Dud (disintegrated) eggs
Gillywater · 21/10/2018 21:24
Thanks again to everyone who gave their advice on my previous thread regarding additional treatments.
My stats currently: age 37, FSH: 12, AMH:12.7, AFC: 13/14, endometriosis
(had a lap in June & diathermy including removing endometrioma from right ovary. Referred to a specialist centre for an MRI & possible excision next year). DH has poor motility so ICSI
This is my first cycle. I was on 300 Gonal F, stimmed for 13 days and am told I responded well. We had egg collection on Friday- 15 collected, 10 mature. Unfortunately, of those 10 eggs, 5 disintegrated on injection. 1 didn't fertilise, and 4 fertilised.
My clinic recommends 5 day transfer. I am not expecting we will get there, but we have decided not to do a 3 day transfer so we can find out as much info as we can about the embryos. I know it only takes one etc etc. but I can't bear faux positivity, and realistically, things look bleak for us.
The embryologist has told me I have poor eggs, which I am inclined to agree with. I'm happy to do the supplements, but I doubt they will rectify dud eggs. I know that I am old, and it's highly likely the endo has contributed to my dud eggs too (hence my elevated FSH).
My queries are:
-For those of you who had decent egg numbers but crappy fertilisation, what did clinics suggest regarding a change in protocol? Did this actually make any difference?
-Has anyone else experienced disintegrating eggs? (Lauren83, I believe you work in a clinic- is this something you have seen?)
-Is it even worth thinking about doing another cycle/s? We were thinking about access fertility, but would appreciate hearing others experiences of using their packages.
Feeling pretty low tonight, so thanks in advance for any advice/replies. The only silver lining will be that I can stop these fecking pessaries when I get the call.
hoping2018 · 21/10/2018 22:24
I'm sorry to hear your cycle isn't going as well as hoped.
My situation is not the same but after cycle one we were incredibly deflated and told 5-20% chance of success per cycle - I'm now 25/40 after cycle 2. I hope my story can give you some hope!
Age 32, (31 for first cycle) fsh 12, AMH 8, AFC (can't remember but letter says reassuringly good). Needed ICSI for MFI and told to get on with it due to my FSH. I got 20 eggs on cycle 1, 14 mature, 14 fertilised but by day 5 we had only 2 blasts. Both poor quality and not good enough to freeze - one put back and BFN. We were heart broken. Clinic couldn't say why our embryos were such crap quality - though they did say using timeline/embryoscope was really useful and gave them lots of information. Lots died off day 1-3 (more likely poor egg quality) but hardly any survived day 3-5 (poor sperm quality). We were told poor quality and probably both of us!
We applied to access fertility for our self funded cycle and they agreed to 3xICSI and money back at the end if not pregnant. Seemed good to us as doctors had said with such poor quality blasts chances of success per IVF cycle were 5-10%.
Cycle 2 we reduced my stims and surgically retrieved husbands sperm after a borderline high DNA fragmentation test. 22 mature eggs - 13 fertilised via ICSI. By day 3 we had four in the running (so loads had died off again) and none of them were the 8 cells they should be. Neverthless we did transfer on day 3- 2 best looking embryos and by the time we went to transfer one had made the ideal "8 cell."
Of the two not transferred on day 3 both went on to make blasts one on day 5 and one on day 6 and are now frozen. I'm currently pregnant with one baby.
Egg quality was a problem for us as so many died by day 3, but sperm quality was a problem too and surgical sperm retrieval seemed to make the difference.
Sorry for the length - but I hope it can give you a bit of hope that they learn things from cycle one and this gives you more chance of success for cycle 2 (even if cycle one is abysmal!) access fertility were great and it took the pressure off but in the end certainly not the cheapest way to do it! I don't regret our decision though - especially given the %chance of success we'd been told.
Cherries101 · 22/10/2018 01:36
I am your age with pcos so my problem is immature eggs . My first cycle was similar to yours except I only had 1 useable embryo. I was recommended coenzyme q10 by my consultant to improve egg quality and ended up with 14 mature eggs / early embryos and 4 blastocysts. Consider your first cycle a test.
Gillywater · 22/10/2018 19:08
Thanks hoping2018- I appreciate the time (again) that you've taken to respond.
I know that the first cycle is a trial and error process, but I am gutted about my abysmal egg quality. I think because I got a decent-ish number of eggs I had hoped fertilisation would be ok. I am going to try and speak to the embryologist tomorrow and find out more.
It is useful to hear about the changes your Consultant made, but I suspect donor eggs (not that there is anything wrong with taking that route) will be mentioned. I am eligible for the access fertility refund programme (or so they have told me) so at least that is an option, if we decide to try again. Glad to hear your pregnancy is progressing well too.
Cherries101- sounds like your second cycle was much better & thanks for your reply. I am already taking 300mg of ubiquinol co-enzyme q10. I am seriously thinking about taking DHEA now too, but I have heard it can cause endo to worsen, so will ask my endo clinical nurse specialist for advice.
Thoughts from other lurkers appreciated
ckc45d10 · 23/10/2018 18:48
Yes, CoQ10 or ubiquinol may help to support fertility. One thing to note is that a water or fat-soluble form of CoQ10/ubiquinol absorbs better.
For DHEA, this is a hormone, and should be monitored by your doctor. Discuss all supplement changes with your doctor, either way.
hoping2018 · 23/10/2018 21:55
Yes it's worth saying my consultant got me to take a host of medications to boost quality - we went straight into a second cycle so not much chance for them to help but I was taking co q10, DHEA and melatonin (AMAZINg - never slept so well). I wouldn't take any of these without consulting the doctor though
Gillywater · 24/10/2018 19:39
Thanks both, I will check out the options with my Consultant in our debrief. I did take melatonin during stimming, but I just did off my own back after reading 'It Starts With the Egg'. I also want to check if there is going to be an impact on the endo.
Cherries101 · 24/10/2018 21:51
I was told to avoid dhea because it can cause pcos symptoms to worsen.
Naty1 · 24/10/2018 22:33
We had serious issues with each of our 3 cycles. I have pcos and we have mfi. I got like 8 eggs each cycle but certainly 1 cycle was messed up by the clinic and i was triggered too soon due to ohss risk. That was the unsuccessful cycle. I dont know why but our fertilisation was really low every cycle. Cycle 1 we only had 1/2 embryos. But it did work.
Gillywater · 25/10/2018 21:18
Hi Naty1, thanks for sharing your thoughts/experience. It's just such a lottery. I spoke to the embryologist and she confirmed poor egg quality most likely due to endo. I guess if we go again we may get lucky, but we'd probably continue to have rubbish fertilisation. Will see what the debrief brings....
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