Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Legal matters

Mumsnet has not checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. If you have any legal concerns we suggest you consult a solicitor.

Original poster

Speeding ticket question - help!

28 replies

Catsitter · 04/11/2010 19:29

I have just opened a letter to say I have a final notice of Notice to Prosecute due to a speeding ticket (36 in a 30 zone which is a dual carriageway so I wrongly thought the limit was 40 and I was actually under the speed limit Confused.

I haven't seen the other letters and am happy (as such!) to pay & have done, the question is, when I ring them tomorrow can I just pay the speeding ticket? Or will they progress anyway? I haven't had a speeding ticket before in 18 years of driving, it's my first one, so I don't know what to expect, do I still have to fill the forms out etc? TIA!

OP posts:
Ponders · 04/11/2010 19:33

Is it called Notice of Intended Prosecution?

Original poster
Catsitter · 04/11/2010 19:42

Yes [worried emoticon] my nerves are shredded, please give me any bad news gently...

OP posts:
LucindaCarlisle · 04/11/2010 19:43

Does the letter say that you will get 3 penalty points endorsed on your licence?

Original poster
Catsitter · 04/11/2010 19:48

It says failure to complete the enclosed form within 7 days could result in a £1000K fine and 6 penalty points. I presume from that it's currently at 3 points unless I don't do the form. But I'm ringing them 1st thing tomorrow and paying anyway?

OP posts:
Original poster
Catsitter · 04/11/2010 19:48

£1000 fine not £1000K!

OP posts:
LucindaCarlisle · 04/11/2010 19:50

are you sure that you can pay over the phone?

You need to deliver the form by hand in my opinion.

Original poster
Catsitter · 04/11/2010 19:56

Well, I will still return the form but does anyone know (for definite please) if I can pay it and stop the intended prosecution as such? I will find out tomorrow as I am ringing them but just really worried tonight and would rather not spend all night worrying over what was originally an unremarkable speeding ticket!

OP posts:
Original poster
Catsitter · 04/11/2010 19:57

The form says return to this office, then it gives a postal address and a fax number so presumably I can fax it (will check though) rather than deliver it by hand. It doesn't mention sending in driving licence yet.

OP posts:
LucindaCarlisle · 04/11/2010 19:58

IIRC the form will ask you who was driving the car at that time and on that date.

When you pay the fine, they ask you to send in both parts of your Driving Licence for it to be endorsed with the penalty points. That is why I do not think that you can pay over the phone.

Original poster
Catsitter · 04/11/2010 20:08

Thanks. But does a normal speeding ticket call itself a Notice of Intended Prosecution? I don't know what it looks like because I've never had one before and also, I never got the orignal! I think it's because it's a company car so not registered to my home address, so the original must have gone to my company for them to give my home address? I am worried that NIP is more serious than an ordinary speeding ticket! {wails}

OP posts:
prh47bridge · 04/11/2010 20:13

You must have been caught on a speed camera, in which case the NIP is the first documentation the police send out. That is the normal process. Unless this is a reminder, there haven't been any other letters. You haven't missed anything.

The purpose of the NIP is to determine who was driving the car at the time of the offence. It does NOT necessarily mean that they will prosecute but it keeps their options open.

When you return the form the police will move on to the next stage. For the speed you report that is likely to be a conditional offer, allowing you to stop the prosecution by paying a fine (£60 I think) and having 3 points on your license. They may also give you the option of attending a speed awareness course which will cost you more than the fine but will not put any points on your license. They have the option of prosecuting but that is usually reserved for people who are breaking the speed limit by a long way.

prh47bridge · 04/11/2010 20:16

And yes, your employer as the registered keeper of the car will have received an NIP first and will have told the police that you were driving. An NIP is NOT more serious than an ordinary speeding ticket. It is the normal process when you are caught by a speed camera as opposed to being pulled over by the police.

Funkychunkymunky · 04/11/2010 20:18

Everything prh47bridge said was what I was going to say Grin

Don't worry about it. It's a simple speeding ticket. It happens.

BCBG · 04/11/2010 20:45

Catsitter: NIP is NOT more serious thatn the original ticket! That went to your employer as registered keeper, hence the delay. If you complete the form you will be issued with a £60 fine and your licence endorsed with 3 points and returned to you. ONLY is you failed to respond would the prosecution process start, and you would be summonsed to court to plead guilty or not guilty. Even at that stage you can plead guilty by letter and enclose a means (statement of income) form, in which case the court would fine you and issue points. The likelihood in that scenario, however, is that you would also be charged the costs of the prosecution and a victim surcharge as well, so it is in your interest to complete the form you have just received and send it back as quickly as possible. Please don't worry though, it happens all the time.

Original poster
Catsitter · 04/11/2010 20:45

Thanks so mych prh47bridge & funkychunkymunky Smile. I was caught on camera (didn't see it flash mind but obviously it did catch me!).

Would you mind if I pick your brains some more (if you know?) The speeding offence happened early September. I have a reminder letter and an original NIP letter. I only opened what turned out to be the reminder today and it was dated 1st Nov with 7 days to respond, so that's ok. I then (in a panic) searched through all my post and found (you guessed it) the original which was dated early Oct which was a month after the offence.

My query is, as it is a company car, they are presumably the registered keeper to whom the original NIP would/should have been served to within 14 days of the offence. Yet apart from my company not saying anything to me at all, I have obviously got my own NIP dated early October which is obviously outside the 14 day period.

In the case of company cars, do/would the police issue two NIP's? (ie one to my company and then one directly to me after that?) I have read somewhere that that's not the case. I presume if the original NIP within 14 days had gone to my company, they would have provided my details to the police (and at least told me). Would I then get my own NIP issued seperately?

Many thanks in advance. I am somewhat relived that at least a NIP is just an ordinary speeding ticket as opposed to heavy legal situation involving wigs and a jury Grin

OP posts:
Original poster
Catsitter · 04/11/2010 20:49

Crossed post BCBG! Thanks so much for your response. But if my NIP is dated early Oct when the offence was well over a month earlier in September, they have not issued within the necessary 14 day period have they? Can they issue two, one to my company within 14 days, one to me over a month afterwards? I thought not (only from rubbish Googling though Smile)

OP posts:
Ponders · 04/11/2010 20:52

Oh, have missed a bit - glad it is only a further NIP!

They only have to get the original NIP out to the registered keeper within 14 days - no time limits after that (apart from you opening your mail Wink)

At 36mph you may be offered a speeding awareness course instead of points - it costs £60-90 as a rule but you don't get the points on your licence (DH just did one & he was clocked at 36 IIRC) but it depends where the offence happened, all authorities don't offer it

Ponders · 04/11/2010 20:55

forgot to say, DH got the NIP, filled it in to confirm he was driving, & was then sent the offer of the course

minipen · 04/11/2010 20:56

Looks like you need to know what date it was when issued to your employer, it will not let me copy & paste relevant bit...

www.nopenaltypoints.co.uk/does-nip-have-be-served-within-14-days.html

scurryfunge · 04/11/2010 20:57

Notice was given within the 14 day period- your company has provided details about the driver outside the notice but it doesn't negate any prosecution to the actual driver.

Your company should have notified you earlier. It is not a major thing...3 points and a fine of £60.If you contest it ,as my husband did because he didn't produce a licence suitable for endorsement in time (unreadable because it went through the washing machine)....he was ultimately fined £400.

I would accept it and slow down.

LucindaCarlisle · 04/11/2010 20:58

The "registered Keeper" of the vehicle is NOT neccessarily the owner of the vehicle.

prh47bridge · 04/11/2010 20:58

The original NIP goes to the registered keeper of the car, which in this case is your employer. That has to be issued within 14 days of the offence, but what matters is when they sent it, NOT when the registered keeper receives it (if, indeed, it ever arrives - things do get lost in the post sometimes).

The registered keeper is asked to admit they were the driver or identify the actual driver or identify someone who should be able to identify the driver. In this case, as it is your company car your employer has identified you. It might have been nice if they had told you about this but they are not required to do so. The police then issue a new NIP to you. If you say you weren't the driver but identify someone else as the actual driver, the police will issue a new NIP to that person. Basically, they will go on issuing NIPs until someone owns up to being the driver or it becomes obvious that someone is playing games with them.

So the short answer to your question is that yes, for a company car where the regular driver is not the registered keeper there would usually be at least two NIPs. The same is true of hire cars - the first NIP would go to the hire company, the second to the hirer.

prh47bridge · 04/11/2010 21:02

And to state what should be obvious, the only requirement is that the first NIP is issued within 14 days of the offence. The 14 day period ONLY applies to the NIP issued to the registered keeper. Getting to the actual driver may take several months, especially if there are multiple NIPs. They have 6 months from the date of the offence to prosecute.

Original poster
Catsitter · 04/11/2010 21:14

Thanks all. I have done further Googling and now realise there is a chain of NIP's. I don't think my employer knows because they use a lease company, so I think the lease company have provided my details without telling either myself or my employer (silver linings hey Wink).

The only thing to check is if the lease company received the original NIP within 14 days, but I would think it likely.

In which case I will fill the form in and send it back and see what they say. I have been in a mad panic about this since I have opened the letter (am pg as well so not exactly feeling my most rational right now!) and in future I will drive more carefully and open all my post properly. The trouble is I thought the original was junk mail as I get a lot, and it came in a shiny envelope (sigh) and I also wrongly thought all dual carriageways with a central reservation were automatically 40mph so I was actually driving carefully! but now I find they used to be 40mph but not any more and to assume 30 unless otherwise advised...

OP posts:
Original poster
Catsitter · 04/11/2010 21:26

Thanks again for all your advice prh47bridge, I appreciate it. What's worrying longer term is that obviously it's not a fast process getting NIPs when you drive a company/lease car, so I will be very nervous for a while in case any more come, because I am paranoid. At least it's had its real effect though, I do thoroughly intend to stick to the speed limit and (more importantly) assume 30 unless otherwise told so. It differs so much.

There's a single carriageway near me that is 50mph, a dual carriageway with a central reservation near me that's 40mph and this one (in a different town though) which is dual carriageway with central reservation but it 30mph Confused. The 50 clearly states what it is but the others don't! In the case of the 30 one, earlier on in the same road it states 40 yet it turns to 30 without telling you! Confused again! I know it must be legal but it's all very confusing....

OP posts: