Anyone had a "good egg" in a batch of bad ones (PGT-A)

[Burntparsnips]

2 weeks ago I had my egg collection and 5 eggs reached blastocyst stage
We transferred 2 on the 5th day (one average, one poor)
We tested 2 genetically
We froze one without testing

Today I found out I was pregnant and we were so excited as we’ve had many many years / rounds of IVF. It was our little Christmas miracle!

Unfortunately the embryologist has since called to say the 2 embryos that were tested are abnormal (one chromosome issues, one had no DNA found). She said she couldn’t comment on the other embryos as they weren't tested but that I should "definitely consider tests on the current positive" (her words).

Apparently I can speak to the geneticist but it will be in the new year as they have finished for Christmas

I truly thought this was a Christmas gift but the clinic have really managed to put a dampener on it. I really wish they had waited till after Christmas to give me the news or allow me one day of positive happiness

Has anyone ever had a similar experience and had a “good egg” in a batch of bad ones?

Statistically you will only get 50% normals in general so I wouldn’t worry about having 2 abnormal. Hopefully you transferred the 2 normal.

Also no dna detected does not mean abnormal. It means that they couldn’t tell whether it’s normal or not. So they would treat that as an untested embryo. It could be a sample error, biopsy error or poor quality embryo.

Sorry when I say they treat your no dna detected as untested what I mean is you could also transfer that if you wanted as they can’t tell if it’s normal or abnormal. So really you have one abnormal, one no result and hopefully a normal that you are pregnant with.

Take a read of this www.thecut.com/2017/09/ivf-abnormal-embryos-new-last-chance.html

I don't think it's clear cut - an 'abnormal' embryo can produce a normal baby. And vice versa. The testing is very limited and isn't conclusive.

I’m pretty sure the stats say there is always a mixture of normal and abnormal eggs in every cycle, it just varies according to age, so it’s quite likely you have been lucky and selected the best ones unknowingly. Try not to be too down at this stage, I’m surprised the clinic seem to have put a negative spin on this to be honest. Congratulations on your pregnancy.

I transferred 2 untested embryos after getting no normals on a previous batch and I'm 31 weeks with twins - I did opt for NIPT testing and all came back normal/low risk

And just with regards the "no result" embryo - my friend retested all her no results recently and all came back as "normal" 🤷‍♀️

PGTA isn't 100% accurate which is why it was downgraded by the HFEA so I wouldn't let this put a dampener on your BFP

Also not sure of the grade of embryos you decided to test - presume these were the "best" two if you transferred an average and poor quality one? I'm a member of a few PGS groups where actually most members lowest graded blastocysts were the normal ones and the top/best quality ones were the PGS abnormal ones

Thanks so much everyone for the replies, it's reassuring to hear the "others" might be ok.
The lady who called just worried me a bit by saying I should do tests
It sounds like the genetic testing isn't quite as accurate as I had assumed. I should have probably done more research before having it done but I'm over 40 and have had a few miscarriages so it did sound sensible as there is no other "reason" why I keep having them. Fingers crossed this one is ok
Thanks again

@ivfbeenbusy

Also not sure of the grade of embryos you decided to test - presume these were the "best" two if you transferred an average and poor quality one? I'm a member of a few PGS groups where actually most members lowest graded blastocysts were the normal ones and the top/best quality ones were the PGS abnormal ones

@ivfbeenbusy That's interesting, as i'm in a dilemma about which embryos to test at the moment. Did Create give you any advice on which ones, or did you just test all of yours? I have 9 frozen and the grades vary from 3BB up to 6BB (i think my 'best' would be the 5BB, i have a few of them.)

I still have one more round to go, but i was considering not testing the 3BB being the lowest, now i am wondering! Create did tell me at the start that embryo grading has no impact on whether they are normal, but that doesn't help with the selection process, unless i break the bank and just test them all!

I tested them all but they were all the same grade and I only had a Couple to test

Create said they only would bot biopsy one if it was really low grade or struggling and they thought it would be better just to be frozen

Personally i wouldn't test them all......what if they all came back abnormal and you have to destroy them (although create did agree to transfer the low level mosaic I had). I'd test half - that way you then have the option to at least transfer your untested ones (my twins were untested embryos)

Lots of good groups on Facebook to join for PGS testing - especially the American ones where it's pretty common to transfer abnormal embryos and have a healthy baby.

@ivfbeenbusy Thanks for the advice, seems a sensible precaution to hold some back, especially if my final round is good too.

@ivfbeenbusy @IslandStars can I be cheeky and ask a question please? Do create biopsy at 5 days, freeze and then delay the testing? Or do they defrost and then biopsy? I have three frozen from a previous round and can’t decide whether to defrost and test them (my clinic keep giving me very mixed views on this). (I have one normal tested one on ice but would like a couple more!)

@Burntparsnips - I had two tested in a previous round, one was normal and one was not. I think it’s very common to have a mix, so try not to worry too much. Wishing you lots of luck 🤞🤞

@Shamoo Most clinics advise to decide on PGS in advance, so after EC when your embryos reach day 5, they will biopsy then freeze. This reduces the risk of damaging the embryo by freezing - defrosting - biopsy- then freezing again - until you’re ready to transfer. There’s also a risk that embryos won’t survive the defrost (whether you PGS or not), so it’s not ideal to defrost twice.

It’s possible to do though if you really need it. As you have one normal, I’d transfer that one first, then test the other frozen ones later if you need to. Best of luck with it.

Thanks @IslandStars - that’s what I have already done with the others (these 3 are pre considering testing), I was just a bit confused as to how it works with create as the posts suggested that they do three rounds before they do the testing so I wasn’t clear on how that worked. Assume that they must biopsy them when they are fresh and then do the actual test later based on your reply. I’m trying to bank a few before transferring back given my age.

Thanks for coming back to me 😀

@Shamoo You're welcome. That's correct, they are biopsied fresh and then freeze the embryo when pre planned. The 3 cycle package with Create only includes PGS on 4 embryos, above that they are £350 each.

You could test them as you go, but they told me most people wait until the end of the 3 cycle package and then decide on which ones they want to test.

Thanks @IslandStars 🙏

Not sure if this forum is still in use? But if so, how long does it take to get the results for PFT-A, we have 5 being tested and it’s now been a week..they did say 2wks, is that about right?

Hi @IVFat43 my results took exactly 2 weeks. Hope that helps

Thanks @Burntparsnips
Do you mind me asking how many were tested and the results? I have 5 but turning 43, the probability is low to have any back ok..

@IVFat43 My clinic Create, told me 3 weeks, but can be sooner. It’s currently been 2 weeks since I sent mine off and the waiting is horrendous! I’m 42, have sent 8 embryos collected over 3 cycles off for testing. I have 5 more which I have held back so far.

Wow you have lots.. @IslandStars
It’s driving me insane, I can’t wait to hear how many, if any, are good... I’d be happy with 2 as they’ll only put 1 in giving me 2 chances..and at £2k for the 2nd embryo and every embryo thereafter to implant, I don’t think I’d try any more than that anyway ..its already a costly game of numbers 😏

@IVFat43 I had one cycle. I transferred 2, tested 2 and then left another one to monitor as it was less developed (but it ended up fine and was frozen)

The 2 embryos that were tested were abnormal (one chromosome issues, one had no DNA found)
Apparently I can still implant the no DNA one (and I have the untested one)

I did read on mumsnet not to test them all due to my age - 42 - in case they all came back unsuitable

@IVFat43 I’ve been very lucky so far, but I’m just praying for 2 normal, as I’ve heard plenty of people getting low numbers. I don’t think I’d be able to afford siblings sadly as I’m doing this single using a donor, so my only thought right now is achieving one baby. It’s all very expensive. I’ve tested to reduce the chance of mc. It worries me that an abnormal embryo may implant and I could carry for a couple of months, then mc. At my age, the time lost is significant, on top of all the heartache. I’ll post back with results this week hopefully, good luck!

Ah that’s interesting @Burntparsnips

I’m 43 (today) 😂 and had all mine (5) tested.. I thought it was more cost effective doing it that way than £2k plus meds transferring a bad embryo to fail.. plus I was told you can’t find out if downs until 18wks gone.. tbh it’s difficult knowing what is right and the best thing to do.. this felt right for us.
It’s our first and only attempt at ivf so I do hope 1 returns back ok

@IVFat43 Happy Birthday! I’ve tested for the same reason, since I have a lot of embryos, no point paying £2K each time for FET when many are likely to be abnormal. It’s hard to be 100% sure on what to do, there’s pros and cons to it all.