Dilemma: double transfer of 2x bc or start again abroad

[MotherOfShihTzus]

Some background: 38, PCOS. I'm so lucky that my first round, 1st fresh transfer, produced my beautiful son, whom I'm grateful for everyday. So this has been a shock (below). We had another embryo from that round which thawed, expanded, but disintegrated moments before transfer last December. I'm now desperate to give him a sibling.

Im in a bit of a dilemma;

After another retrieval in feb this year, I'm just at the end of a 3rd IVF chemical in a row, 1 fresh and 2 x FET. All transfers included full immune protocol. Progesterone issues on number 2 but resolved with a modified natural for #3 - still a loss.

I now have 2 remaining embryos from feb's retrieval, BC's frozen on day 6, and frozen together- so would be transferred together. We are scared that this could result in twins, with an extremely active toddler/ nursery fees.

We're considering just starting again and having another retrieval abroad. The last 2 months I've worked hard at eliminating sugar, gluten and dairy from my diet as a way to improve pcos symptoms and hormone imbalance, so feel like a retrieval now may yield better quality eggs.

1. Does this sound like a silly idea or is there merit?

1. Where the costs in Prague and Greece, look cheaper and in some cases, more aligned to the cost of an FET, does anyone have a view on the total cost of an ICSI cycle?

1. Does the travel just add up to the same cost as the UK?

1. But is the quality of treatment worth it?

The travel abroad is of course complicated by travelling with a toddler (longest I've ever left him is overnight one Saturday, where i saw him the Saturday daytime and by lunch time the Sunday 😂)

So many questions - if anyone can help with any I'd really appreciate it!

Bump

Hey OP.

Are twins a 'not ideal but we could just about cope' or an absolutely no way?

If I'm honest, I probably would have done the double. I think it the warnings about the risk of twins often end up obsfucating the fact that if you're older, you're still much more likely to have no babies from a double transfer than twins.

Being older, and poor quality embryos are both associated with lower rates of twins from double transfers for obvious reasons, as is multiple previous fails. Looking at studies, your risk would probably be lower than 10%. Which is not massive, although I appreciate may be far too high.

Unfortunately I don't know anything about IVF abroad so can't comment on that!

Hi,
Sorry I don't have much to add to your actual questions, but just to add to your diet changes (well done BTW- it's tough changing things up even without a toddler in the mix!) have you added in any supplements?

I had a change of drug protocol for my second EC but also changed diet and took omega 3, myoinositol, methylfolate, vit D and Hugh strength CQ10. We had a much better outcome in terms of embryos (currently pregnant with a 4AA and 2 x BAs in the freezer, from only 9 eggs vs failed transfer of a 3BB last time, our only suitable blast from 19 eggs) I have PCOS too.

Feel free to ignore if you've already done supplements/aren't interested - but hope this serves as a bump up the board if nothing else!

Best of luck whichever route you go down x

Thank you both so much for replying ❤️

@MinPinSins my husband is more scared than I regarding twins, the cost being a big factor, as well as the fact we have a highly active / death defying toddler! For me, the overriding concern would be, I'm trying to have another baby for a sibling for my son, but if we have twins, the age gap now looking like 3+ years, I fear they would be close with each other and my son would feel left out 🤷‍♀️ it may be silly! But it is a worry.

@IWouldRatherBeOnHoliday thank you for recommendations and so glad to hear of your improvements. My pill box rattles with 20+ meds/ supplements a day 😂 incl 600mg COQ10, inofolic alpha, metformin, hydroxychloriquine, bits d,c,e etc. etc. I've been on all this c.18 months since able to start trying again. I have just added melatonin so we'll see on that!

Upon lots of reflection this last week, this is also due to feeling like I don't have much belief or hope in this current batch now - going into the clinic feels like 'here comes more heartbreak' rather than the excitement I should and did feel in the beginning. But researching the abroad option has been exciting; the care in Greece is phenomenal, the treatment completely personalised; and I feel as though, even though it would cost more - if it doesn't work, I can at least feel we've had a lovely holiday with our toddler and created happy memories regardless. Whereas with the double transfer back home, Im feeling like we're throwing money away with little hope of it working, or almost scared that it dies - and too well 🤷‍♀️ so we are leaning towards Greece. I'm setting up appts with our home clinic and Greece options so maybe that will shed some light - I'm hoping it dies at least!

@MotherOfShihTzus glad you have reached a decision point, I completely agree that having a feeling of confidence is a really important factor. I so hope going with the clinic in Greece brings you a beautiful sibling for your son, all the best with your next steps 🩷

Thank you @IWouldRatherBeOnHoliday :) the reality of going abroad with my son is frightening though 😂

And congratulations on your pregnancy ❤️ wishing you minimal symptoms and a magical birth. I'm always so happy to hear of successful ivf stories - we all know what we had to get through to get to this point 🩷

@MotherOfShihTzus have you found the prices are better abroad? Even with the travel costs?

@waitingforourmiracle I haven't fully costed options, as there are still many unknowns (dates, meds abroad, how many days accom), and I'd pay more going abroad compared to an FET at home as my clinic have quite a basic, cheap option (£2k FET) but if I was comparing fresh cycle to fresh cycle, I believe the cost is cheaper, yes. Some examples;

My uk clinic:

• fresh cycle + ICSI + scans (no meds no bloods)
• £5,865
• meds on top were: £1980

Gynem Prague:

• fresh cycle + ICSI + scans + bloods
• £2,210
• Flights c. £50 return
• Accom c. 90 per day
• FET - 900 euros

Greece Ark

• fresh cycle + ICSI + scans + bloods
• £3,250
• flights c. £279 each
• accom c. £90 per day
• FET - 1,100 euros

For me, it's about now having negative feelings about my current cycle, and feeling like we'd end up doing Greece anyway (more of a holiday fir a toddler), and having the positive association of a lovely holiday regardless :)

I'm seeing it as the additional cost is the holiday we wouldn't have otherwise had - so trying to see that as separate! And saving in the long run by avoiding a potential other fail at home. I think with Greece, we'll at least have a lovely holiday :) and the money we spent will benefit our son; whereas another transfer at home, being £20k+ down already this year, is taking away money that could go towards his life 🤷‍♀️ girl logic? Maybe 😂 but it's starting to feel the right option for us. I don't think I'd regret it if it failed, I'd know I'd tried everything. But if we go down the transfer at home route, I'd regret not having gone for Greece, if that makes sense?