How on Earth do British families manage?

[Dappy1212]

I have grown up in both Pakistani and British cultures and love and hate aspects of them both. It's great being bicultural because you have a real perspective and understanding of the society you live in and aren't afraid to questions how/why things are done.

I grew up as a child leaning more to cultural norms in a Pakistani society and then from the 18 onwards more towards British cultural norms (moving out of home, meeting new people, being career focused ect). I am now married with 2 kids, live 1.5 hrs from my family and 30 mins from DHs. We see our family 3 times a week and make every effort to since moving further away for our careers. They are as supportive as can be but of course there are limitations to supporting each other due to distance and work.

Recently I've been taking on more of my Pakistani culture. Cooking Pakistani foods because it's quick and healthy and abandoning the kids sleep schedule and letting them sleep anywhere. Pakistani culture is very family orientated. I always wanted a big family but can't see how it's possible for me to manage without living closer to in laws and maybe taking a break from my career.

My sister and cousins live in a more collectivist way compared to me, they have between 2-5 kids. They share the school runs, share food and have the kids over at each others giving everyone a break. This is how I grew up too. They are mostly professionals and worked part time initially but have recently taken a short career break. They will likely go back to work at some point.

I just can't imagine how stressful it must be for British families in the UK with more than 2 kids. I'm guessing this is why families are smaller. I think I'm going to go back to DHs community and live close by to in laws as I just can't see things working another way.

How do women juggle children, families, social life, housework, careers without the support of a collectivist society? It seems like an impossible task and a bit lonely at times. DH is great and gives more than he can in all aspects of my life but it's just too big a task for 2 people to manage.

My (Israeli) relatives live like this. I like the benefits of it - sharing the load, pitching in, not mentally totting up “favours” and wondering if I’m in debt to this friend or that. But when I am there I feel utterly suffocated - everyone’s got an opinion about why my child is crying, whether they are warmly enough dressed etc. Argh. Back I go to my gruelling work schedule, expensive nanny etc.

Honestly? I don’t manage it.

This is interesting for me as I'm white British but DH is Indian. I definitely see the cultural differences. There's much I admire about the Indian way of life - just how close families are, how involved they are, how much they help each other. I think there must be far fewer lonely people in these Indian/Asian communities. My MIL lives alone but she constantly receiving visitors, phone calls etc from cousins, siblings, nieces, nephews etc. I know this is a great comfort to her. I also admire the way elderly people are looked after in Indian/Asian communities.
On the other hand, I'm a reserved British introvert and have to say I struggle with such intense family involvement. I need my space! I need peace and quiet! I do wonder how Indian introverts cope with having so many people around them.
We only had 2 children with no family nearby. It would have been nice to have support in those early days but we coped just fine with nursery, after school club, flexible jobs that allowed us to work from home sometimes etc. Of course it would have been much harder if we'd had 4 or 5 children but we would have coped I'm sure. Luckily neither of us wanted more than 2!

I appreciate you enjoyed growing up in a large family that was fun and lovely for you, less so for your husband. Maybe three dc is a compromise for you both?

I guess your dreams and ambitions are more likely with less kids, as we have more time to study, reflect and achieve qualifications/advancement.

I think for me it was also about the amount of attention each child receives, help with homework, one to one time and managing. We are led to believe in this country we should also have sparkling social lives, beautiful houses and bodies and ME time. If you take away a lot of the conditions many of us grow up with - you do have the kind of simplicity you describe op.

And there is contentment in collective simplicity.

I grew up in a similar environment to you in the 70s here, white area and we had a huge amount of support, and we needed it. My mother was not terribly emotionally self sufficient, so it was safer...I miss it sometimes. The togetherness, the solidarity and the security, but I am not sure I would trade it for the ease of my current life. I would find it an intense experience now I think.

Move back perhaps and see how it feels after one child, but you sound very intelligent and so you would be wasted tethered to the kitchen sink in my view!

@jugglingalways ·

Snap.

One MORE child! :)

One of the ways I manage is not visiting family who live 1.5 hours away three times a week! That is a big commitment, time wise - three hours driving plus the time you spend there. Do you go after work or at the weekends?

In general, most of the parents I know who have two (or more) children and no family support are managing to juggle children, families, work etc, usually with one parent going part-time or being a SAHP for a few years, and acknowledging that in the early years life will be quite full-on and busy.

I have one child and don’t live near family. DH and I manage by splitting things equally, both having quite flexible yet fairly low-pressure jobs (ie: busy while at work but no 50 hour weeks or working in evenings/ weekends), accepting that we will need to pay for after-school/ holiday childcare, and lowering standards for housework. We split our time at the weekends between getting stuff done, family time, and each having time for ourselves.

If you are struggling to manage with two children, would you be able to manage with four, even with the support of family if you moved back? Would the other demands of being part of the extended family (such caring for elderly relatives, having your life under close scrutiny) balance out the benefits of shared childcare? Would your DH resent becoming the sole breadwinner if you quit your job for a few years, and would that affect the power balance in your relationship? It does sound like a very gendered lifestyle with the women being responsible for children, the household, elder care while the men work. I’d be very uncomfortable at that lack of independence.

I’ve seen several posts here over the years where a relationship was originally fairly equal, then after a few years as a SAHM the woman decides to go back to work and discovers that it’s a real battle to get her partner to take on any responsibility for childcare/ household stuff, as she’s been responsible for it all for so long.

And how does ‘letting the children sleep anywhere’ fit with the need to be up and ready for school? One advantage of a strict sleep schedule is that we have time in the evening to catch up on housework, and hopefully relax a bit!

The thing is if you live close to family it's far less time consuming when you see them. If you live down the road, you can pop in for twenty minutes for a cup of tea and a chat. I have family on the other side of London, if we visit it takes a whole day.

I think it must be really hard and also really not good for this already vastly over populated planet. I wish I had someone to cook me Pakistani food though!

Similar background (not muslim or Pakistan) to you and everyone has 2 kids tbh. Even with family help many parents in my family are still doing professional quals well into their 30’s. It’s not only handling the immediate load of more than 2 kids it’s the helping onto the property ladder, the cost of education etc. all that stuff means no-one in my family in my generation has more than 2 children.