ERA EMMA ALICE testing thread #6

[Gardenlady543]

@Janefx40 @birdbybird @seven201 @Gardenlady543 @patientpatient @MyEasterEggs @thislittlebird @Yuliaaa @Violette22 @2021ivfagain @OrangeBengal @Enfys23 @Loz2467 @DEIVF @Hopeful199 @ER12 @greendress789 @Douchas12111 @Lori2022 @AdviceForJane @Anonbaby @Molls87 @ChickenT2b @GoldenElephant @IVF22 @StillTrying10000 @warrior101 @whatcangowrong @Yaynayokay

Oh yes it really has happened we are onto thread #6.

All are welcome to join us, we started out as people interested in ERA EMMA ALICE but we seem to have had every test available between us.

So if you want to know about the microbiome, reproductive immunology or you just feel your case is complicated and what like minded people to talk to about it you've come to the right place

Sorry, I'm struggling to keep up again!

I can see that @Loz2467 has had some good fertilisation news though! Congratulations. I hope a good number make it to day 5.

Sorry to see that quite a few are struggling. Love and strength.

No news from me, just in the tww of a natural ttc cycle. I bought a ovulation medichecks blood test (as didn't get a clear Positive opk) but have realised it won't be worth using as I'm taking cyclogest. I have so many stupid moments like that!

@seven201 I think you have about 4 months to use their kits, the expiry will be on the website in your my medichecks section. If you don't think you'll use it for a cycle without progesterone then you could use it just to see what your level is like on the meds.

I'm CD18 and still getting negative LH, have seen that the cycle after a chemical can be prolonged.

@ChickenT2b is the diagnosis just on the ovary appearance, as that's not enough for a diagnosis. I have a high AFC without a PCOS diagnosis.

@Loz2467 the thing is if you get a amazing result, like a large amount of high quality embryos, it kind of points in the direction of an issue that needs to be resolved affecting implantation/ the luteal phase of the cycle. IVF is very important to provide information, obviously I hope everything goes well and the transfer works with the meds in the fresh cycle enough to overcome the issue, but if it doesn't work, having a clear direction for investigations is really useful. I had a really good result in my fresh cycle and all everyone could say was it was great and my prognosis was amazing only to then have 2.5 years of crap going through constant investigations, I think it's better to know early where the issue might be. But hopefully it won't come to that.

Thank you @Gardenlady543 that's an idea!

I hope you get your surge soon so you can get things moving again.

@kerrym87 is that 30 on one ovary? He could only see the one for me.
I’m thinking I have PCO but not PCOS. There’s not much info out there on just PCO and what that means for eggs/quality. I guess time will tell.

I’m literally just starting to look at clinics as self funded due to being a step mum (don’t get me started) but it’s so hard to know where to start and what to base your choice off before paying £200+ for a consultation. Also considering Access packages but can’t help but think there must be some sort of catch. 🤷🏻‍♀️

@Gardenlady543 yes sorry it wasn’t a PCOS diagnosis but he said I have a polycystic ovary I.e lots of follicles. Is this good or neither good nor bad?

Guess I am hunting for some sort of silver lining after yesterday’s news!

@ChickenT2b it was over 30 in total. However they did ovarian drilling on both and removed endo from left ovary and now it doesn't produce as many eggs/follicles as the other side.

@Gardenlady543 yeah absolutely that makes as I’ve implanted naturally twice within the first month trying. Obviously lost our second at 19 weeks but since that something must of been wrong for nothing to work / implant for over 18 months. But like you say for now all I can do is luteal support with the progesterone for this first cycle and see where we are at. Then I’ll kinda be lost… might be microbiome and ERA is that right? Not sure what else. Obviously I could have the lap if my new dr thinks it’s necessary. I’m so sorry you are so far on and I hope for good news soon. The last transfer is the furthest you got isn’t it which was big steps xx

@kerrym87 when you say removed endo from one ovary, do you mean they drained the endometrioma? This was suggested by Prof Jurkovic that I went to see this week, as something they (ivf ppl) may wish to do.
Or did you have the cysts removed?

@ChickenT2b some clinics do similar packages to access as well, I went with the 2 cycle package and it has saved me a lot. You need to pay for meds and extra blood tests on top, but mine I get 2 collections and FETS to use up embryos, the package ends when you have a live birth or run out of embryos. So if you got pregnant the first go, then you have probably spent more money, but someone like me who just had their 5th transfer from the first collection, this would have cost a lot. The refund packages you need to have your situation checked by them to ensure you meet their criteria.

Having a lot of follicles is good, they gave me mild stims I got 12 eggs and 9 blasts. But if they overstim you you can get a lot of eggs and a lot of drop off plus you'd be at risk of OHSS. It's worth trying to get an insulin resistance test, if that's positive they put you in metformin. I also did a full hormone panel to see if I have pcos phenotype D as I didn't meet the criteria of having a lack of ovulation/ irregular cycles.

@Loz2467 yes you'd need to explore the lap, maybe also a hysteroscopy. I don't know if that reproductive endo place could maybe do some monitoring and see what happens with your hormones in the luteal phase.

Thank you @Gardenlady543 it’s good to have an idea where to start. I had a hyterscopy last June and no polyps or anything was found. He wanted to do it post ovulation and the biopsy showed late secretory stage and no signs of endometritis (something else I was paranoid about because of the infection). I could get the lap done if this transfer fails if they suggest it. Or they might say to try an FET then go to that. Yeah seems weird my cycles have been regular but this spotting turns up at 7 dpo like clockwork! It isn’t coming from the cervix either else the progesterone wouldn’t stop it would it. So it’s clearly the lining breaking down too early but i don’t know why. Many things can cause a luteal phase defect can’t they but I haven’t found the reason for mine yet plus other women I’ve known with it on mumsnet forums have got pregnant using the cyclogest after ovulation in a natural cycle but that never worked for me.

@Loz2467 maybe you need to really increase up the progesterone, I think there can be issues with progesterone resistance. This is why I went quite extreme with the progesterone in my recent cycle. It sounds like you've done a lot to look inside the uterus. So if the fresh doesn't work I would enquire about the lap, as you just got a date didn't you, so they can hopefully provide another date soon. You will really kick yourself if there is an issue and you use up all your embryos. I would say to go ahead with the fresh though, as some people do best with the lining from stims. It's like my case, I may have a completely normal HSG next cycle, but what if there is a problem and I use up my last good embryo without checking.

@Gardenlady543 Yeah that seems like a good idea. They did see the same black type area above my lining in my scan on Saturday so something is definitely there whether it’s a fibroid or endo or adeno. It’s in the muscle layer they said and the nurse said if it was likely to affect treatment they wouldn’t of started the IVF but I think otherwise. I’m in cyclogest twice a day so 800mg a day so I’m thinking if I could increase to 3 times a day after my transfer - I wonder if I could ask. In a natural cycle then cyclogest 400mg once a day from 2 dpo completely stops the spotting and my 7 dpo prog test came back at 142 p mol but that was in clomid too. Not just progesterone. I could have the lap done in feb - so that could be next steps then I don’t delay or waste any embryos if there is an issue. He said mild endo doesn’t usually affect IVF it’s only when it’s causing endometriomas etc but I just don’t know much about all this. I do feel like I’ve had a better lining from the stims so we will just see. When’s your HSG? I saw about the struggles last time. I’ve never had my tubes checked actually so the lap would help with that. Secondary infertility makes my brain hurt! Any type of infertility is just unfair.

@Loz2467 I think stress can cause a lot of issues too. I’ve found acupuncture really good as the lady who does mine is amazing.

@ChickenT2b I’ve gone for a 3 cycle refund package with CARE. Think Access do similar one. It has already saved us money vs what we’d have spent PAYG (lots of add ons included in it like embryoscope etc) and obviously still not had a baby yet so might be saving £10k+ more.

@ChickenT2b they used laser to remove the endometrioma and then they did little spots on abnormal pcos tissue as sometimes it can stimulate normal tissue to grow. Didn't work for me but does for some. Can't remove cysts as they pop up and disappear all the time unless it's a big one. The cysts in pcos technically are lots of larger follicles which may or may not produce and egg, the name is a alittle.misleading 😊

Hi everyone. Sorry I'm struggling to keep up. Hope you're all OK.

We got the results of Dh's infections test as advised by Dr Gordon who works with Shehata. It's a urine test DL12(?) And its shown he has Ureaplasma. I'm going to do a bit more reading. But they're sending me a test out to do and then once my results are back they'll let us know the plan. Most likely antibiotics for dh and if I have it too, it'll be the same for me. He's also having his testosterone done this week.
Seems like we might have identified more issues 😒 feel so detached from it all now.

I'll try and catch up with everyone's news. Lots of love ❤️ xx

@VenusStarr this is what my friend had, she ended up going to Clarewell clinic, they did a swab and detected it and treated her on moxifloxacillin, as her next swab was positive they said it was colonised and not an issue and didn't need more treatment.

@Loz2467 I need to wait until my next cycle and haven't even had the LH surge yet, I've heard cycles can be prolonged after a chemical, bet the invasive saline scan I had didn't help either.

@Gardenlady543 ah yes that’s what I’m thinking about. Your saline scan. I remember reading about that. I’m so sorry and I hope you get your LH surge soon then you can move forward with the next part and you’ve got your last good quality embryo. Wish I paid for the day 3 updates now. Seems a long time hearing nothing from Tuesday morning to transfer day! Saturday!

@Loz2467 a day 3 update can be very stressful as some people have a lot get to day 3 and then a big drop off after, I think a final day 5 will be good.

No LH surge again today.

@VenusStarr ureaplasma was found in my microbiome test and my partner then also tested positive for it (same sex). We took doxycycline for a week and tested negative after.

Thank you @Gardenlady543 and @Lori2022 my Emma and Alice were clear, as was my biopsy last year when I had my hysteroscopy (think they just looked at chronic endometrisis though, not sure if it's linked, does anyone know?) The turnaround for results is quick so I'll find out soon either way.
Thank you x

@VenusStarr my friend had 2 x EMMA ALICE that didn't find it, it was picked up on the menstrual fluid test. It is one of the bacteria associated with endometritis and I read it's associated with miscarriages, my friend had had a miscarriage, but Clarewell that deal with STIs weren't that concerned about it, but did treat it. She is pregnant now, this is my friend that was told there is absolutely no hope for her and got pregnant naturally on Chinese herbs after the transfer of a euploid didn't implant the month before.

Almost makes you wonder whether worth just taking a week of doxycycline for both partners (obviously not around an actual embryo transfer and not if allergic to it) just in case! 🤔

@Enfys23 I know a lot of USA clinics put some doxycycline in the protocol of FETs, UK avoids antibiotics, but so much in IVF is invasive, maybe more antibiotics should be implemented. While I completely understand about the risk of antibiotics resistance, I was very unhappy to get diagnosed with an infection that was really hard to clear after years of infertility and so many people come to the thread with the same issues :(

That's really interesting @Gardenlady543 🤔 maybe I haven't just wasted £300 on a test! I was reading some articles yesterday and it accounts for about 50% of miscarriages apparently. It might explain us losing healthy babies on the immune protocol. We just don't have any embryos now and haven't conceived naturally in over 2 years, so the odds are not in my favour.

Any sign of your lh surge? X

@Gardenlady543 yeah that’s true! More stress! Did you have a fibroid removed a few months ago? I’m wondering if this could be a fibroid in my myometrium. If not and it’s adenomyosis then obviously they can’t remove it. If it is a fibroid can it cause implantation failure? It was only mm but I can’t remember exactly how many. Dr Google just said it can cause infertility 🙃 so now I’m worrying.