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Ritalin and other drugs help boost brain power

98 replies

Poins · 22/12/2008 09:26

"Brain boosting drugs need not be feared www.newscientist.com/article/mg20026863.400-brainboosting-drugs-not-to-be-feared.html?DCMP=OTC-rss&n sref=online-news"

OP posts:
Poins · 22/12/2008 09:31

heres the link about Modafinil www.newscientist.com/article/mg18925391.300-get-ready-for-24hour-living.html

OP posts:
juuule · 22/12/2008 19:03

""This isn't like steroids and sports... enhancement is not a dirty word,""

Why not? And if it's okay to enhance the brain for exams etc why is it not okay to enhance the body for competitions?

AMIStletoekiss · 22/12/2008 20:00

yeah and "'using drugs in this way is not "unnatural".' er, yes it is. If they want to argue that it's a good thing for people to have better memory and concentration, they could equally argue its better to be able to run faster or lift more weight

CoteDAzur · 22/12/2008 20:04

Or dance all night without getting tired

AMIStletoekiss · 22/12/2008 20:06

or be very relaxed and mellow about life...

CoteDAzur · 22/12/2008 20:14

Or see entire cities on a blank wall

Monkeytrousers · 24/12/2008 14:07

I think it'#s a great idea. It doesn't give you brains you haven't got. It just helps you concentrate for longer, just as it helps people with adhd to concentrate. Or should people who take this for any condition have to stop taking it for exams.

Great for mothers with famlies who also want to get a degree and can only study when the kids are in bed and they are exhausted.

and if you want to dance all night too!

Nighbynight · 27/12/2008 12:24

Fine, if you want to risk being one of the few who suffers from side-effects including death.

www.ritalindeath.com/

www.medic8.com/medicines/Ritalin.html

The psychiatric drugs industry is huge, and has a vested interest in selling more of this stuff.

yeah, great, take ritalin to get better marks at university. Will you be taking it all your life, to keep boosting your performance?

Thank god, most employers don't hire people based solely on their degree result.

Monkeytrousers · 27/12/2008 19:51

"Fine, if you want to risk being one of the few who suffers from side-effects including death."

What, as many as aspirin?

Nighbynight · 27/12/2008 21:02

er well I dont take aspirin, actually.
what are your sources for that figure?

We are not discussing people taking a medicine for an illness anyway - we are discussing people trying to get better marks in tests.

Nighbynight · 27/12/2008 21:03

I knew someone who took speed so that he could work all night as well as studying all day (bit like your example of the mother, actually).

he was one of the unlucky ones, and died.

TotalChaos · 27/12/2008 21:29

what an odd story. reminds me a bit of the suggestion in the early years of Prozac that it could make you some sort of social superstar, better than the normal you.

ilovelovemydog · 27/12/2008 21:38

nighbynight - absolutely! Totally agree that psychiatric drug industry has vested interests in people taking these things as long as possible.

Monkeytrousers · 27/12/2008 22:46

But that interest doesn't disqualify any potential gain for people who would benefit from it does it?

Nighbynight · 27/12/2008 23:04

No Monkeytrousers, but it does mean that pro-drugs stuff that comes out in the press should be looked at very carefully.

VisionsOfSugarPlums · 27/12/2008 23:24

Oh great, more pressure to drug ds1.

Monkeytrousers · 28/12/2008 09:18

It's not about kids Visions, if you'd read the link you'd know that.

Nighty, what makes you think I haven't looked into it very carefully? And even then weighed up the pos and cons on the given evidence and thought, "actually, this could help a lot of people"?

stuffmyturkey · 28/12/2008 09:21

This is marketing by pharmaceutical companies, nothing more, nothing less, dressed up to look like a scientific study.

Nobody should buy this idea -- it's crap.

Monkeytrousers · 28/12/2008 12:52

Have you actually read the article SMT?

It's quite amazing how many people are prepared to trust their gut instincts - or prejudices - without reading the bloody piece.

stuffmyturkey · 28/12/2008 13:11

MT it is prejudice, I read the first article but not the second.

I suppose it's my experiences that lead me to automatically think this way, and I don't really bother to research the names involved anymore.

Despite my admission, I still wouldn't touch this stuff with a barge pole, and remain convinced that someone somewhere is trying to sell something to a lot of people.

I wouldn't call it a gut instinct though. It's previous experience, conversations with people in marketing and on the pharma side, media experiences, you know what I mean. Perhaps you have seen a different side of it to me, or are not as cynical.

Nighbynight · 28/12/2008 14:14

MT, you didn't answer the question about aspirin, so I looked at it myself. Aspirin is, it seems, pretty nasty stuff if you take it over a long period. That's why people commonly take paracetamol these days, and "an aspirin" is no longer a term for a trivial bit of medication.

Here's the info about the side effects of Ritalin, from the second link I posted:

Side effects

Common reported side effects are: difficulty sleeping (which can lead in turn to other problems); loss of appetite (thus its use as an appetite suppressant); irritability; nervousness; stomach aches; headaches; dry mouth; blurry vision; nausea; dizziness; drowsiness; motor tics or tremors. Up to 5% of children experience disturbing hallucinations often involving worms, snakes, or insects (New Scientist, 31 March 2006).

Less common side effects are: hypersensitivity; anorexia; palpitations; blood pressure and pulse changes; cardiac arrhythmia; anaemia; scalp hair loss; toxic psychosis.

There have also been reports of: abnormal liver function; cerebral arteritis; leukopaenia; death. There have been at least 19 cases of sudden death in children taking methylphenidate, leading to calls by the Drug Safety and Risk Management Advisory Committee to the FDA to require the most serious type of health warning on the label, but this advice was rejected (New Scientist 18 Feb. 2006).

Medline lists a number of side-effects of unquantified frequency.

Risk of death

As mentioned above, methylphenidate has been implicated in cases of sudden death by heart failure. The FDA decided against requiring warning labels, even though its advisory committee voted in favor of this. (bold from me)

Illicit use

.
.
American psychiatry's infatuation with the brain coincides with a drug industry more than happy to contribute funds for research that only counts symptoms and pills. If only family counseling or special education rewarded stockholders the same way Ritalin or Prozac [fluoxetine hydrochloride] does. (Diller, West J Med, Dec. 2000)

Street names for ritalin include: diet coke, kiddie cocaine, kiddie coke, vitamin R, R-ball, poor man's cocaine, rids, skittles, and smarties.
(end of quote)

I've now quoted so much from medic8 that I had better give their link again!
www.medic8.com/medicines/Ritalin.html

On the subject of the second article, do you really, honestly believe, that a wonder drug exists, that lets you re-design your life to exclude sleep?

Just the other day, I was reading a piece about how lack of sleep could harden your arteries, according to new research. Will the wonder drug protect us from these sort of effects, or will yet more drugs be required for that?

I read both the articles originally linked, and find them both extremely biased. The NS one is candy floss, based upon the nature study that is subscription only, I think, as I can't see it. The title of the nature article is hardly unbiased though: "Towards responsible use of cognitive-enhancing drugs by the healthy", ie the conclusion is in the title, that these drugs are good things.

You havent either answered my original question: it may seem like a great lark at university, to take ritalin, party all night and get good finals results.
But when you have to produce the goods, day in, day out, in a job - what then? Will you rely on the ritalin for that, too? Do you envisage taking ritalin all your life?

Monkeytrousers · 28/12/2008 15:34

Nighty, I'm not going to read your post as leactures for me doesn't begin until the new term. But I did read your first para and I'm glad you did your own research and found that one of the most useful and life saving drugs around, especially when taken chronically, i.e. aspirin, is "pretty nasty stuff". I await your insight on penicillin or even more, your list of side effects of nasty chemotherapy. Cos that's a doozey.

stuffmyturkey · 28/12/2008 15:39

MT that is SO patronising. Are you in medical research? Doesn't give anyone the right to be sneery! Guaranteed there will be someone else in the same field who will disagree with you ..

Nighbynight · 28/12/2008 15:56

I really can't take you seriously MT!

YeahBut · 28/12/2008 16:06

This sort of debate makes me so . All drugs have potential side effects. The question should be do the potential benefits outweigh the potential risks. It is not a medication to consider lightly. It does not increase your IQ. However, for many people, children and adult, ritalin is a means by which they can reacg their potential and lead normal, fulfilling lives.
In cases where there is no clinical need for ritalin to stimulate the brain into functioning properly, it has no effect.