Teacher action about SATs -- is there not a thread??

[lljkk]

Teachers might strike if SATs aren't dropped,
OR they might strike if they ARE dropped.

I don't want SATs to continue as they are, but don't know what to make of this mess.
Is there another thread about this? Can't believe there isn't!!?

I agree with them to a certain extent (not doing SATs at 7) but haven't we always had some sort of exam at 11 so I'm less convinced by their reasoning at that age. I do think there has to be some sort of objective testing rather than just teachers' reports and observations which are less quantifiable.

Haven't see another thread on the subject, btw.

I would be delighted if they boycotted them next yr as ds is in yr 2 next yr.

i dont remember being tested at 11 ,i remember when i was at primary school ,the kids who lived on the council estate were put in the lower bands in secondary and the those who lived elsewhere got put in the higher sets
I still dont believe in sats or the national curriculum for that matter .

The y2 SATs are very low stress ime (2 dc, including one now in y2).
But y6 SATs are dreadful, Ofsted grading depends on them & entire y6 can be focused on them.

Sady some schools Y2 SATs are not low key. Friends DS has been sent home with about 6 or 7 three page booklets with Lit/Num SATs practise to do over Easter. They have done practise SATs at school already and no doubt will do more after Easter. Wat too much, so OTT.

Primary school children, especially at 7y, do not need formal testing. Scrap them!

Y2 SATS - don't know they're taking them

Y6 - thought they were fine. A damn sight more pleasant than the 11+ and segregation that follwed. I'm quite happy with idea of some sort of test at this age, though whether SATS are appropriate I don't know. The good thing that did come from them was 'booster groups' in Y6 which really helped my dd with her maths and science - up to that point things had slipped as she was in a v bright class and it went at the pace of the fastest, so this was a chance for the 'average' to get some attention.

Agree with lalalonglegs - I'm not happy with less quantifiable teacher assessments either.

Let schools keep their own informal teacher based assessments. They work fine at primary level IMO

That's interesting Hulababy - your experience sounds complete opposite of mine. May be difference in school ethos and/or teachers?

Throughout the school there have been some teachers whose assessments I trust completely - but one or two whom I wouldn't, really.

Playing devil's advocate... why wouldn't some teachers be tempted to inflate the scores they assign, if it were all teacher assessment? How could we prevent that from ever occurring -- especially if the results were to be published in any way, which means that the whole school had an interest in getting good results?

Plus, keep in mind one union is threatening to strike if more teacher assessment is brought in, because of the extra work load.

Otherwise, why does Ofsted have to put so much stress on KS2 SATs in assigning gradings from inspections? This makes the Y6 outcome too important. Plus, for high achieving children, if Level 5 is as high as the school can record, then the school has an incentive to just let the most able children coast for Y6 and instead concentrate most resources on the least able pupils. That's not a desirable outcome, either.

I know I'm just rehashing old arguments, but what is the best way forward wrt KS2 SATs? Is there really no optimal assessment regime?

The 11+ had been scrapped in London by the time I was that age but we still had to sit tests in English, Maths and verbal reasoning (I think that was what it was called) at 11 in order for our secondary schools to have some idea of our ability. As far as I know, these sorts of tests carried on through 1980s and 1990s until KS2 was introduced and I do think they have value not just to let parents know how their children are faring but also to let the new schools have some idea about streaming the intake (at most comps I think there was still some grading on ability, don't know if that is still the case). With the pressure on teachers' performance, I would be very, very sceptical about their ability to avoid enhancing assessments. Agree that the overfocus on KS2 SATs is unacceptable and counterproductive though. Why not just scrap league tables as they have in Scotland and Wales?

PrimulaVeris My son sat in their hall on rows of tables to carry out his yr2 SATS (aged 7ys) - I was horrified to learn this and along with several other parents complained bitterly to the HT about the formality and stress at such a young age. She eventually changed the venue to the class room thereafter.

I also made a comment to his yr2 teacher about her being nervous at the possible results to which her reply was "It doesn't matter, 'cause at the end of the day I can change them to what I want anyway". FFS ! what's that all about ! What's the bloody point then?

SCRAP THEM !! they are worthless

Icandothat -
I agree - that's outrageous. At my dcs primary (and all others locally to my knowledge) it's all done in own classroom, very informally - just like doing a spelling test iykwim

Many schools do Y2 SATs in formal conditin, even when in the classroom. Even Y6 children shouldn't be subject to that.

Was a secondary teacher for nearly 10 years and felt we overtested secondary school puils - but now it has moved to primary. Shocking.

Y2 - I agree, Hulababy
Y6 - I think they should be able to do this. As well as SATS, many children this age are sitting school entrance exams or the 11+ - tremendous pressure here in many cases. But parents don't seem to complain about that?

Yes but at least entrance exams and 11+ are for the benefit of the pupils. SATs are not for individual pupil benefit but fr school league table data

Although I protested against formal testing in yr2, I am 'guilty' of putting the same ds through an 11+ exam. He was mature enough at that age to cope with it, I felt.

Are yr2 SATs results used in junior schools to get an idea of 'ability etc ? Both my ds's have been 'streamed' according to their literacy and numeracy abilities since reception.

They may be yes. However, as you say, many schools assess ability from reception without the need for formal tests - so still see no point in SATs esp at y2

lljkk - thisis how local authorities are supposed to make sure that teacher assessments are accurate.