Mediation queries (divorce related)

[bobs123]

After over a year of drawn-out communication between stbx and myself via our solicitors, we are now going to mediation. We have got as far as decree nisi and DC are sorted (he is paying maintenance following a push via my solicitor)).

We exchanged all the finance stuff and got as far as a proposal and a counter proposal. We are not worth a massive amount depending on how you look at it, but because it has taken so long to get to this point (not my fault) my solicitor has now suggested this.

I have tried to research this and have the following queries if anyone can help

1. Is mediation paid for jointly, and if there are extra charges incurred through, for example, one side cancelling/not attending an appointment, who pays?

2. Are our solicitors present, or do we report back to them?

3. If one side does not turn up to even the initial meeting, can it then proceed to court?

4. If the mediator cannot give advice, how can this be resolved? Is it really down to me and stbx to make the decisions?

5. could an agreement be reached, and then one side go back on it?

I realise it is all about being reasonable, but incredibly difficult to deal with someone who claims to know nothing about finances, is incredibly busy, takes 5 months to reply to a query, and who really, really would cut off his nose to spite his face (just a touch of sarcasm there!).

I would be so grateful for any help or useful advice given as I know there are those of you on here with the relevant experience to do so.

Just seen this thread - thought it had "died"

So...mediation tales.....

To recap we did a year of solicitors and were then referred to mediation

In December we had our first individual sessions. I was asked what in particular I wanted to focus on (finance). I was asked a rough estimate of my assets. This meeting had a set charge, should have lasted about an hour but I was in for longer. The mediator explained the process etc and asked about any worries etc.

Any communication to the mediator thereafter outside meetings is done via an assistant who has been brilliant at letting me know whether STBX confirmed appointments etc. EG when he was asked his availability in January and didn't respond I suggested the assistant give him an actual date.

We then had our first joint meeting in January. I think they are expected to be around 11/2 hrs. We were in for just over 2 hrs. This is now on an hourly rate which will include any prep work the mediator has to do and writing it all up afterwards.

It was conducted in a very non confrontational way - just 3 chairs in the room, no table. The mediator tried to conduct the way the meeting went but we did go off at a tangent a lot - very quibbly timewasting stuff. As stbx and I had not seen each other for months there was a lot to discuss so it was difficult to stay focused. We were also expected to bring all our documents - we had been given a list at the first meeting. This includes reasonable needs for now and the future. This is basically what the meetings will be based on I think - who needs what re accommodation and living expenses. Unfortunately he didn't bring his. We also both signed a contract basically saying we agreed to give mediation our best shot.

About a week late I received the notes of the meeting - what had been discussed and points for us each to focus on. We have also been given a date for our next meeting this month (they are about a month apart). stbx has been asked to submit his paperwork prior to the next meeting so it can be distributed for our perusal.

I would say the mediator so far has been brilliant. It's true they can't give advice but they can say things like how the court system works and "have you thought about this?". It will also only work if both sides want it to and are fed up with solicitor's bills/procrastinating

Oh, and there is a case to be made if you have DC over 18 who live with you. Even if they are at uni they still spend half their time at home!

Do you know how I can make a case for over 18s?

I have two, one unemployed, at the moment and the youngest will be 18 in two years and will be in FE.

I have been told they have no right to financial support, I really do not want to move for the moment so am trying to work out how I can keep the house.

Fuckit Who told you they have no right to financial support? If the youngest is still in eduction and is living with you then absolutely you should get support at a prescribed amount of his gross income. I don't know how far along you are...are you mediating? Has Section 25 of the MCA (matrimonial Causes Act) been pointed out to you? Are the DC living with you? Have you exchanged finance disclosure?

As I said it all comes down to reasonable needs for the future. for example if you are not working or have a lower income than him due to being a SAHM you can argue that you need either a larger share of the pot for your DC (they spend half the year at home even when away at uni) or if the pot is not large enough to rehouse you both/allow to to stay in the house then you need financial support for yourself/DC.

PM me if you like. Not an expert by any remote stretch of the imagination but have done a fair bit of research

that should read you should get support at a prescribed amount of your XH's income

He has accepted he will pay for youngest until finished a levels, and will pay me some support until that point. He has stated he will not pay for the nearly 18 year old when he turns 18 even if unemployed. He will not contribute toward 20 year old who is working and living at home. My solicitor did not suggest otherwise.

I earn far less than him but he has a baby on the way and a partner who intends to give up work. There is not enough money to keep house, but I can't afford anything big enough for us all, renting as there is effectively no capital.

Did form e last year, my sol made an offer, he refused. He made an offer, I refused as could not afford to live with children. No money for Court. Sol has suggested mediation as she does not think he will agree to what I need.

I am trying to get the courage to make appt for mediation. I can't pay the bills next month as he has reduced maintence to what he thinks is fair and can afford. Mediation is expensive. I am also a bit intimidated by him, although I still miss him badly. Mediator will do shuttle mediation if needed. I also needs of pay for some dentist stuff and would like to do some counselling to help me through. NHS provision was useless in both cases.

I am in a bit of a mess really. Any pointers v gratefully accepted. I think I need to go to CAB for help.

I think you should perhaps consider mediation. As long as you get a good mediator, who should not allow any intimidation to take place, you might have a chance of sorting things. I would say that shuttling would be very time wasteful and difficult in achieving the objective. There are those that say if you have an abusive ex then mediation should not be an option. Having said that, unless you have a total tosser like some EXs on MN doing the solicitor bit for a while is enough to take the wind out of anyone's sails because of the cost and might make them more reasonable. I found it a lot easier than expected, but then you build it up and up in your head....and I've only had one meeting!

Is he living with his partner and is it rented/hers/bought? If his partner stops work will she get maternity pay? Is he paying proper maintenance for DS2? No he does not have to contribute to DS1 over 18 and in employment but there is a case for DS2 if he goes to uni. This, as I have said, is down to reasonable needs and how much income you both have.

There should be a certain amount of pressure to get things sorted from his partner which is a good thing. But then it is up to you, with the help of the mediator to know your rights.

Re counselling - why is NHS useless? What is the alternative?
Are you eligible for Child Tax Credits as well as Child Benefit, and even an NHS Exemption Certificate? There are calculators online.

Go to CAB by all means - get as much help as possible.

I found the mediator put it all in perspective - your income is this, his income is that, you need this to rehouse, he needs that, you need this to live on, he needs that. That's basically what it comes down to

I have tax credits but they end in April as they are income based and this year I will have earned a wee bit too much. Not eligible for anything else right now.

NHS will pay for tooth to be removed, I grind at night and have cracked it. Dentist advises root canal and a mouth guard. Total cost probably just shy of a thousand.

The NHS counsellor I had, and could have another six sessions with, well let's just say he was not great. Although hopefully he will retire soon!!! Think my GP would be relieved! There is a psychologist at the Pain clinic I go to who was lovely and does private counselling. I would like to see her.

Mediation has to be tried. Part of the issue is I think that husband has not paid for proper legal advice so he thinks having read a bit he knows best. The other issue is that I don't think our income will stretch to two homes. His girlfriend will be renting with him. She works some way away although round here is home to her. She is giving up her job so she can be here, he wants to return here to see his children...that will be the official line anyway. She has been a high earner, as was he. Surprisingly his income has dropped by 75% in past four months, coinciding with finding he was having a baby and moving to be with pregnant girlfriend.

Obviously I hope his income will increase again but even at previous levels two homes is going to be a stretch. We downsized two months before he decided, or should I say told me, he was off. No room to downsize further and minimal equity as other debts were paid off in the move. Pensions have some value but not great.

Oh loads more to tell, but think that is the important bits in terms of Finances.

I think the technical term is that I am stuffed. More to the point my boys are stuffed too.

Shame about the NHS counsellor - luck of the draw on who you get I guess.

Cannot all your dental be done on the NHS? I have reduced all my costs down the bare minimum and apparently am eligible for free NHS/glasses etc (still waiting for it to arrive though and have been waiting 3 months so am now chasing it up) I don't overly burden the NHS anyway but renewing my glasses at free/reduced cost will be useful.

Hopefully when you try mediation H will soon be put right on any issues he thinks he knows best. It is entirely voluntary but when you sign to say you agree to it you are expected to contribute fully - and that means producing any finance details needed. We have to produce HMRC details from last 3 years and most other stuff from the past year so all needs updating from the original disclosure given to solicitors.

Slightly worrying that his income has gone down by 75% recently Is he self employed? If so then difficult. If not he will have to produce P60s and payslips. Presumably he has a pension? You will also be asked about both your mortgage capabilities. A lot of suggestions are made on how the court might view things...if they were both high earners, it would be expected that they could be so again, whatever their excuses.

Does he see your DC? If he doesn't then his excuse for moving closer and his GF having to give up her job, baby notwithstanding, would not hold up.

Probably not being very helpful. We actually sold our house and are both in rentals (me small, him luxury due to our respective incomes) so at least I don't have the problem of bill paying in a big house.

He has seen them once a week for supper since moving away. Very consistent so that is good

I too have been cost cutting, renting would be slightly cheaper than living here but mainly as I would get rid of other debts. There is not a huge difference and we would like to stay here if we can at least until A levels are completed.

He moved out nearly two years ago and I still miss him. I still lack confidence in being able to do stuff. How long did it take until your heart stopped physically hurting? He has changed so very much so I do know that the person I miss is not the person he is now. I have got that far in my brain at least!

I will try and sort out money for mediation. That is the next step, and the right one. Thanks. Talking has been a bit reassuring.

How long did it take until your heart stopped physically hurting?
My heart stopped hurting years and years ago when I realised what he was really like - but it was a very slow realisation over years. We are actually getting divorced on the basis of 2 year separation even though we were still living in the same house and were pretty well separated before that.

Luckily I have no strong residual feelings for my stbx due to his treatment of myself and my DDs. I have however gone through a year of feeling anxious, panic attacks, breathing a sigh of relief when I make it back home safely every time I take DD to school etc. I have not sought medical help as I realise what is going on in my brain and as time goes on it is sorting itself out. I talk it through, go for walks etc. Luckily I was quite independent before I got married (even if it was a long time ago!)

I hope you get sorted. It's a shame there are not more people on this thread and there is not a lot of info on here in general from other posters re their experiences. There are a couple of posters (WellWhoKnew & KarenThe Toadslayer) who have posted re their experiences - court etc which have been informative and entertaining and good examples of women who come out the other end much stronger

Update...surprise surprise he has cancelled the next mediation session as in over 2 months he has not been able to get the required paperwork together...a mixture of showing his control and sheer laziness methinks.

Oh no! I really need my own stuff to be concluded so I can imagine how you feel. What twunts they are. Do you know when it will be now? Let me guess, he wants it sorted but does not want to have to put any effort in!

I think I am going to be brave and start a thread. It seems legally that as his girlfriend unexpectedly (ha ha) got pregnant I might not be able to love with my own children as long as they want to live with me. It is so bloody unfair. This is just awful. I am failing to keep going at work, very weepy and just exhausted, so have to do something. Also having building work and redec done following flood so need to know if I will still be living here with my boys in a few months time or not.

I will be totally outed by all this. I just hope anyone who recognises me is a friend. I am worried that the about to be a mum girlfriend is on here. My ex would know I read and post.

They had an affair six years ago and much of the story is on here from the past. In many ways I have been in limbo since. I have to move on.

Do you still feel entangled in it all? I have been so blooming slow to catch up! I have even defended him to my solicitor when she said he was a bully! Hard habits to break after all my adult life spent thinking he was my other half (yuck but I can't think how else to phrase it).

Haha are you married to my stbx too? I think God created a certain mould for this type of twat human being! Yes we have another date in a couple of weeks....we'll see!

Yes I wonder if I might get outed too as I tend to overshare sometimes (if I do I ask MN to delete it!!!) and I wouldn't put it past stbx to trawl through threads!

No I don't feel entangled as such. We are 2 entities living on different planets as far as I am concerned. however he will do his best to exert control right to the end, then blame anyone and everyone for how much it's cost him (at the moment it's his solicitor's fault for charging extortionate bills and not acting/acting differently as per his wishes).

Yes it is a form of limbo. I feel everything is on hold atm. However I tell myself that one day it will be over...one day!!!

Fingers crossed it is soon. We are nearly a year from decree nisi and no further forward, in fact I am about 5K lighter due to Solicitor fees doing Form Es etc. I feel as though my Solicitor has given up now.

I have started a thread in divorce and sep. I hope someone pops in there to post a bright idea!

I have found out I can get legal aid for Mediation although not the Legal stuff. Trouble is the mediator my Lawyer suggested does not do publicly funded legal aid. Now what to do...

How did you choose your mediator? Male or female? Does that make a difference?

I'll check your thread out and bump it/put inane (nearly typed insane ) comments on it to try to keep it going. trouble is with this sot of stuff is that you can get reams of replies or nothing

Re Mediator, my solicitor recommended her and I checked her out. She seems to be the best in her field in this area. I had read threads on here with some horror stories and I think it's best if you make sure you get a good one. Great that you can get legal aid. If you solicitor cannot suggest one that does that then do a search online for those in your area and vet them thoroughly! don't know if male/female makes a difference. We were told that average total costs for a mediator is £1000 approx - think we're on about £500 after just one meeting!

Since starting Mediation I have not incurred any legal bills from my solicitor. I got all the updated paperwork together myself, and do not think I will need to speak to my solicitor till I get a good idea of stbx's proposals. If you have been fighting this a while you should have a good idea of your rights/what is reasonable.

I think that your solicitor has not necessarily "given up", rather realised that no settlement will be reached through the currents process, which is why Mediation is the next option.

Insane comments would probably be entirely appropriate!

Yes, it become clear that stbx was not going to respond positively to letters, hence mediation. Mind you my Lawyer does sound a bit fed up with him. She thinks he is a bully and threatening - maybe. I have asked her if she has any alternative recommendations.

My gut is saying just go with the woman she recommended, she sounded nice on the phone.

Have you checked her out - extensive experience etc? As well as sounding nice she has to be firm and not take any stick

I think I also need someone authoritative so he actually listens to them. Maybe I should find someone else. Not sure. Have stinking cold and off work atmosphere but trying to make my head work to do some very outstanding marking. I am feeling a bit scared about the future though.

Yes it's scary when everything seems to disappear from under you. I should check out mediators who do legal aid in you area and have a good look at their profiles. If none of them look as good as the one your sol suggested then go with that mediator.

At least your other thread is getting some replies...probably not what you want to hear though. Unfortunately there's no quick fix and whichever way go go it will take a while - Timeframe is up to a month before 1st individual appointment (request your appointment just after his just in case he messes about), then approx one month between appts (not allowing for cancellations made by he who simply can't be bothered/is just being a twat!)

Thanks. And thanks for pouring oil on potentially troubled waters.

I was surprised that so many people would consider an 18 year old as reasonably managing without home or bank of mum and/or dad! Food for thought.

Not surprised that overwhelming view was that I should not expect or require spousal though. I would love to tell him to stuff it but I can't.

Morning - you're up early!!! I don't think it was an overwhelming view on spousal - just one or two. I know someone who is working who gets spousal, I also know a guy who gets spousal as his X has a good job and he is unemployed (don't know for how long though). Where there are little assets spousal is normally given for a couple of years to let the one supported to "get back on their feet".

I think there has to be cut-off somewhere. However a mediator/court would take all things into consideration such as disability, illness, state of mind etc of DC

How are you doing Bobs?

Have first mediation - just me not STBX on Thursday.

Hi Fuckit so you have your first individual session this Thursday? It's normally a set price so make sure you ask all the questions you can think of and voice the problems you think you will face. It can be very tricky reading between the lines with someone who can't give advice. In my meetings (had 2 joint so far since my first meeting beginning December) I sort of voice it - how would the courts look at this and how would they take that into account.

Seen some of your posts on other threads. I've been posting a lot on the Hobbit's Bar thread (part 3!). Also watching Wellwhoknew and MrsC who are coming to the end of court