Residency Hearing Barrister Fees

[Isabel1974]

My husband is taking me to court for the primary Residency of my 2 children because I am daring to move away 80 miles (for work and to be near family).

My lawyer has said it is ideal to get a Barrister £3k +VAT, and seeking advice from friends, they say that obviously for something so important (the residency of my two boys), to take no risks even though I am very unlikely to 'lose'.

Does anyone know of any charities that lend such money, otherwise I will have to represent myself as I am not entitled to legal aid. Or have any other fantastic ideas, before I explode in a stressed out heap?!

Hi Isabel - you say you are not entitled to legal aid. Does this mean that you are paying a lawyer. I can't understand why a lawyer would be advising a barrister for this matter in the family court. This matter will be investigated by a CAFCASS (Children & Family Court Advisory Service) social worker, who will make a recommendation to the judge. I am assuming your ex is concerned about contact now that you are living further away. What age are the children and what are the contact arrangements at present. I can see why your ex might be upset at the move, but I don't think the remedy is for him to apply for a Residence Order, as this would mean the children would be 80 miles from you!

If the children have always lived with you, then I think it highly unlikely that there will be a Residence Order will be made in favour of your ex. Are the children old enough for their wishes and feelings to be taken into account, as this is an important factor.

Prior to any court hearing, parents in your situation are encouraged to have mediation sessions (can be arranged by CAFCASS worker) and this might be the way forward. Might you be able to come to some agreement about contact e.g. meeting half way, contact less frequently but for longer periods.

Ideally the way forward would be for you and your Ex to come to some compromise/arrangements between yourselves, as once you get into the Family Court arena, things can drag on for ages and worse still the children know that they are being "fought" over and this can cause untold emotional distress.

each hearing cost me £360 plus VAT in london for barrister - so 3k may be if you add up lots of hearings.

ask price for the first hearing and take it stage by stage .

if you only need one hearing it wont be 3k.

asl solicitor how can you redice his/her costs eg in preparing statements etc .

barristers are good on points of law.

depends what the issues/arguments are

for the sake of argument, why should your DC NOT live with him and for you to be the visiting parent with alternative weeknds and half the holidays? depends on their ages, schools etc - if he can put a good case for them remaining where they are and residing with him but shared residence with you for alternate wekends and half the holidays - well, why not?

I had a solicitor with me for 2 hearings and a barrister booked for the final hearing (this was residency). I paid £1500 in total, but would have paid £2500 if we had got to final hearing.

Thanks for your comments:

NanaNina, I am paying a lawyer yes, the judge (in the first hearing), declared that a CAFCASS report was not necessary as I had been the primary carer for 3.5 years and no issues had been raised before. My ex, lodged a prohibited steps order (PSO) and a sole residency order at the same time. As the PSO was an emergency it was held teh following week, and the judge enforced it because he said that sole residency could not be heard over a 30 minute hearing, and that a full day lon hearing was needed. Mediation has all been done, he cannot bear to lose control over me & the boys (5 and 6).

Cestlavielife, yep have thought of that, but he works full time I work part-time and I have been their primary carer for 3.5 years. They are also only 5 and 6, so no I dont think that is an option, and yes admittedly I do not want that to be an option. Also he has a history of depression, so not good really. It is a day long hearing and outside of London, so I think that is the problem regarding price.

So I still revert back to my original question, does anyone know any charities or like organisations that lend money in such situations. I cant get Legal Aid because my finances are too complex, but I am not wealthy by any stretch of the imagination and cannot afford these fees (my ex on the other hand can)

Have you thought about using a McKenzie friend Isabel? I have self rep'd at 10 hearings with my McKenzie friend and one of those was a final hearing. It is about what is in the best interests of your children and not how much you spend on legal fee's. Judges and magistrates do not think any less of you for not spending money you don't have on legal fee's.
There are some really useful info on organisations that can help.

www.childrenslegalcentre.com/
www.familycourtsupport.co.uk/
www.barprobono.org.uk/

It's really not that hard to do, you just have to keep your cool and always put your children first and leave your own feelings out of it. Hope this might help a little

i dont think any charity is going to lend you money for this or pay for this for you. and why should they?

charities have to meet specific terms eg i was able to apply for voice communication equipment for my disabled child had to fill invarious forms confirming his disability etc etc. at this point - you cannot say to a chairyt "i am right and he is wrong" as that is for a court to decide.... unless you have some very unusual clear cut circumstances in which there is evidently some injustice going on... where some barrister might work pro bono for you...buit on face of it looks a very routine case?

why not ask your regular bank for a loan?

also you could ask friends /family. (i did and they helped)

depression - in what way has it manifested? what specific child welfare isues have been recorded? depression alone is not reason to restrict contact - many parents with depression cope fine; - but of course depends how it manifests eg my exP's "depression" mixed with anxiety, letters from Gp saying he unable to function and manage his affairs (let alone look after dc), his behaviour witnessed by others including social workers, etcetc.

can your ex arange and pay for the after school child care?
how is he proposing it will work?
what holes can you pick in his proposal "in the best interest of the children"?
what family support does he have eg to take care of dc when they sick?
what child care arrangements would be in place when he working?

working full time is not per se in itself contrary to having sole residency - after all i work virutally full time and have sole residency (but then my ex has severe MH issues, see above)

you could rep yourself (and take a mckenzie friend for support - try diff organizations for mackenzie friend) ) but talk to as many people before hand adn get legal advice paid for or free so you have every avenue covered to repsent our case as to why it is in DC best interests to move away from the local area, change school, leave dad behind going from (presumably) regular contact to less contact and live with you and only have alternate weekend contact with your exP - what contact would you offer how would it work who would do and pay for the travel etc etc.

if you going to mention his depression you need hard evidence eg psych or GP reports and evidence of how it is negative affect on the Dc and a concern.

Oh Cestlavie. You are the reason I never normally do things like this. You know nothing about my situation. I am not a yummy 4x4 mummy wanting extra spondoolies. I merely asked a simple question whether anyone knew of any charities...and surely it is up to the charity to decide.

Also I am not stupid, I know I can ask family & banks, again that was not the question I asked.

I did however say about my husbands depression, but I dont want to go into detial on a public website. I asked one question. Thank you for taking me to the cleaners publically. If i were you i would think next time thst you might be hurting someones already fragile feelings.

Cestlavies has given you some excellent advice, but I am in agreement with her that I doubt very much charities would give you money when they are struggling to attract donations.

Isabel to me it reads as if Cestlavie is not challenging your situation but highlighting the areas that you need to consider addressing as these may well be the arguments the children's father will present, so please try not to get too upset.

Re: a charity, no I am not aware of one. Speak with your lawyer re: pro Bono work perhaps.

Good luck

And having done a quick google, there are lawyesr out there who do pro bono work for charities but not for individuals.

I'm not aware of any charities that offer this.

Your solicitor should be perfectly able and willing to represent you in Court and would more than likely be cheaper than a barrister. If they're not willing to do this I'd be asking myself why not?

If you really can't afford to pay for legal reoresentation at the hearing a Mackenzie friend is quite a good way to go, or do it yourself. There are so many more litigants in person these days and the judges don't penalise them at all. It depends whether you can detach enough to not be a gibbering wreck in Court, provided you can do that you'll be fine.

Good luck with whatever you decide to do!

of course you dont have to answer any details on here - i merely put forward (devils advocate if you like) the questions you need answered clearly by you or your barrister/solicitor - you know what the answers are. i have no need to know them. if CFCASS get involved they will also want to know all the details.

but having been thru court process with an exP with severe MH issues it became clear to me that "depression" alone is not considered any hindrance to residency - however, examples of recorded behaviours (which may be linked to MH) may be taken into consideration - these would be clear welfare issues recorded eg by SS; agression/violence recorded by police or others etc.

i also have some experiencee of applying to charities for funding and have seen that it is fine to ask for money for a specific item equipment etc - but not just for money generally....

or maybe if you can show a clear injustice you could get pro bono work - but perhaps you would need something stronger than what looks like a routine residency argument - but you and you you alone know the issues and whether a charity or pro bono layer (google pro bono lawyers locally or ask CAB) might be willing to take your case on.

my exP had a clear need for legal representation (due to his MH issues) and at one hearing judge commented on this saying he clearly needed help...but was unable to get pro bono/charity involved - however at one point an old family friend a barrister attended with him free of charge as mckenzie friend - this was very helpful .