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A gay couple adopted our grandchildren.. and kids think we're dead

190 replies

Notsotired · 21/06/2009 20:09

link

The heartbroken grandparents of two children adopted by a gay couple have been told they will never see them again.

Despite looking after their five-year-old grandson and four-year-old granddaughter for three years, social workers decided they were "too old" and unsuitable to continue.

And, tragically, the children now think that their grandparents are dead.

"Social workers made up their minds that we were too old," says the grandad, who is 59. His wife is just 46 and both look much younger.

"It just breaks my heart and eats away at me every day. My own grandchildren have been wrenched away and now they think that me and their granny are dead."

The children went to live with their grandparents because their mother, a heroin addict, couldn't look after them. The boy's father is dead and the girl's father has not had any contact with her.

But social workers later insisted the children would be better off with the two gay men. "My wife and I were happy bringing the children up ourselves," says the grandfather.

"We are their family. Now we've been told we'll never see them again. How can that possibly be right? They are our flesh and blood."

The children have now been given new identities and totally removed from their former life, family and friends.

The only contact their grandparents have had with the children in the last eight months is a two-paragraph letter from their new parents giving a few scraps of news about the pair.

The case provoked a storm of criticism in February when the adoption was first revealed.

The grandparents and children cannot be identified for legal reasons so we are calling the boy Adam and his sister Katie. We are calling their grandparents Brian and Margaret.

Thanks to a well-wisher, the grandparents know where the children are living, only a few miles away in an affluent area near Edinburgh.

Whenever they are in the area the grandparents find themselves staring out of their car windows in the forlorn hope of catching a glimpse of the children.

"Even if we saw them we would never approach them or do anything that would upset them," says Brian with tears welling up in his eyes. "But we can't help hoping we might see them in the distance."

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When it became clear that the children's mum was incapable of looking after them, social workers were happy for Brian and Margaret to be granted "interim parental rights".

But problems began when the mum, addled by drink and drugs, began making threats against her parents, saying she wanted her children back.

In September 2006, Brian and Margaret reluctantly suggested to social workers that Adam and Katie should stay briefly with foster parents until their daughter stopped menacing them.

Then Brian and Margaret say they found themselves under immense scrutiny from social workers who later changed their minds about their suitability to care for the children. Brian and Margaret hired solicitors to get the children back.

Four times a court ruled in their favour, but eventually, they say, they were left unable to cope with the lawyers' bills and emotional stress.

Brian claims they were then "bullied and manipulated" into eventually agreeing to the children being adopted last year - on the basis that they would still have some contact with the children.

Then, last October, they were shocked to discover that two men were adopting Adam and Katie. And in the row that has followed all access has been cut off. Margaret says: "We honestly are not bigots. It's just the practicalities which bother me. Which dad do they call dad? "How can anyone explain to a five-and a four-year-old what on earth has happened here? It's all so sad."

The gay couple have been together for eight years. They live in a smart home and lead a well-off lifestyle. They are both in their thirties and one has given up work to look after the children, taking them to school and nursery.

Before the children moved in, they got planning permission improvements to their home to accommodate the children Knowing that Adam and Katie live so close makes the agony even worse for Brian and Margaret. "It's Adam's birthday next month," says Margaret.

"I want to give him a present like any normal granny. I just want to see the kids - even if it's only twice a year, that would be better than nothing." Brian says social workers told him that the children think he and Margaret are dead because they haven't seen them since October.

"It's not surprising that they think we're dead when they haven't seen us for so long. We've been just erased from everything.

"I can't stand the thought that these kids will think we have abandoned them."

Originally Brian and Margaret say they were told they would be still be allowed contact with the children. "We would never have consented to adoption otherwise," says Brian. "But now we've been told we will never see them."

The couple are in talks with solicitors in the hope of winning some limited access, but accept the adoption cannot now be overturned.

A sympathetic businessman is paying their legal bills, but it will be a long drawn-out process. Meanwhile, a short drive away, Brian and Margaret fear Adam and Katie are starting a new life believing that Gran and Grandad are dead.

OP posts:
FabBakerGirlIsBack · 23/06/2009 17:27

Have only read the OP as it wouldn't be good for my blood pressure to read more but I wanted to say that some things don't change. My Nana was told 30 years ago she was too old to take me in.
I was sent to an abusive foster home instead.

PeachyTheRiverParrettHarlot · 23/06/2009 17:33

'I bet the social workers involved are chuffed to bits and go home each night bragging to their family (if they have one) about the children earmarked for adoption and at getting this adoption through a) to punish the grand parents for arguing back with "the authority" and b) because they can start (and continue) the social engineering experiment with people's children, knowing that the parents can't jump to the children's protection/rescue in the future.
'

You know

I really want to be a SW

I am applying next erm in fact, I can make a difference

But it's bile like that without any evidence to the fact that makes me wonder if I can hack it. NOT the job- I did siomething similar before and know I will be excellent- the uninformed opinions of people with no more info than a few quotes or hearsay.

You want to know why there are some problematic SW's? because the damned good ones will be scared off by such crap first.

PeachyTheRiverParrettHarlot · 23/06/2009 17:34

I ahve no problems with two men adopting- becuase of my experience of friendships with gay men I hope will adopt. My friend is a teacher, would make a stunning aprent and I fiormly beleive a child would be lucky to go to him.

whereeverIlaymyhat · 23/06/2009 18:23

The point is Peachy you may have no problem with it but you are not the person that matters here, please remember that if and when you are a social worker, your opinion doesn't matter, it's about the impact on the child/ren and not having a mother is a massive thing to miss out on.
So I beg you please do not let political correctness and your own agenda cloud your judgments.

PeachyTheRiverParrettHarlot · 23/06/2009 18:30

I have no agenda

I ahve no problem with the IDEA of gay people adopting

Obviosuly every case is absed on its merits and individually WITH ALL TEH INFORMATION NEEDED- that stuff we don't have here

I don't beleive there is any reason a gay couple souldn't be adopting, I do believe every case differs but yes, absolutely I beleive there are kids out there that my friends would be wonderful parents for

I probably ahevhad more contact with SS both as user and worker than most (have 2 disabled kids) so I know the downsides of SS as much as anyone BUT SW are not inherently all bad people, assuming that is bizarre and paranoid

PeachyTheRiverParrettHarlot · 23/06/2009 18:33

(BTW clearly I mistook this for a MN thread trather than a palce of work and I assumed that as a MN theread I was allowed an opinion unless patronising posters dont like it ..... SW,sare allowed opinions outside of work

whereeverIlaymyhat · 23/06/2009 18:38

SW are entitled to opinions and since you aren't one yet you can express it where ever you like, that will change if/when you do become one though.
I have a friend who is a good SW and her mother is a god awful one, neither would express any opinions on a internet forum which makes me doubt those who claim to be SW on here and other sites.

spicemonster · 23/06/2009 18:39

I am really, really shocked by the homophobia on this thread. And very saddened.

The only reason gay men have to adopt or have surrogates is because they're biologically unable to have children. That doesn't mean as far as I can see that they should be denied parenthood. How horrible to consign people to being childless because of their sexuality.

It's ironic really - on so many fertility threads on here, you always get a handful of people saying blithely 'oh why don't you just adopt?' as a great alternative to fertility treatment. But obviously that advice only applies to women. If you're a man, that's not okay.

I heard an interview the other month on the radio with a man who had adopted two children on his own. Would that have been wrong too edam? You don't think he should be allowed to adopt because he's a man?

I'm really surprised and disappointed in that attitude.

edam · 23/06/2009 19:05

Well, that's why I surrounded my post with caveats, spicemonster. Because thinking about these issues made me realise I do actually have a problem with male gay couples adopting. As you will have seen, I suggested this might be prejudice on my part. Never thought I was prejudiced against any group or minority and am a bit uncomfortable about discovering this issue feels wrong to me.

Can't quite work out whether there are real grounds for my reaction, based on the (likely) needs of (most) children, or whether it is some underlying prejudice of which I had not been aware.

Would welcome some more thought on that!

spicemonster · 23/06/2009 19:26

Yes, so you did, I apologise for not recognising that.

I don't know if I have a different perspective because of the number of gay men I know who would make brilliant dads. Or maybe it's because it was so difficult for me to become a parent.

I'm waiting for a builder to arrive so don't have a lot of time to make a considered post but there is (as I'm sure you know/suspect) no evidence to suggest that children do less well in a gay adoptive household than a straight one

baby.lovetoknow.com/wiki/Gay_Adoption

Hope to catch up with you some more later

StayFrosty · 23/06/2009 19:30

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

whereeverIlaymyhat · 23/06/2009 19:36

I do not propose to know what sort of parents gay men make however I do know having been to school with a man who was obviously gay from age 11 that they do not have an easy time of it. Not every gay man has the confidence and social ability to stand up and say their piece or defend their position.
Not every child can or even wants to defend their adoptive dads lifestyle choice, why put a kid who has already had a rocky start in life in that position where they have to fight battles they did ask for and there isn't even a biological link that might justify it ?
It strikes me that it's inviting problems into the childs life that are un necessary and potentially damaging and it's not fair.

StayFrosty · 23/06/2009 19:45

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

whereeverIlaymyhat · 23/06/2009 19:47

Hilarious as it might be for you it would not be very funny for the kids.
I have never said a word against any gay couple i've come across in real life, as long as they are good people I've no reason too, but I am an adult, children are not so discrete.

StayFrosty · 23/06/2009 19:49

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

katz · 23/06/2009 19:51

i would have no problem with my children being brought up in a same sex household, I would hope that some of the prejudices shown here are not being passed down to your children. My DD's are well aware of same sex relationships and take it all in their stride, when told that Uncle X is marrying Uncle Y the reply was cool can i be a bridesmaid.

Kimi · 23/06/2009 19:51

I just think this is so so wrong, (gay couple aside) if the grandparents have been looking after the children, if they are able to look after the children and if the children are happy with them then they should be left with their blood family.

Gay or stright those people have no right to stop those children seeing the grandparents, it is so so wrong

katz · 23/06/2009 19:53

Kimi - the grandparents weren't providing a safe environment for the children and voluntarily handed them over to SS to be place in foster care, they were happy with the adoption (with access to the children) until they discovered it would be a same sex couple then they started objected.

whereeverIlaymyhat · 23/06/2009 19:54

There is no hypocrisy on my part I would not want 2 men to adopt my children and would do everything and anything in my power to stop it happening, I appreciate I have no say in other peoples lives but can totally understand where those grandparents are coming from.
The links highlighted some issues people may feel need addressing, I do not worry they will turn the children gay or abuse them, but the facts are they are not a normal couple so it presents issues that the child/ren should not have to deal with.

katz · 23/06/2009 19:58

whereever - 'not a normal couple' what the a load of codswallop,

Kimi · 23/06/2009 19:59

Oh I see, well I think the grandparents should at least have contact.

I have a friend in a same sex marriage who is so against gay adoption, there is also a same sex couple with a child at DS2s school no one bats an eyelid at them.

I think it is a personal choice thing.
I would be happy for my children to be with my friend and her wife, but not strangers, gay or straight

PeachyTheRiverParrettHarlot · 23/06/2009 20:03

whereas

I would behappy for my boys to be adopted by gay mmen

One happens to hav declared he is gay but thats not the reason, the resaon is I would want th best aprebts possible regardless of sexual preference

LOL at doubting SW's on here , if lacking an acceptable argument try to discredit those who opose or shut them up eh?

NNever mind, there's plenty people will agree with you, sadly

katz · 23/06/2009 20:03

kimi - again this was offered but their homophobia was seen as detrimental to the sucess f the adoption so was withdrawn.

I have to say i do agree with you though Kimi, if anything were to happen i would like my children to go to friends or family, however not bothered if they were gay straight single or married

Kimi · 23/06/2009 20:09

Is this the little girl who is scared of strange men

StayFrosty · 23/06/2009 20:19

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.