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Original poster

question regarding seat belts.

31 replies

IneedAgoldenNickname · 13/01/2013 12:47

Hi I hope some one can help me here regarding the law on seatbelts.

Last week my ex picked the boys (aged 6 and 8, both under 135cms) up in his work vehicle, a landrover of some description, which has a bench seat across the front fitting 3, and no rear seats. I wasn't happy that he didn't bring their car seats, and have since read that they are not allowed to travel in the front seat without them?

The boys then told me that there is only one seat belt, so one of them (the 6 year old) wasn't strapped in. I have refused to allow him to pick them up in it this week as I believe it is illegal.

He says that due to the age of the vehicle (96-97) the seat belt law does not apply, but google tells me that the law regarding front seats came in in the early 80s.

Does anyone who is correct? I'm prepared to hold my hands up and apologise if I'm wrong, however much I hate doing that.

OP posts:
ilovepowerhoop · 13/01/2013 13:26

it is illegal for children (under 1.35 metres, or under the age of 12 to 13 years) to travel in the front of any vehicle without the correct child restraint and without seat belts - he is talking mince!

www.childcarseats.org.uk/law/index.htm

ilovepowerhoop · 13/01/2013 13:28

ring the non emergency police number (101) and ask them whether they think its safe for your small children to travel unrestrained in the front of a van - you will have your answer then!!

colleysmill · 13/01/2013 13:43

We have 2 old vehicles - one with no seat belts at all and one with belts in the front.

When I looked into it (google the Government website as its really clear on there and it talks through all scenarios) children can travel unrestrained over the age of 3 but only in the back of a vehicle.

ilovepowerhoop · 13/01/2013 13:44

www.bbc.co.uk/health/physical_health/child_development/safety_seatbelt.shtml - another link that says In the front seat, an appropriate child restraint is compulsory. If there aren't any seat belts fitted, your child cannot travel in a front seat, with or without restraint

Original poster
IneedAgoldenNickname · 13/01/2013 13:45

Thanks ladies (men?) You have convened what I thought.

Ilove I walked up to our local community police office, they agreed with me and looked horrified that anyone would take a child in the front in those circumstances!

OP posts:
colleysmill · 13/01/2013 13:54

Tbh it feels really strange not to have a seatbelt on in the front and I say that as an adult.

Original poster
IneedAgoldenNickname · 13/01/2013 14:00

Just realised my typo, should said confirmed, not convened!

I know colley I can't NOT strap myself in, it doesn't feel right!

OP posts:
tribpot · 13/01/2013 14:05

Even if the age of the vehicle made it legal (which it doesn't), how would that make the risk acceptable for his own children?

Original poster
IneedAgoldenNickname · 13/01/2013 14:08

I don't know tri I can't get head around that, all he said was that he'd only be going 30mph, so it's like he'd be on the motorway Confused still dangerous!

OP posts:
cumfy · 13/01/2013 14:14

Does he always wear a seat belt ?

Original poster
IneedAgoldenNickname · 13/01/2013 14:16

He always did when we were together, but then I've rarely been in a car with him as a passenger, and there is always a drivers belt. He says it's only ok because there isn't one there.

OP posts:
Original poster
IneedAgoldenNickname · 13/01/2013 14:17

He also sent me a link for a classic and vintage vehicle site, that says a front middle seat doesn't have to have a seatbelt. But it doesn't say that makes it legal for a child to sit there Confused

OP posts:
ilovepowerhoop · 13/01/2013 14:22

Its not illegal for the car not to have a seat belt but it is illegal for a child to sit there unrestrained.

colleysmill · 13/01/2013 14:23

He's still wrong though - the directgov website says children only in the front with a car seat. And the classic car rules only apply if no seat belts were originally fitted and still they can only sit in the back.

Original poster
IneedAgoldenNickname · 13/01/2013 14:28

Thanks again :) I was worried I'd misunderstood the websites, but it would appear not.

OP posts:
sarahtigh · 13/01/2013 14:30

most vans have 3 x 3 point seat belts so would be possible to put 2 car seats in, occasionally middle is a lap belt DH last van was 1998 model and it had 3 point seat belts

vintage cars do not need seat belts

there is a company that make small ones like backpacks which are perfectly legal and great for holidays taxis etc maybe made by TRUNKI the one that did the suitcases with wjheels that double up as seats ( they were on one of THE APPRENTICe programmes

clam · 13/01/2013 14:34

Although, actually, does it matter what certain websites say? The bottom line is, if he brakes suddenly, your unrestrained child could well go headfirst through his windscreen. What's to debate?

BertieBotts · 13/01/2013 14:49

If you can stomach it, look up some crash tests on youtube of unrestrained children and show him. I've just found one at 30mph and it's horrifying.

If he usually has another car, surely it's simple enough for him to just use that one? I know it must be a pain if he's travelling straight from work or whatever but it wouldn't take that long to go home and swap cars.

It is legal for a child to travel unrestrained in the back IF and only if there are NO seatbelts fitted in the back. And yes you're right that the seat belt laws came in in the 80s so any car manufactured after then for use in this country would have had to have had seatbelts fitted in all seats.

colleysmill · 13/01/2013 14:49

We were given incorrect info by our classic car club so they aren't necessarily always right.

Even with a car seat in the front of a vehicle isn't always risk free - not long after we bought our campervan we were out for the day and ds (3) was in the front in a car seat and he decided to reach forward and managed to open the passenger door as I was driving along (fortunately down a quiet country road with nothing around). The carseat sat him in a position where he could get at the handle and we simply hadn't realised. We always lock the door now to stop that little trick.

BertieBotts · 13/01/2013 14:52

Although to be fair after watching the video I've just seen about unrestrained children in the back in a 30MPH crash there's no way I'd be happy about that either even if it is legal Shock

Original poster
IneedAgoldenNickname · 13/01/2013 15:01

Sarah he has car seats for them, but they are in a different vehicle. The problem is the lack of seatbelts.

Bertie the other vehicle he had is his gfs, and apparently she was out in it (although according to Facebook they were having snuggles around the time he told me that) he also had a car of his own, but it's off the road as he can't afford the mot.

OP posts:
Original poster
IneedAgoldenNickname · 13/01/2013 15:02

I've seen videos before, and agree I wouldn't be happy for then to be in the back either

OP posts:
zipzap · 13/01/2013 16:08

If he's going to use websites to justify his approach then send him the official government one quoted below - he can't argue with that. And the youtube footage of course!

If he tries to turn up again with the same car then I'd call the police up to stop him - or follow and arrest him if he drives off regardless.

Original poster
IneedAgoldenNickname · 13/01/2013 16:15

It didn't go as far as him turning up, I questioned how he'd foot the bikes in the car when he asked me to send them.

He's now been slating me on Facebook, but interestingly only his gfs sister had agreed with him, and also put that a shit storm is coming, I'm worried he's Hong to take me to court now for access/residency :(

OP posts:
nocake · 13/01/2013 16:18

The law is very clear. If your vehicle was not built with seatbelts children over 3 may only travel in the back. Children under 3 are not permitted to travel in it at all.

This also applies to seats that don't have a seatbelt.

The law also says that children under 135cm must travel in an appropriate child seat. Don't let him take them in that vehicle again and call the police if he attempts to.