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Megrahi to be released

66 replies

midnightexpress · 20/08/2009 14:12

I admit that I don't know enough about the ins and outs of this case to say whether he did it or not (though it does look suspiciously like there has been a cover-up of at least some of the facts in the case). And I have no idea what my reaction to this news would be if I were a relative of one of the victims.

However, what is interesting is how there is really nothing very edifying in seeing the vengeful 'he should rot in hell' comments from some quarters. The guy whose daughter was killed who says that Megrahi should be allowed to go home to die seems so much more worthy of admiration, somehow.

What do other people think?

OP posts:
edam · 20/08/2009 16:18

First, compassion is a good thing. He's only been released to die very shortly.

Second, it seems clear there are very big questions about the safety of his conviction. He had to abandon his appeal in order to qualify for release on grounds of compassion. But I think it's doubtful whether he is responsible for blowing up the jet - especially as the Yanks had blown up an Iranian plane not long before, giving them a massive motive for striking back. Obviously there is some pretty murky politics involved in this case.

I know legally he is the guilty party, but given there are question marks over that, makes even more sense to consider him for compassionate release.

Saltire · 20/08/2009 16:20

I usually consider myself to be quite compassionate, but not in this case. As far as I am concrned he was found guilty. Of murder, so he should at the very least, end his sentence in a libyan jail.

louii · 20/08/2009 16:22

It was explained during the Justice Ministers speech why a transfer could not take place.

Saltire · 20/08/2009 16:23

I know

prettybird · 20/08/2009 16:32

I thought Kenny MacAksill's speecg was very good. And I like bentneckwine1's ds' comparison with the "Golden Rules".

And it is interesting that most of the Brittish relatives have been supportive of him - indeed many of them have been campaigining for his release.

At least now the way is open for a proper public inquiry. Although I doubt that that will happen as one of the reasons why his appeal had been taking such a long time was that both the American and UK governments were refusing to release key evidence.

SoupDragon · 20/08/2009 16:43

"he should at the very least, end his sentence in a libyan jail"

Would he have ended his sentence in a UK jail or would he have been in hospital?

hannahsaunt · 20/08/2009 16:50

There were apparently substantive grounds for appeal and it seemed to be thought that the appeal had a very good chance of succes but it had to be dropped to allow the release as it is to happen (time issues notwithstanding it not means that evidence will no longer be heard ... not that I'm cynical). Generally across the media the families of UK victims are supportive of the release (believing the conviction to be unsafe) and the US families want someone/anyone to be in jail. Kenny McAskill had to either pander to the Libyans (new oil contracts etc) or pander to the US (and who wants to be labelled a lapdog of a US president again?) - damned if he did and damned if he didn't ... FWIW I think he went with the bigger man approach and retained th moral highground.

bentneckwine1 · 20/08/2009 16:59

I agree with hannahsaunt about retaining the higher moral ground. Plus if we hadn't released him and he died in a Scottish jail then it was suggested that he would become some kind of revered martyr whose death whilst imprisoned might be seen by some to need avenged.

By releasing him we hopefully removed that risk of further terrorist outrages.

HolyGuacamole · 20/08/2009 17:40

Absolutely shocking that he is to be released. Can't believe they let him out, besides the fact he was found guilty, what about the pressure that has been laid on by the Americans in the past few days? Unbelievable.

Do people forget how bad Lockerbie was? I mean obviously you have to give huge consideration to the people that died, their families etc. But what about the fallout that is not talked about, the damage to that community and the Policemen who were so traumatised that they had to leave their jobs, unable to cope with the trauma of finding body parts in fields. There were far reaching effects that came from Lockerbie and it is a mockery of justice that this man was released.

edam · 20/08/2009 18:43

Don't see why we have to ask 'how high?' when the Americans say 'jump'. We've landed ourselves in a whole heap of shit many times by rushing to do what the Yanks tell us.

And I think Clinton's remarks were actually aimed at a domestic audience - she had to protest to keep US voters happy.

FiveGoMadInDorset · 20/08/2009 18:46

Alot of people, including members of the ictims families are not convinced that he is guilty though.

HaggisNeepsnTatties · 20/08/2009 18:48

Dont believe he is guilty. Going home means that he drops his second appeal and in doing so, means that the government wont have to release papers that they have been trying to hide.

HolyGuacamole · 20/08/2009 18:57

Yes, true, but - he was convicted as guilty and that surely must count unless/until proved otherwise.

I am not suggesting we bow to American pressure Iraq war style, but given that a lot of Americans died in this plot, then surely the words of Clinton should be taken into consideration as representative of how some people feel about it. I am as skeptical as anyone about acting solely on the opinion of American Governments but in this case I just think it is wrong that he has been let go without any innocent verdict being given.

He had a cushy life in prison compared to others convicted of much lesser crimes.

Grandhighpoohba · 20/08/2009 19:29

Leaving aside whether he was guilty or not

He was imprisoned because he showed no compassion to his victims. If we cannot show compassion, then we have no right to lock anyone up. Without the moral highground, the state can have no authority

Saltire · 20/08/2009 20:21

""Do people forget how bad Lockerbie was?""

NO, I don't.

Thats why I think he shouldn't have been released

prettybird · 20/08/2009 20:37

Any pressure the Americans (or any other country for that matter) try to impose should be ignored. The decision should - and I beleive was - be made purely on the basis of the Scottish judicial system.

oneopinionatedmother · 20/08/2009 20:48

from what i understand, any prisoner suffering th same illness would have been releasd as the prison hospital woul dbe unable to provide appropriate care as per his right to equal treatment to a non-prisoner.

I also am dubious about his conviction, especially as some of the bereaved families campaigned for his release. If he did do it, I hope his death is painful. If not, I hop ehe gets to spend some time with his family. It all depends on the truth of the situation.

though his sufferin wouldn't make them feel any better, it would seem like karma.

Hormonesnomore · 20/08/2009 21:21

I have no problem with him being treated compassionately as a convicted prisoner who is terminally ill.

I do have a problem with him being allowed home to spend his last days at home with his family.

His victims were not allowed that privilege.

And I believe what Beckysharp said is true.

RaggedRobin · 20/08/2009 22:11

"he was convicted as guilty and that surely must count unless/until proved otherwise."

his conviction would have counted unless/until proven otherwise if he hadn't developed a terminal illness. it would have been a fairly shameful outcome if an appeal had decided that a miscarriage of justice had occurred only for megrahi to die days later. even if an appeal was not successful, as grandhigh poohba says, we can't criticise the lack of compassion shown by people who commit violent crimes, if we can't show compassion ourselves.

it's a very murky case, involving politicised (and commercial?) decisions at every step, but in its best light, i hope that kenny macaskill's decision can be seen as leading by example. there have been too many issues recently that seem to have compromised ideals of democracy and fairness in our country. it is refreshing for this request for compassion to have an outcome that seems humane.

pickyvic · 20/08/2009 22:11

i have heard several times that there is some degree of doubt as to this mans guilt? that he was used as a scapegoat so that gadaffi could start negotiations? why is it that so many of the british victims families have no problem with him being released? what do they know that we dont? i think if there is any doubt as to his guilt then its right that he is released - he was convicted on purely cirucmstantial evidence it said on the news today. id tread with care.

ilovesprouts · 20/08/2009 22:12

he should of stayed where he was ,

SoupDragon · 20/08/2009 22:47

"what about the pressure that has been laid on by the Americans in the past few days?"

What about it? They're probably just pissed off that we don't have the death penalty.

MsHighwater · 22/08/2009 00:15

More than one person has commented that, as he was convicted under Scottish law, he should have seen out his sentence in a Scottish prison - of course, this ignores the fact that his trial, being before 3 judges and no jury, was unprecedented in the Scottish judicial system. Leaving that point aside, though, it was under Scottish law that he was entitled, along with any other prisoner diagnosed with a terminal illness, to apply for compassionate release. I wholeheartedly subscribe to the view that a principle should serve in every situation. If it is right to consider release for any prisoner, it is right to consider it for any prisoner, no matter their crime.

As an afterthought, a propos of the intervention by Mrs C - I really don't think Scotland has anything to learn about the application of justice from the government of the country responsible for Abu Ghraib, Guantanamo Bay, capital punishment for juvenile and learning disabled criminals...

prettybird · 22/08/2009 15:18

Interesting letters in the (Glasgow) Herald. One pointed out how the USS Vincennes was given a heroes' welcome back for shooting down the Iranian passenger plane and the captain given medals - nobody was bothered by that.

Whie I reconginse that two wrongs don't make a right (viz the "heores" welcome for Magrahi in Libya) it does illustrate the West's (or the US's) hypocracy in this affair.

AtheneNoctua · 24/08/2009 13:23

Surely you mean that the crew were given a heros welcome in spite of having shot down IR655, and not because of having shot down a passenger plane by accident. What a horrible mistake that was. Absolutely horrible.

But, unlike Magrahi, it was a mistake. The guded missile system identified the Air Bus as an attacking war plane. I'm sure that's not a whole lot of consolation to the families of the deceased. But, it's really not comparable to someone who intentially took the lives of 270 innocent people.