is contained in this section entitling the neighbour to their costs.

Original poster
lidlstory · 23/06/2015 15:00

Thanks Collaborate.

Well, I've just received an email saying the LL will give us one month's free rent for the first 6 weeks and thereafter the college will pay our rent for as long as the scaffolding stays up.

I don't know what to think really. It just means we'll have a noisy summer with eyesore scaffolding.

I suppose it's a fair offer - going to think about it overnight.

OP posts:
Collaborate · 23/06/2015 15:06

Sounds like your LL has come to his own financial arrangement with them. And they still haven't shown you a copy of their agreement with him?

PausingFlatly · 23/06/2015 17:18

Do you want to live there at all?

BitterChocolate · 23/06/2015 17:25

If they're paying your rent while the scaffolding is up then would you be able to move out somewhere else temporarily? I suppose the trouble would be finding somewhere for a short term let in the height of summer.

Icimoi · 23/06/2015 18:57

£600 for three letters!

It won't just be for the letters. It will be for the time OP has spent with the solicitor, plus going through the paperwork, plus drafting the letters which won't be short and will have to be drafted very carefully indeed.

PennilynLott · 23/06/2015 19:35

Could the principal not provide proof? Is that why they're offering to pay the rent?

LotusLight · 23/06/2015 21:06

It sounds like a reasonable offer so you could use that rent to find (if you can find it) a nice little place for say half the week when the works are very noisy in the summer although you don't really want to be letting two places at once.

flipyoumelonfarmer · 23/06/2015 21:22

This is no help to you at all, but I reckon the LL has signed documents giving permission, but nobody wants you to see them because the same documents set out how much compensation the college is paying your LL for his agreement.

But that's by-the-by, really. If you do agree, have a really good think about what conditions you want to impose. The big one for me would be that they're not to play music (unless you really enjoy Heart FM).

Original poster
lidlstory · 23/06/2015 22:20

Well for a start, it turns out the scaffolding is for support, so there won't be anyone on it, it will be alarmed and covered and they only need access to put it up and take it down.

I want to know whether the LL signed a doc or not. If he did, he is over a barrel and that will help if we want him to surrender the lease.

OP posts:
SoldierBear · 23/06/2015 22:34

There does seem to be something that both LL and college head are hiding. No doubt the college lawyers have been beavering away behind the scenes.

It sounds as if LL is getting some hefty compensation.

Collaborate · 24/06/2015 00:46

Compensation that should be due to you, seeing as you're the one whose right to peaceful enjoyment of the property will be interrupted.