Fertility counselling?

[EpiphanySoul1]

Hi all, I’m wondering how many people have done counselling during IVF. I am onto cycle 6 of IVF. Been trying 4 years. I generally feel I am ok and actually doing quite well considering but I listened to a podcast yesterday that discussed fertility and I felt so upset and tense after it so wondered if I was keeping things pent up.

My clinic have free counselling so I emailed on a whim asking for an appointment and now I have one for Friday and I’m scared to go!!!!

Has anyone done counselling and found it good?

@EpiphanySoul1 my first session is this Friday as well, it will be over the phone. I don’t know what to expect, my friend has done it and said she found it really useful, she did it with her DH and they discussed ways they can support each other. I’ll be doing my session alone, DH is supportive and is a kind of go with the flow person, so things haven’t really affected him.

The nurse had mentioned the counselling to me on my OTD for my FET, so I decided to take her up on it.

Good luck @Gardenlady543 I decided to email back and confirm the appointment! After all it is free and it might be useful. I don’t know what I’m afraid of - maybe that I’ll let it all out and become a complete wreck! Mine is via video call.

How are you feeling about it? Why did you decide to go forward and do it?

@EpiphanySoul1 I mean if you do break down then you’ll be in good hands, sometimes we bottle stuff up and the gates are just opened. I’m a doctor so I’m used to being on the receiving end when people let their guards down, I expect it and try to help as much as I can.

I guess I don’t really know what’s going to happen. I feel I’m functioning well, but things are getting to me. So it will be good to see what the counsellor has to say. I guess the bit I’m struggling the most with at the moment is uncertainty. I’ve never had a BFP, I thought IVF would help, but despite a good amount of high quality embryos both the fresh and frozen transfers didn’t result in anything. I am waiting on the results of PGT-A, I had 7 frosties and the best didn’t survive the thaw so now I have 6. If there are euploid ones (which hopefully there will be- I’m 35), then I want to talk to my specialist about a natural FET (I react to progesterone and estradiol makes me nauseated) and I want to ask about a scratch as well, I was thinking about an ERA but not sure if they are any use with natural FET.

So I guess right now I’m in no mans land, I can’t look at social media or the news and has a go at my boss today as he keeps mentioning his pregnant daughter in law. I just said it’s triggering for me and upsets me and I know he isn’t aware of this but I want to make him aware so he stops and after I said that I then just blurted out “what do you want me to say, good for her, I hope she never experiences the hell I'm going through” And he just said “I’m so sorry”, so you know maybe I’m not coping that well. I haven’t spoken to my best friend for over a year because she started trying at the same time as me and it happened straight away for her and now she has a baby and I can’t face it. I don’t really want the counsellor to come up with solutions, because I feel avoidance is the best option right now. I guess I just want someone to listen and say “it’s ok”.

I’m interested to know about your story, it sounds like you’ve really been through it, something must have prompted you to want to try the counselling?

@EpiphanySoul1 I had counselling when my first cycle failed, it's helpful for some people but not everyone. I'm someone who struggles to keep things inside and naturally quite anxious and so talking through things with someone was helpful for me, especially because I didn't feel the few friends/family who knew about our IVF could understand what we were going through.
The only possible negative is if your clinic don't offer many sessions and you end up uncovering more deeper held traumas or emotions that you then don't get enough sessions to work through that mentally that can be a little harmful although I would assume the counseling would focus purely on the fertility side of things and I would hope that it wouldn't be an issue or they would offer a solution if so xx

I had fertility counselling through my clinic which was just focused on the fertility side of things, was given some advice but usually more of a chat, I also had the opportunity to access some counselling through work which covered a little more and this used more counselling techniques such as cognitive behavioural therapy- both helpful in their own way xx

I had counselling while waiting to get top of the list as I found the wait and unknown really stressful.

I'm SO glad I did it because we managed to work on a lot of the issues I had and I was given coping mechanisms too and it was just really beneficial to me. Talking to friends is fine, but taking to someone who solely just wants to listen to you and understand was beyond helpful for me

That’s so helpful @willithappen I hope I have the same experience.

I hope so too @Gardenlady543
The lady I had was so amazing. She emailed me tools to help stop me worry and over think. I have a worry chart now that I can look at
We also spoke about the chimp paradox theory and it makes so much sense to me too!
She helped me beyond just the fertility stuff. I think I'm going to look into more regular counselling too

Thanks all for your words of support @willithappen @Roo45 I really hope it’s positive. I do think I need to talk it out and see if I’m actually not dealing with stuff properly.

@Gardenlady543 I’ve a very long and convoluted story. We started ttc when I was 30.5 - after 6 months I self-referred to a private clinic for fertility tests as I have an oddly shaped cervix so thought maybe that might be indicating something wrong. When we got our results we got a big shock that all my tests were totally fine but DH had only had a sperm count of 1 million and ICSI was our only option. Took another 6 months to get the cycle set up and then only ended up with 5 eggs due to me not responding to the low dose of meds and then not being able to reach my left ovary. We got 4 embryos but all dropped off at day 5 and nothing to transfer which indicated a sperm issue.

We did a DNA frag test then after a month or so break and it came back extremely high so we had to wait another 3 months to get referred to a urologist. Then 3 months or so to wait for DH to get a varicoele embolized and 3 months recovery time before we could try again.

It was about 1.5 years then so I got my AMH tested again and got a shock that it had dropped off a cliff into just below normal for my age. Consultant reckoned I had fallen off that cliff most women do at 40 at 32!!

We did our second round on a higher dose of meds and ended up with poor response and all 4 embryos arrested on day 2 indicating poor egg quality. We then took a good chunk of time off to improve our diet etc (events though it was already good but we got a nutritionist and went on a crazy carb gluten dairy sugar caffiene alcohol free thing)

We did another round then and it went even worse!! We only got 2 eggs on max dose of Stims. We had an extremely bleak few days where we discussed potentially having to go donor eggs but then got a call to say both had fertilised and were doing great on day 3. Both then by some miracle made it to blast with top grades. We transferred back a top quality hatching blast and were so hopefully bit it was negative! As it has taken us 3 rounds to get a blast and with my AMH dropped so much we didn’t want to put our other one back so we researched and moved to a new clinic for embryo banking of 3 rounds with PGS as with male and female issues we were worried about miscarriage risk.

Our first round went so well. We got 13 eggs and 3 top quality blasts but the testing came back with one abnormal and two inconclusive so we would need to retest to see what the story is with the other two. We decided to leave them alone for now and see how our next two rounds went for getting any normal blasts. Retested my AMH as it was a year since last test and it hadn’t changed at all so we were feeling positive, did our next round on the exact same dose of Stims and it ended up being cancelled the day trigger was due as I didn’t respond at all to the meds and it was our worst cycle yet!

So we are none the wiser as to why it works sometimes and not others or whether we can make any normal blasts or not. Our consultant says we have to just do another round as we have made 5 top quality blasts and some key or may not be normal so he can’t recommend donor egg or giving up but we can’t get any good idea of what on earth is going on with me!!

I would be very interested to hear how many of yours are PGS normal. As I am now nearly 35 too so same age.

Re friends I actually am fine with my friends babies, I’ve been godmother to 3 since we’ve been TTC. My friends know though and none really discuss their pregnancies with me at all so I think I’m ok by the time the baby is here. I do have a friend who recently got pregnant and sent me bump selfies every week until I had to tell her to stop as honestly it was damaging my mental health and then I’ve had 3 friends do IVF after me who have all gotten pregnant first time so that is tough too. I just worry I’m bottling it all up.

Sorry thats very long 😂😂 @Gardenlady543

Bless you @EpiphanySoul1 wow what a journey, it must have been so frustrating when you’ve had to wait around like waiting for the urologist and with the variability of response, that must have been so frustrating too. It sounds like you’ve been handling everything really well, but sometimes there are things under the surface and we don’t realise it. So I reckon speaking with the counsellor is a good idea.

I’m interested about how many are euploid as well out of the 6 they’ve tested. I’m quite worried as things don’t add up... I have an AFC of 34 so had low dose stims, got 12 eggs, all mature, all fertilized, we ended up with 9 blastocytes, half were 1,1. The one we transferred in the FET was hatching when frozen and as soon as it was thawed it fully hatched, so how was it so vigorous and absolutely nothing happened once it was transferred into me. It makes no sense how we’ve never conceived naturally either, if the embryos are so good. I think there’s an implantation issue so I’m hoping the scratch will work for me. But I thought the first step is to look at the embryos.

Wow with the bump photo friend, omg you are so much tolerant than me! When are you going to do your next fresh cycle?

@Gardenlady543 I would be hopeful with that many embryos you have transferred the abnormal ones as I think 50% should be abnormal at 35 so that could mean you will find one more abnormal and the rest be normal! It’s a good idea to do a scratch too but I’d consider combining it with an ERA or Alice/Emma as they act as a scratch but you’ll also get the benefit of finding out if something else is up implantation wise!

My plans is if I get a normal to do immune testing ERA /ALICE and EMMA to hopefully leave nothing to chance.

Ha yes my DH said to just ditch her as a friend but we were very close pre pregnancy so I just got the courage up to point out how awful she was being thinking if she got offended that would be it but she apologised. We haven’t spoken much since though as I just am still a bit damaged by it!

Oh I forgot to include in my story the consultant who told us my DH sperm count had improved for the IVF sample so to go away and try naturally for 6 months so we did, came back and she told us she had never said that - even though we were both in the meeting!!! So I had to find a new clinic after that!

Oh wow @EpiphanySoul1 I would be so annoyed with the consultant, I’m glad you started a few years ago because time was on your side. It sounds like you’ve got the bulk of things done now and got a good few embryos in the freezer.

Sadly my best embryo didn’t survive the thaw, so I am down to 6 now, but hopefully there are some nice euploid ones in there.

I have just been diagnosed with progesterone hypersensitivity and I vomited on estradiol, so I’m very very keen to go for a natural FET next time. Do you know if the endometrial biopsy is any use with natural FET? As far as I’m aware natural FET either can or can’t include progesterone, it doesn’t affect implantation but can have an impact in ongoing pregnancies.

@Gardenlady543 I’ve heard lots of people say that their normal embryos weren’t the top graded ones so I would try not to worry about losing your best. I would be very very surprised if you didn’t get around 3 normals from your batch - they just may not be the ones you expect grading wise. When do you get you results back? The waiting is very hard.

You’re right I don’t think an ERA would be useful with a FET but one of the Emma/Alice checks for infection in the uterine lining which is fixed with antibiotics so you could always have that one done as like I said the biopsy acts as a scratch so you may as well try get some more info while doing it. I don’t know too much about natural FET otherwise I’m afraid.

@EpiphanySoul1 the biopsies were sent off last Thursday, they said to expect the results back in 2-3 weeks, but sometimes they’re back in a week. If they aren’t back by Thursday they’re going to cancel my appointment with the consultant which is booked for this Friday, so I’ll have to hold off on an ERA/ scratch for an extra month while I wait for a new appointment. They don’t allow appointments with the specialist, while awaiting the results, which is so annoying as there are so many other things I want to discuss.

As it’s a small sample size I know the general stats don’t tend to mean much, but it would be good if I get 50% or more as normal. I’m with access fertility 2 cycle program, so can still have another fresh cycle if I get the worst news, I’m just trying not to think about it that much. Like you say hopefully he abnormal ones have self selected out and I think you’re right with grading, so many people say it’s the worst graded ones that are the normal ones!

I thought I would come back and update in case anyone else is looking.

I had a nice chat with a lovely counsellor. She didn’t give me many tips of what to do but we did talk things through and I do feel a bit calmer about it. She also helped me realise that I actually have developed anxiety from all of this. I always had that tendency for it and some of what I said to her she pointed out was classic anxiety not even related to ivf woes. So I’m going to try work in my anxiety. I may do another session with her in a few weeks but there was a lot of benefit to a one off session.

I would encourage anyone who is unsure or whose clinic offers it included to consider it.

@Gardenlady543 I saw your update about the embryos on another thread. Great news!

Ah that’s good that you found it helpful @EpiphanySoul1 ! I found my session helpful as well, the counsellor helped me to recognise issues that I need to deal with. I use Headspace so I can pick some relevant courses that focus on the issues I’m having. She also recommended I book in again, so I think that’s an indication that I need some extra help. Do you use headspace, if not, you could do a trial and see if helps? I’m sure they’ll have some anxiety focused sessions in there.

Thanks about the embryo comment, it seems to have opened up a can of worms! me and DH are both having a C4M2 blood test, this seems to be specific to my clinic, apparently 15% of the population carry it and it can be a cause of recurrent implantation failure and miscarriage, if either me or DH has it then I’ll be put on heparin. I’m also have a thombophilia screen and autoantibody tests and we’re getting set up for a mock cycle with an ERA cycle when my period comes in around 2 weeks time. So much going on, but I guess the good thing is there are 5 euploid embryos, I would hate to have an issue with implantation as well as the embryos, hopefully we’ll know more about what’s going on after these tests.