Azoospermia and DH doesn't want to explore options

[UnluckySeaUrchin]

After TTC for several months DH and I had fertility testing at a private clinic and we have recently found out that DH has azoospermia. Due to some medical history I think he suspected he had a low count but didn't realise it was zero (I was vaguely aware of the history but he never mentioned any fertility concerns until we got the results). I'm completely crushed. I want to explore what our options are but due to DH's medical history he doesn't believe there is any chance of himself having viable sperm and doesn't want to have any further testing to see what might be possible. He also isn't comfortable with the idea of using donor sperm. I am devastated. We live in a different country to family and don't have a close social circle here (I see nieces, nephews, friends' kids once a year at best) so I have no meaningful relationships with children that might help me deal with the idea of a childless future. I can't stop crying and feel so hopeless about the future. I'm also 38 so don't have much time left to make these decisions. DH asked if I wanted to divorce and I don't – but I am also really struggling to come to terms with the idea of being childless.

Hi @UnluckySeaUrchin i have PM’d you.

@BellaBlack thank you ❤️

Hey @UnluckySeaUrchin , how are you feeling ?

This news is quite recent and it's reasonable your husband needs a bit of time to process it, so I wouldn't take anything he says at face value just yet.

Give him time to think about it, and use this time to do the same.

If it were me I know it'd be a deal breaker and if my husband still felt like further options/donor sperm wasn't an option, I would separate. But what's good for me isn't necessarily what's good for you.

So take time to consider. You do not want to separate, but is it possible or likely that childlessness puts such a strain on your marriage that you end up separating anyway ? Or do you feel confident you'd stay together no matter one ? How would you feel if you gave up having kids to be with him, but ended up separating anyway eventually, possibly after children were no longer an option for you ?

You cannot control what your DH does, only what you do. At this point there are only three possible outcomes :

• He changes his mind and you have children through TESE/donor sperm/other procedure (if you hope for this do put a time limit on it.)
• He doesn't change his mind and you renounce having children (knowing there is no guarantee you'll stay together at the end of the day so you need to be comfortable with this choice regardless of what happens down the line)
• He doesn't change his mind and you leave.

You need to weigh all the options while he does the same, and make a decision.

This must have come as a shock to you, and possibly to a lesser degree to your DH.

@Jadviga has laid out the scenarios very well, often in life there is no obviously right decision, only several unappealing options. Maybe you could explore your feelings with a counsellor.

Did you discuss having children before you got married? Had he ever mentioned the medical history - was it a burying head in the sand kind of thing or did he actually not understand the implications?

I think the not exploring other options would bother me a lot. I don't even mean donor options but getting an expert opinion on whether there is any way of extracting viable sperm or not. That would be the minimum 'effort' I think I could tolerate but that's going from someone who's dealt with years of infertility, not someone who may have just found out. Give it time, but with a deadline in mind, and good luck with whatever you decide.

Hi OP,

What was the medical condition he had in the past? I think it sounds like he has shut down the conversation and options to avoid further disappointment. However it could be that he does have sperm and just needs it extracted surgically. Azoospermia does not always equal end of the road.

This must be such an awful shock to you. I'm on another thread for azoospermia and you are welcome to join if you think it will help you and need some support

Azoospermia support, stories and timelines www.mumsnet.com/Talk/infertility/4558984-azoospermia-support-stories-and-timelines

@UnluckySeaUrchin reaching out and sending love. This is so hard and my DP also has azoospermia so I know how earth shattering that news can be.

we are exploring every option now that will end with our own biological children but he has said he is closed off to donor sperm and this is eating me up inside. I know he needs to explore everything else first but he is so so against it that I fear it will be a deal breaker for us if it comes to it. We have always been morally/ethically aligned on everything in our 8 years together so this has been a big blow. I’m burying it in the sand for now and hoping I can convince if the time comes but I know a little about how you are feeling.

would you write a letter to him? I know that sounds weird but I find I can curate my words much better when I can write/plan/edit rather than in conversation. I feel like if he was open to exploring a little more, you could both make your peace with the outcome but him closing off to any exploration is robbing you of something without even giving it a try. If it all fails, you will be there for each other but at least you know you’ve tried.

so so hard and I wouldn’t wish this on anyone xxx

@Jadviga Thanks so much for your reply – I didn't realise that there had been more replies here hence the delay in responding!

I honestly just don't know how to feel. He doesn't want to talk about it at all and it seems to be just case closed for him, which I am really struggling to deal with. I don't want to leave, but I also don't want to be childless... and I feel like even if I did leave, I would still most likely be childless. I'm 38 and so don't have a lot of time, and don't want to rush into a relationship before I'm ready purely to have children. DH and I have been together for 12 years. I'm also feeling increasingly like this is something he may have strongly suspected but never spoken to me about, so I'm also feeling quite betrayed. He says he suspected it would be low, but not zero – but, if that's the case, then why is he so certain that a TESE would show no viable results?? I'm just so sad and feel so, so alone. I've made an appointment to speak with someone next week, so hopefully that helps.x

@lemons44

I'm not 100% certain what the condition was – he just won't talk about it... which I'm finding really difficult. I've tried to talk to him about the possibility of there being sperm that could be extracted but he is just completely not open to any further surgery and says there's no point. He's also not interested in exploring donor sperm..

Thank you for the link, although it seems like everyone else has partners that are open to exploring options... I just don't know what to do..

@HeyMona Thanks for your kind words. As you say, all the options are very unappealing... I just want him to be a bit more open but he won't talk to me about it at all. When we first met, neither of us was interested in having children. I realised it was something I wanted about 6 years ago – he always said we could if I wanted to but I didn't push anything as I thought it was important that he wanted it too. I just kind of assumed that it would happen. When he said he did want to start ttc, I was so happy. I knew that there had been surgery when he was a child, but he never went into detail and never mentioned it whenever we talked about children.. so I don't know.. I'm increasingly thinking that he suspected there would be issues so I'm also feeling quite betrayed as my options would have been very different 6 years ago.. I think you're right – I need him to get more information on what exactly is and isn't possible and I need to have a deadline for it to happen..

@IslaO I'm so sorry to hear you are also going through this. It's so difficult. I like the idea of writing a letter – even if I don't give it to him, it might just help me organise my thoughts!x

No worries, you've been dealing with a lot !

As an aside - you mention you're 38 and running out of time. Have you considered children on your own ?

I'm not saying this lightly, I know full well what it entails because I have done it. I was not willing to consider a life without children, or at least without knowing I'd done everything in my power to make children happen. I have two sons now, 4 and 2 years old, and although it's not easy everyday they're the light of my life. And frankly it's quite comfortable to be in MY bed in the evening and not have to share with anyone !

Obviously this is not for everybody, and I'm not suggesting you split up today with your husband to run to the nearest fertility clinic. But it IS an option, amongst others.

I wouldn't do anything just yet, in any case. Give yourself (and him) time to process. Broach the subject again in a few weeks and have a clear timeline in your head of what you want to happen. If you want to pursue biological children especially it's important to have this timeline and stick to it, whether it involves meeting someone else, co-parenting or sperm donor. This way you'll know you've given yourself the best chances.

In the meantime perhaps some counselling might help - not with the medical stuff, but with understanding what's going on with your husband. There may be a reason he's been burying his head in the sand and refusing to explore options (aside from the obvious possibility that he's a misleading conniving jerk of course 😉). Dealing with whatever the issue is might help convince him to actually face his issues rather than run away from them. Obviously that would be the most positive outcome. That said, the fact that he's been so "oh well that's it then" about the whole thing does make me wonder if he was that keen on children in the first place ?

Hello @UnluckySeaUrchin

It is a very difficult situation. My wife and I went through it a number of years ago. When I was diagnosed azoospermic I could not handle the options presented and so went into avoidance mode for about a year. I came out of it after a chance encounter with a friend of a friend who was a nurse at a fertility clinic and helped me reframe the idea of donor sperm.

Regarding DH and his reluctance towards using donor sperm. For me, the insight that changed my perspective was that there would be a pregnancy, a birth and the magic that entails. The baby would be biologically half my wife and if I loved my wife, why on earth wouldn't I be overjoyed and in love with a baby... That was enough for me to get my head in the game, but I needed the time beforehand with my head in the sand to digest it.

We started IUIs with donor sperm and did 12 treatments over 2 years, which we later discovered was not great advice from the clinic. We got pregnant on the 1st and 8th attempt and both miscarried after 5 and 8 weeks respectively.

In parallel, I embarked on a natural healing journey to see if I could defy the medical world and start to create sperm cells of my own.

As my diagnosis was a condition known as maturation arrest, meaning the cells that were meant to grow to become sperm cells didn’t. They were not getting instructions from the pituitary gland to grow. My urologist (Dr Ramsay) told me it's like I have all the workers, the bricks and the cement to build a wall, I just don’t have the foreman to tell them what to do.

After a couple of years of searching, I found the healing practitioner for me. We got to work on the messaging within the body and did some gradual work over about 3 months.

I then left it all for another few months before I went to a clinic for a test.
Amazingly, there were tiny numbers of sperm seen, about 20. In total!
With this development, we decided to do IVF at the Lister Clinic in London.
After one round of IVF, the miracle happened and our son was born. The donor sperm that we had on standby in the freezer was not needed.

I hope this helps.

pm