This is an odd one, Palins 5th child is apparantly her 17 year old daughters?

[jojosmaman]

... according to some reports in the US?

here

[Earlybird]

combustiblelemon - with all due respect, think you are far too heavy with the conspiracy theories.

I agree that news of her daughter's pregnancy was probably unexpected and perhaps caused consternation given Palin's religious and political leanings. But, really doubt they'd concoct such a convoluted story in order to release the news. It's probably nothing more 'sinister' than realising family news - whether 'good' or 'bad' - is no longer private when you're a public figure. And far better to 'release' the news of the pregnancy to the media, than to allow them to uncover it.

[msdemeanor]

fuck me, Bristol IS pregnant!

[cestlavie]

Sadly as far US politics goes, pretty much anything is fair game. The Democrat attack dogs will go after Palin as viciously as they can, and exploit every potential vulnerability they can, having learned from the Republicans and Karl Rove that those tactics can help you win the election. They have, and will do, exactly the same against Obama as well and I'd expect the Democrats to do the same.

Remember the last time? They managed to turn a John Kerry's pretty much exemplary war record (vs. a candidate who'd dodged the draft with his dad's help) into something to be used against him through the utterly spurious, vicious and downright false Swift Boat Veterans campaign.

Ironically, as far as Palin goes I suspect that one of the things they'll try to avoid training their guns on is her sex, simply because they cannot afford to piss off the legions of disaffected female Democrats who wanted to see Clinton running for office. They will, however, be perfectly happy to exploit any little story which casts doubt on her credibility as a wholesome 'soccer mom' including her family (alongside attacking her lack of experience, social conservativeness and potential mis-deeds during her time in administration).

[msdemeanor]

Dittany, I think that saying someone has lied about her daughter being pregnant (the Palin example) and accusing a politician's wife of being unfaithful are totally different accusations. You can't 'accuse' someone of not being the father of their children, but you can accuse a woman of lying to her partner and being unfaithful. Surely both are equally misogynistic? A man whose kids aren't his own hasn't done anything bad.

[Earlybird]

I find it fascinating that there seems to be the assumption that those women voters who supported Hillary will now cross over and support Palin/McCain.

There seems to be little energy given to the fact that Hillary is politically liberal, and Palin is conservative. The main things (only things?) they have in common is they're both women and both in politics.

[tiggerlovestobounce]

So does that mean its actually true that when her waters broke at 8 months pregnant with a child she knew would have additional needs she carried on with a planned speech. Then took an 8 hour plane journey (without telling the airline that she wasnt fit to fly), and then drove for an hour to a medical facility with limited resources?
And then went back to work when her baby was 3 days old?

I'm not sure that isnt worse

[msdemeanor]

Poor old Bristol. Saddled with a stupid name, her head stuffed full of godbothering nonsense, and now being hastily married off at the age of just 17.

[combustiblelemon]

Dittany, It's not because it would be the lowest blow possible. It's because a man not being the father of his own children would not mean that he had lied and his wife having cheated on him would actually gain him sympathy!

Earlybird, fair point. It's possible I've watched The West Wing once too often

[msdemeanor]

Oh, come on, it's a totally different accusation Dittany! You can't unknowingly not be the mother of your children. The accusation in the Palin case is not of not being the mother of her child, it's an accusation of lying, the same accusation that men face all the time. John Edwards has been accused very recently (and still is actually) of lying about being the father of his ex-mistress's child. Now, THAT strikes me as the same accusation. eg they are both accused of lying about a child's parenthood to save their political skin. There was no 'boys club' to save Edwards.

[laweaselmys]

If the rumours had been true and she'd done the whole baby swap thing that would have been pretty awful.

Getting forced to get married at 17 because your pregnant strikes me as even worse. Would she be so insistent that they would get married if she wasn't the potential VP? Also agree Palin's behaviour around her own pregnancy did her no favours to real feminism in my view. It's not exactly empowering to women to be expected to work through your early labour and return to work crazily soon.

At any rate the truth hasn't made me think she's any better a mother.

[laweaselmys]

... hmm. I don't know if mother is fair. I'm going to change that to person.

[MKG]

laweaselmys--Women all over the world work in fields, give birth, and go back to work soon after. My mil did it after all 12 of her births. It was either go to work, or not eat.

When I voted on the primaries I knew who my picks were. I originally said that Clinton was my candidate (I voted for her), but if she didn't get the nomination I would vote for McCain, unless Obama impressed me, which he hasn't.

[Piffle]

mccain inept.
One example
Not knowing or bothering to find out the difference between Sunni and shi'ite Muslims,while wanting to be commander in chief of the army seeking to bring peace between the two?
Google john McCain inept...
The guy is more of a loose cannon than reagan
The Way McCain talks to and about his own bankroller sorry wife speaks volumes

Why do folks in the US vote for the person not the party?
I'd never vote Tory but if labour leader was fuckwit I'd simplynot vote rather than think I'd vote for the "impressive" David cameron for example

[ByTheSea]

Firstly, dittany, I am not a misogynist, but I think Palin's ideological bent certainly is. If she has lied about this, and she still may be, then IMO it demands our attention, as do the other possible scandals in which she seems to be involved. We have had lies lies lies in the executive branch of the government for too many years now. I also still think the whole thing seems fishy, particularly the way she allegedly handled the leaking amniotic fluid and flew transcontinentally, IMO, putting herself and the baby at risk as well as anyone else who may have been involved in that flight, in the litigation-happy states. That speaks loads about her character and decision-making abilities, and it does not speak positively.

And BTW, though a long-term UK resident, I have not renounced my US citizenship and therefore I do have a vote for US president, although unfortunately it won't make much of a difference in defeating the McCain/Palin ticket as it's a New York State vote and will count as a majority vote in pretty much a die-hard blue state.

[laweaselmys]

MKG - But that is so different. Working or starving is totally different to working straight away to prove you are tough and reliable at work. Which is unfair... did you really go back to work three days after you had children because it was no problem??

Surely most women are utterly knackered and sleeping most of the time at that point. I've not given birth yet, and if it was expected as standard of me that I was to do that - purely to prove my commitment to my job, not because I would starve otherwise I couldn't do it.

[Piffle]

not saying she is fair game but slurs and delving into the lives of top politicians means that she knew her family secrets would be media dinner.
Not that it's right or wrong.
I'm happy to think she's a fruit based simply on her record!
Her kids names,pregnancies,marriages whatever are technically irrelevent unless it brings her honesty into question.

[morningpaper]

Being a geek, I love conspiracy stuff

Has someone already posted the alleged photos

[badgermonkey]

news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/7592636.stm

[msdemeanor]

Dittany, yes, she refused to pursue the bill on benefits for same sex employees, but NOT because she thought it was wrong. She AGREED with denying benefits to same sex employees, just as she hates gay marriage, but realised that it was not legally possibly to prevent equal rights on benefits because of a supreme court ruling, so just stopped spending money to fight it.

I dislike sexism as much as you do, but if you think accusing politician of lying is sexism, then men are terrible victims.
of COURSE women know which baby they are the mother of, which is precisely why the charge in Palin's case is about lying about a child's parentage. exactly the same charge as was made against John Edwards.

[spokette]

Earlybird There seems to be little energy given to the fact that Hillary is politically liberal, and Palin is conservative. The main things (only things?) they have in common is they're both women and both in politics.

Quite. Just because I am woman, it does not follow that I will automatically vote for a fellow womb incumbator.

McCain is an imbecile. When asked how many houses he had, he could not remember!

Palin's situation reminds me of the sanctimonious right who bleat on about family values, morals blah, blah, blah but who seem to forget their own dirty little secrets which they try to hide (John Major's Back to Basics springs to mind). It will be interesting to see how the moral hyprocrites that McCain and Palin represent will campaign on the issue of family values, moral integrity and single mothers!!! Ha-ha.

How long do you think this shot-gun marriage is going to last?