Boundary fence in our garden

[Ratbagcatbag]

Hi all

Just after some quick advice please?

The neighbours at the back of us have a lower garden than us and a small wall up to our garden (which is higher). We moved in 11 years ago and they moved in 7-8 years ago.

The wall used to be higher (prior to me moving in) but it was bought level with our garden and then a fence put up, however it was put into our garden as they have a patio area and nowhere to put a fence.

The issue is that it makes it tight for us to access the back of our garage.
The fence is still holding up but getting weak in places and may need replacing soon, (next couple of years). We've decided that if they take it down they can't put a new one back up in our garden, however reading information it seems anything past 12 years can in fact transfer to them so we can't possibly stop them if we raise something at the time.

Can anyone advise if this is the case and what I should do? Should I just make them aware now that we won't allow it back in our boundary or take it down (which seems extreme, but not if it means we will never get our part back). The fence is a good foot into our garden.

I've tried to show what I mean below.

..................f
..................f
.............yf_
.............y
__y

The bottom line is their garden, the y is their wall, the top line is our garden and the f is the fence. (ignore ........'s it's the only way to make it stay in the right places)

Can anyone please advise?

They can attach the fence on the inside of their wall?

You probably need to talk to them... Just raise it calmly, ask them what their plans are for the fence and explain the difficulty you're having... Take it from there.

If it's built on your land it's your fence and you can do what you want with it. Be careful though to make sure that it is on your land. Look at the land registry title plan, and the original deeds (the LR plan is a guide only). Also check the neighbours deeds at the land registry.
Do the deeds mention if either of you is responsible for maintaining the boundary wall?

If it's in your garden i would explain to the neighbours that you are going to take it down a) because it's in your garden and shouldn't have been put up in the first place and b) because it's impeding access.

And leave it at that. Just be firm and polite. Don't enter into any discussions and don't mention anything about 12 year rules (not sure that's legally enforceable anyway..)

Deeds won't show sufficient detail.

I haven't seen the deeds or the land registry title plan. How would I get my hands on them? Can I also request their deeds to see if they have a boundary outlined. I'm thinking it might be best to get these before I tackle anything.

Sorry it's just something we've always assumed that when they remove it we wouldn't allow it to go back up, but by not doing anything we potentially give them a bit of our garden is the part which is worrying me.

We're fine the current fence staying up, DH just has to squeeze through the gap abit, I just don't want long term issues by not dealing with it now.

Apologies I also wanted to say thank you as well for the responses I have already.

How thick is their wall? maybe they could build up the fence on top of the wall

If by the 12 year thing you mean adverse possession (squatters rights) then it only qualifies if it was without your permission, so the fact you knew that extra foot was your garden and allowed the fence to be there might mean they can't claim it I think

Just tell them you're taking your fence down and see what happens. Do check the boundaries first though.

Have you discussed with your neighbours that they also think the fence is theirs?

The title plan I soften useful as it can show that a boundary continues in, say, a straight line from the back of next door.

My plan is this weekend to pop round and just ask/ confirm the fence is ours as its in our boundary line. We're doing the garden gradually so it's not unusual for us to be considering the cost of replacing the panels.
If they say its theirs (which I suspect they will) I will then do all confused face with well why's it in our boundary then etc and see where it goes.

All of the lines for the rest of their garden make sense until it steps up into ours.

I wouldn't "ask/confirm" anything.
I would take the attitude that the boundary is the wall - as it always has been.
When you have solid plans for replacing your fence it would be polite of you to inform them of your plans.

Oh, and to be safe, go ahead and replace the fence (closer to the boundary wall) before the 12 years since they moved in is up if you can.

As Fester say. Don't ask. It's really really impt to be clear and firm from the very beginning. If you ask, you are showing doubt.

Just to add to the mix I would recommend checking our online guidance re boundaries as well just to understand what issues can arise and how often it can come down to mutual agreement with the neighbours in resolving such issues.
The guidance also explains how the title plan will show the general boundaries and extent only and is not designed t show the exact legal boundary.
www.landregistry.gov.uk/public/boundaries

Your approach re discussing and agreeing a way forward but as others have suggested the plans (old deeds or not) will only tell you part of the story and are very unlikely, in my experience, to help with regards whether a fence is one foot out in either direction.

The age of the physical features, namely the wall/fence, will I am sure be relevant to any discussions. Adverse possession may come into play depending on timescales although I suspect the main focus is likely to be on whether the original reasons for lowering the wall and putting up the fence remain true/necessary. If they do then hopefully you can both agree on a way forward.

If you do and you wish to formalise any agreement then the guidance refsr to how this can be done although fixing the boundary is very rarely applied for.