Lawsuit against TFP GCRM (Glasgow)

[Grossnegligence]

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/05/15/ivf-clinic-whistleblower-wrongfully-sacked-tribunal/

Please read this article about GCRM. Think twice before you sign up for treatment there.

https://www.gov.uk/employment-tribunal-decisions/ms-a-henderson-v-gcrm-ltd-and-others-4102334-slash-2022
For those who do not have time to read all 82 pages, let me summarise main points for you.

-Lab was critically understaffed and unsafe
-Errors were made including binning eggs, using wrong media, using expired media, not topping up tanks with patients' material. Success rates were poor.
-Business manager was pushing for more patients (60% instead of 35%) to have invasive ICSI as it was more profitable. Without clinical indications.
-Lab manager was reporting all the problems but she was being ignored. She was asking for the workload to be reduced but instead, business manager was asking for it to be increased for profits.

This needs to become common knowledge in Scotland.

https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/health/23529385.gcrm-embryologist-career-wrecked-tribunal-fight-win/

It says in the article that she wants the patients to know.

Thank you for posting this. I can see in the scotsnet thread you posted you were criticised for posting this - ridiculous that anyone is criticising you. I can’t understand some of the scientific parts of the Tribunal decision, but does anyone know if there is any risk of errors with fertilising eggs with wrong sperm/implanting wrong embryo? I’ve had a baby with this clinic and now seriously concerned when I’m reading about errors.

Hi.
I read the tribunal and there was no mention of those sorts of errors. I would imagine the risk of something that major happening would be extremely small as such things would need to be heavily controlled.
I hope this puts you at ease xx

This is very concerning - we are about to start treatment with them. So far I have had a generally good experience but this has totally shaken me. I looked and could not find a statement from them on the issues raised.

I understand the embryologist won her case against wrongful dismissal but what is not clear is whether the practices that she highlighted have been since addressed and of course whether both Mark Tomnay and Ella Tracey have been removed from their posts and/or other disciplinary action taken by the company.

What an utter disaster... I am quite shaken.

Mark Tomnay was promoted :)) Says a lot about them.

Thank you. I did think if there was any risk of this sort the Herald or Telegraph would have reported, or it would have been covered in the Tribunal decision, but the new mum anxiety kicked in!

As for them issuing statements, they will probably just want to keep things hidden. Since the articles came out, I have seen negative reviews on google that have now disappeared (the reviews).
They probably have people working behind this to make sure the news do not spread. That is why I am doing the opposite.

@Loulaki I am sorry if the articles stressed you out. Please just remember that you have the right to ask questions and demand answers as you paid money to them. I hope all goes well for you x

@Grossnegligence thanks... I have called them but it is a shock and not what you want to hear when you are about to go through IVF with them...

If anything, now might not be a bad time as they would likely be more careful with patients now than ever x

That’s such a poor way to deal with this. Surely it would provide much more reassurance to be open and transparent with patients and to set out what improvements they have made. Deleting reviews and refusing to address this will just reinforce the fact that they have a massive issue with staffing, are prioritising profits over patient care and are effectively exploiting people at such a vulnerable time. It basically shows that they have something to hide.

Did anyone call them today? If so, what was their response?

I called them. They were really nice about it and encouraged me to look at the data that is publicly available via the regulator regarding their facility and also said that the medical issues raised were not upheld during the trial (and this is a matter of public record too). I felt reassured as they also said they would be happy to talk about it further if I had any more questions.

Oh this is upsetting to read. I went in for egg retrieval in August 2021 and again I December 2021.

I'm not shocked at all. I have previously worked in the group that GCRM is part off (TFP - formerly The Fertility Partnership) and have witnessed first hand the stress, pressure and bullying environment that takes place, specifically from management and higher management - what Ann Henderson had stated is very true, it mainly relates to getting more people in the door and doing everything they can to get as much of the patient's money as possible. It's ran as a business to make money, and that has always took priority over patient's care and the staff's wellbeing - the large amount of staff turnover has attributed to the fact that this is all they care about. Notices get given out whenever they think patients or media will be ringing in, to try and control their narrative and reduce any negative press.

We have had a cycle with them for the past two years nearly and I can confirm that the phone /clerical staff are not very customer friendly, some quite rude actually when you call up. Their service has got worse since we started in2022

The nurses and embryologists we have met have all been lovely and nice.

They have changed their ovulation tracking protocol to offer ‘clear blue’ urine sticks rather than blood tests for ovulation. I feel this is poor service prior to them changing this, when I was being tracked for ovulation last year, the clear blue I was using at home didn’t correspond with the same day the blood test that GCRM took, (they noticed my surge that day, clear blue sticks noticed the surge the next day) when I questioned this on the phone I was told 1st hand from a staff member that the blood test is more effective (which I believe to be true) but she also made a comment that the urine ovulation indicator sticks done even work for a lot of woman and reassured me the blood result was precise. So I was shocked to find out that they done even offer blood tests for tracking now and recommend clear blue ovulation indicators, how can this be precise? I just feel this is a big contradiction on their part and lack of service to give patients the best possible outcome.

I would not use them again and would not recommend them, we had 5 blasts transfer within a year and half timescale.. not one resulted in a live birth, whether this was their negligence or not we will never know, we have unexplained infertility for the record.

*dont

I really want to know if this true. I had a my first round here in Nov 2022 and 2nd in March this year. On my first round we collected a lot of eggs for my AMH but only one fertilised which was a shock. They embryologist then proceed to tell me that ICIS would be more successful for us. I was shocked to why they never mentioned in the first place that women with lower ovarian reserve should consider ICIS. We transferred the nearly blastocyst no grade, which seemed pointless. Just think they didn’t want to give me a transfer refund. On my review they said I was young and it will likely work for eventually. Which I found so unhelpful. We did a second round a very oddly even though I had 12 follicles and high estrogen we only got 4 eggs. So it would have been less work for them to do ICIS I suppose. I had worried that ruptured some before egg collection as i had some bleeding but they ignored me saying that wouldn’t happen. But I now found out from the NHS they are supposed to give a drug called luveris to hold onto your eggs. Only two fertilised but I got two good embryos. One resulted in me getting pregnant, I said I was worried they didn’t have me on progesterone and they said the don’t bother with that. I had a missed miscarriage at the 7week scan they think stopped growing at 5weeks. We transferred our last embryo and the gyno seem very inexperienced and the nurse had to keep telling him to put the catheter in the right position. They ‘said’ the transfer was successful but afterwards the nurse cuddled me and started crying. It felt like she knew the gyno had did it wrong as he took a while to move the embryo over. From just going through a round with the nhs they are much more detailed and careful. I doubt I’ll ever get as many eggs as I did with my first round with GCRM. I just feel something felt not right about our first round.

And so have I. Still scarred.
There's a place in hell for people like them.

@Kitty12345678 to be honest, as upsetting as I'm sure it just have been, I don't find what you've told me particularly odd. Ivf outcome can be vastly different round to round and first round is always trial and error. They simply can't get it right first time as nobody knows how your going to respond to a particular dosage medication ect wheras in subsequent they can tweak it depending on your previous response.
Icsi also isn't usually automatically recommended to couples in the instance of poi ( ovarian insuffiency)
Unless youve had sperm test detailing the need for icsi due to male factor then ivf is always the first option . This is only considered for further rounds when there has been a poor fertilisation rate due to ivf.
Also the drug given to prevent ovulation does vary depending on your own personal circumstances protocol ect.
And while it has a high success rate at preventing premature release, unfortunately it can happen.
Lastly , regarding progesterone. Progesterone isn't actually required if you've had a fresh cycle , unless youve had 3 or more miscarriages them they would usually supplement with progesterone

Do you work for GCRM? No I’ve actually had a round with the NHS and they said they would always recommend ICSI for woman with lower ovarian reserves or less eggs collected. Why is okay to waste a cycle just to see what will happen, it’s a waste of money, time and heart ache. Also, progesterone is standard with the NHS, they like to be safe especially if you are older and have underlying health conditions which could mean lower progesterone, why would I want to go through 3 miscarriage first are you completely mad?. With GCRM its all just about saving money. Would never use them again.

@Kitty12345678 hi , no I don't work for them.
Unfortunately I completely disagree that your misinformed by your local clinic because this dosent apply to every clinic on nhs.
This may be protocol in your local clinic but not nhs standard. Progesterone is NOT standard in every clinic and i even discussed this with them and they said i had the option of paying privately for progesterone but they wouldnt fund it unless youve had 3 miscarriages. And with primary ovarian suffiency ICSI is also not standard in every clinic.
Icsi costs more and in our nhs clinic and many others as ive been on here talking to women for over a year now and im familiar with their own experiences . We were only entitled to one round on nhs so we completely had our round wasted.
That's just the way it works. Everyone who's has ivf will tell you first round is trial and error.

@Grossnegligence I'm not denying there's any wrong doing in that clinic but I don't think this can be said for all TFP clinics. We had an nhs round then had a round at TFP . Not Glasgow.
They were wonderful. Friendly and progressional. Nobody seems inadequate or stressed. The consultant in our tfp actually works for nhs so we were lucky enough to deal with him on both occasions and he's highly recommended.

@Kitty12345678 I do agree with PP.
Unfortunately first rounds are exactly this, trial and error. You can't get it exactly right first time. I highly doubt they set you up to fail, especially in nhs rounds. How would that benefit them. The thing is nobody knows how you'll respond first time if you've never done ivf. Ivf costs alot of money and icsi costs more. I think its completely normal to be angry when it dosent go right and be looking for faults but as others have said
This isn't standard in every clinic.
Both myself and my sister have had ivf/ icsi . My sister has low egg resevere when she did ivf at 36. Icsi was never recommended to her and she now has 2 dds. Having low count dosent mean you can't get pregnant via ivf. Yes if you have icsi then there's more chance that few number of eggs might fertilise but icsi is not the go to. Many women with low counts have ivf , never icsi. If your first round via ivf was not resulting in suffient fertilised eggs then yes icsi may be recommended then.
I have pcos amh was 62 and was deemed to be a high responder and there was concern over ohss , I'm 38 and I collected only 3 eggs. To my complete shock as i was lead to believe i was a risk to over responding. just shows nobody can know how your going to respond.
We did have icsi but only because my dh has low round and morphology .

Wow just read the report and I'm quite shocked.
Luckily we didn't have treatment there but we did have treatment at tfp .
We didn't feel pushed at all to go ahead with ivf and we felt well informed.
Tfp never pushed us to have icsi either even tho our results were borderline. We were on waiting list with nhs but icsi wasn't what was recommended to us there either but we didn't want to wait any longer. Success wise , I'm pushing 40 and our first round worked and I'm now 11 weeks.
They publish success rates based on individual clinic. Our rates were very good
Personally I wouldn't hesitate using our tfp clinic again.
Only one negative I have is communication. Were were constantly having to chase things up but I don't think that's tfp that seems to be alot of clinics .
My friend used in ovo and it was the same