New MMR study

[FairyMum]

Sorry, can't do link, but wanted to post this interesting link FYI:

news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/4311613.stm

TBH I don't really get about it anymore. Something died inside me when I saw the dept of health man come on after the dtp's were changed and say it had nothing to do with thimerosal and everything to do with polio. I really thought they might admit that thimerosal was likelt too have caused problems in susceptibile children. when they just out and out denied it I realised that life is too short, they're never going to admit it so whatever. Stuff the lot of them.

NYM if your friend is right, that's a huge cover-up. Is he sure about this? I guess that's a daft question, he wouldn't say it otherwise, just that it's amazing.

Jimjams, do you know anything about people who were officially accepted as vaccine damaged way before MMR was an issue? I'm thinking of people who are adults with special needs; my sister has worked with people who have vaccine-caused SN clearly marked on their medical records. I have a very vague memory that there used to be a compensation fund - wasn't there a whooping cough vaccine that damaged a lot of people a few decades ago?
I just wonder whether the way they are treated has changed as a result of the MMR row.

Jimjams are you saying thimerosal is no longer used to store the MMR vaccine? Or just not the DTP one? I don't know what the mercury contained in the MMR vaccine referred to by this producer is called, he couldn't remember. It's only my assumption that it's the same one as used to be in the DTP.

What I do feel now is that there's no point in considering single vaccines because you just can't be sure that they offer the same level of protection against the diseases; additionally there is now solid evidence that the single vaccines do not reduce the incidence of autism (whether or not it's linked to the vaccine).

Indeed, if the single vaccines are also stored in the same mercury, hypothetically isn't there an increased exposure to that mercury (ie more than one vaccination)?

I genuinely don't know the answers.

My aunt used to care for someone who was damaged by the measles vaccine- that seemed to be accepted. The whooping cough thing was always denied (still is). Someone who posts occasionally on mumnet had a sister damaged by it. Her story was rather harrowing.

There is a compensation fund-- but woefully inadequate and useless.

In the states the vaccine manufacturers have (had??? rules have changed recently) to pay a certain amount into a vaccine injury compensation fund for every shot given. The more dangerous the shot the more they have to pay. For routine jabs the most dangeorus (ie the one with the highest payment per shot) was the DTP, followed by the MMR. The DT was considerabbly safer than the DTP (can't remember the figures but it was something like 1 dollar per DTP, 7cents per DT or something). So that kind of suggests that pertussis can do damage! This fund was then used to provide compensation. I'm not sure its still up and running though, Bush did something that protected manufacturers.

AFAIK thimerosal has never been used in the MMR (as its a live vaccine). Certainly officially its never been used.

Edam. I know, it would be a huge coverup and to be honest I don't subscribe to conspiracy theories (by this government or any other).

I suppose the point is that it may not be a huge cover up if the proportion of children who are susceptible is absolutely minute relative to the number of those who are vaccinated. Obviously this is no comfort to those parents of autistic kids who suspect that vaccines may have been responsible.

For what it's worth, I will still give dd MMR, although I want to look into what I was told in more detail. If I decide need to travel to the continent to vaccinate her then I will, but to be honest I do have faith in the current vaccine (certainly above single vaccines)

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Wakefiled's suggestions on the possible link between MMR and mercury and autism

Jimjams - I'm confused - you said earlier that thimerosal was the mercury which was removed from DTP... but then you said that officially it has never been used in MMR?
So are you saying that you think it is used in MMR?

Sorry to be thick, I'm a bit knackered

and the people who do give a shit (like Wakefield- ever wondered why he is popular with parents?) are distinctly unpopular with the powers that be.

No I don't think it has- partly because I don't think you can use it in a live vaccine (think it kills the vaccine- but could be wrong on that would have to check)

actually soocci you're not completely on your own- other parents are a good support.

although having said that- it's in the flu vaccine which I think is live.....

This is really interesting to me - DS is one a month today (where did that year go?!) and will no doubt be getting a vax reminder through the post soon. I'm really unsure about the MMR for my own autoimmune reasons, but now I'm wondering if it's safer than single vaxs. Not keen on leaving DS unvaccinated - did have the DTP, albeit the second and third lots late.

If I do decide to give him the MMR, how old would people recommend he is? Am sure I don't want him to have it at a year.

Have you heard about the bird flu and no vaccination for that but a drug instead which wont be available to next year.
Sorry it's off at a tangent, just interested why?

The longer you leavbe it the more likely it is to work (especially if you had measles as a child). They used to say that post 15 momths was better (more likely to work). It leaves them open to exposure for longer but there isn't that much measles around. lots of mumps though.

Just looked at media coverage of the Danish study this guy referred to. Pretty reassuring as is today's Japanese one. Can't do links but here it is if you want to look back

news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/2410371.stm

jimjams the flu vaccine is inactivated

depends what you mean by reassuring NYM. it tells you that the MMR is safe for the majority of children- we all know that- no-one disputes it. Wrong hypothesis blah blah blah

Also Danish children didn't receive thimerosal from their DTP's (as they used DTaP)

Aha layla'smum maybe it can't be used in live jabs then.... (vaguely remembered fact)

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Jimjams, that's awful about the vaccine damage.

My mum thinks there was a File on Four programme some time ago linking MMR and mercury... anyone remember anything about this?

Is mumps dangerous for babies? I had it when I was 7 (well, for my 8th birthday - what a lovely present from my little brother!), but don't recall it being that bad? I thought it was a mild thing if you had it when you were little, but more dangerous if you were older (and male). Am I totally wrong?

I have had both measles and mumps. Don't think mumps is dangerous for girls. I thought it could be for boys and make them sterile? I remember looking very strange with swollen face so not good for vanity!
Measles not that dangerous either if healhty child I don't think. Very bad if you are a weaker child like my friend's little biy with a heart defect. I think that is why I am so pro-MMR/vaccination. These diseases can be pretty terrible for some children

You're right hunker- often mumps is symptomless in babies subclinnical). In very rare cases it can cause sterility in adult males (post puberty) but that's rare as usually only one testicle is affected.

is it just me who silently sniggers every time i see the word testicle