Obama and McCain - your thoughts/opinions on the American presidential candidates

[Earlybird]

Is Obama all charisma and no substance? Or is he a breath of fresh air politically speaking - offering hope for real change? Is he politically experienced enough to be president, or is he largely the X-Factor presidential candidate (huge momentum created by media adoration/hype but at some point the bubble will burst revealing a manufactured candidate?)

Is McCain too old, too conservative and/or too dull? All substance and no charisma - so doomed to fail with the media/public due to importance of image/soundbites? Or a man of experience and integrity who will guide the country with a steady and experienced hand?

As a Mumsnet member based in America, am curious to hear how the candidates appear to those who don't get their news through the US media. Am particularly interested atm as Obama is in the midst of his International tour.

There was no special charity or any other organisation providing maternity care for either of my sisters (I have two but there were quite a few typos in my post -- sorry). They are just poor and living in the city of Chicago. So they got whatevere care poor people living on welfare in Chicago get to. If you want to see a doctor and you can't pay for it, you just show up at the emergency room and they can't turn you away.

Private medical care here is so much more expensive and covers so much less than it does in the states. So I have the choice of the NHS (which is not exactly free) or really expesive Bupa care which I have but can't really afford to use, and it doesn't cover most things anyway. It doesn't cover maternity. And it only covers things that are curable and medically necessary. So, for example, it does not cover cancer because that is not curable. I'd rather have a system like the one in the US because at least I could afford the quality medical care there.

No, I haven't seen the documentary. Just because someone makes a propoganda film and calls it a documentary doesn't make it a truthful piece of work. Now I don't know much about this documentary, but I do wonder why if there are so many Americans without medical care I don't know any of them. I know rich people and poor people in the states. And they get medical attention when they need it. Of course I don't know everyone. But if these numbers are true, how can I not personally know anyone who is without medical attention when they need it?

I think you, like McCain, live in a parallel universe.

Spokette, I think racism goes both ways, as Underrated pointed out in her 26 July post:

If I cross the street, I am not welcome. Kids in the playground will say, "We don't like you because you are White"

I know that racism goes both ways. The difference is that the power resides and is frequently abused by the dominant race.

It is possible, you know, that people just don't support his political views. White people who don't vote for Obama might have based their vote on something other than the colour of his skin. Just as black people who don't vote for McCain might do so for some reason other than because he is white.

I think the people who talk about the race for the white house (black house? ) do more to make it racial than do the candidates. I think Americans can see beyond skin color and talk about the issues. I'm sure there racist biggots in the States (I knew a few in South), but there are many many more Americans who will vote on their political beliiefs.

"I think Americans can see beyond skin color and talk about the issues."

I really hope that is the case.

Very good point spokette.

I'm talking from the point of somebody living overseas and of course, I won't have the big picture, by a long way.

Of course, the whole point here is about media - I'm telling you what I'm hearing in the media. I think I see a different picture here in Australia than I did in the UK. The UK was very US-centric while Australia is very good at taking a global view.

Anyone care to speculate on why Jesse Jackson is a public supporter of Obama, but in a private moment accidentally caught on tape only 6 weeks ago, disparaged him in the crudest of terms?

It makes me uneasy to think that a leading public figure who logically should be one of the biggest 'cheerleaders' for Obama is extremely critical of him 'off the record'.

Probably because they are both tied to the Chicago machine.

Perhaps that is it Athene. Obama is close to accomplishing what Jackson wanted, but never could manage - so envy and/or jealousy? Or is there some other, less personal, reason?

spokette - unless I am mistaken, race became an issue in the campaign following the outrageous comments of Rev Wright. That still sits uneasily with me. Of course, Obama denounced the comments. But having sat in the congregation for 20 years, written several books with the man, and cited him as a mentor and father figure - surely those views were commonly known? And presumably tolerated, or agreed with until they became public.

Also because Obama is too much of his own man for Jackson's comfort and refuses to cowtow to the same old rhetoric that Jackson trots out time and time again. Obama Barack is looking to the future whereas imho, Jackson is stuck in the past.

Stevie Wonder's song "Pastime Paradise" sums up for me the difference between Obama and Jackson:

Jackson

They've been spending most their lives
Living in a pastime paradise
They've been spending most their lives
Living in a pastime paradise
They've been wasting most their lives
Glorifying days long gone behind
They've been wasting most their days
In remembrance of ignorance oldest praise
Tell me who of them will come to be
How many of them are you and me

Dissipation
Race Relations
Consolation
Segregation
Dispensation
Isolation
Exploitation
Mutilation
Mutations
Miscreation
Confirmation.......to the evils of the world

Obama
They've been spending most their lives
Living in a future paradise
They've been spending most their lives
Living in a future paradise
They've been looking in their minds
For the day that sorrow's gone from time
They keep telling of the day
When the Savior of love will come to stay
Tell me who of them will come to be
How many of them are you and me

Proclamation of Race Relations
Consolation
Integration
Verification of Revelations
Acclamation
World Salvation
Vibrations
Simulation
Confirmation.......to the peace of the world

Let's start living our lives
Living for the future paradise
Praise to our lives
Living for the future paradise
Shame to anyones lives
Living in a pastime paradise

Concensus from America media (both Democrat and Republican) is that Michelle Obama did well in her speech last night. Some wish she had shown more of her 'human' side and told a few more personal family anecdotes rather than the issue 'laundry list' that took up a good portion of the speech. But all agree that she is an impressive and accomplished woman.

It has also been noted that she made a real point of saying she loved the USA (as opposed to her previous comments that she rarely, if ever, had felt proud of her country).

There is also speculation about why, when she spoke of her own (and his) educations, she specifically didn't say Harvard and Princeton - but rather 'college' and 'law school'. Pundits suggest it is because the elitism of those institutions might make it difficult for many potential voters to relate to them.

Both Major and Thatcher dined out many times on the fact that they went to humble grammar schools whereas Blair and now Cameron try to downplay their privilege education. Even Cameron is sending his daughter to a state primary school, albeit in Kensington/Chelsea and CofE (ie predominantly, white middle class).

Some Democratic strategists saying the first night at the convention was a 'wasted opportunity' with exclusive focus on 'soft' advert type speeches (Michelle Obama, Ted Kennedy).

They're advising that tonight (and future nights) needs to focus on the issues - an economy teetering on recession, job loss, war in Iraq, fuel and petrol prices, housing costs and mortgage crisis, healthcare etc. Enough with the 'feel good' - we need to hear some policies and strategies! It's all well and good to say 'time for a change', but exactly how do they propose to make those changes?

Spokette - Major and Thatcher still chose to surround themselves with people who were educated at public schools.

Anyone see Hilary's speech, or excerpts of it? Thoughts?

I've got friends who are reluctantly going to vote McCain. Dh is very into the American elections, I just feel like I've been Obama'd to death.

Thoughts on the Democratic National Convention?

What did you think of Hillary Clinton's speech? Bill Clinton? Impressions of Joe Biden?

FInally, what did you think of Obama's speech? Do you think he convinced the fence-sitters he needs in order to win?

Obama's speech was, eloquent, inspiring and grounded. I found Bill Clinton's endorsement more convincing than Hillary's who is probably still smarting from defeat. Biden complements Obama with gravitas and maturity.

Next question, what about Sarah Palin? A desperate measure by McCain to grab Hillary Clinton's female voters or is it an astute move to prove to voters that he is able to change with the times?

I suspect the former and find it very cynical and patronising that he would think that many women would vote for another just because she is a woman!

I wonder if McCain has realised that he has undermined his main argument against Obama as having no experience etc because when it comes to experience, Palin is still in nappies (or should I say, diapers)!

My sentiments exactly Spokette (I'm normally a lurker here in England). I mean, what kind of Vice President would she make? If he became president and then dropped dead, could she run your country? I'm sure she's a lovely lady, but who would take her seriously as a VP? Patronising and strange.

Her experience:

In charge of the Alaskan national guard for the past two years (already trumps Obama's military experience).

Mayor of her town for 4 years,

Governor for 2 years.

She is chair of the Interstate Oil and Gas Compact Commission

She hunts and fishes.

She has 5 children her youngest born about a year ago and he has Downs Syndrome. Her oldest is going to Iraq this fall.

She is a member of the NRA and Feminists for Life.

She is in favor of ethical drilling of oil in Alaska.

Overall she seems well rounded, ambitious a good choice for a running mate.

Hillary Clinton said on Tuesday that she made 18 millions cracks in the glass ceiling and Sara Palin just burst right through it. Grant it McCain is definitely courting the female vote, but Palin also has a lot to offer on energy issues. McCain is a good candidate alone, but Obama needs Biden to be more credible.

What I find interesting is that Obama claims to be for "change", but his big "change" was having a Washington insider as a running mate. I think he could have been bolder in his choice. He made the safe choice. McCain on the other hand didn't make the safe choice (everyone though Romney was going to be the guy) instead he went with an unknown woman from Alaska.

These next few months are going to be very interesting.

I think she is an interesting choice, and an accomplished woman with a tremendous amount of potential. However, I cringe when I think about the upcoming Vice Presidential debates. I think Biden will eat her alive, but hope I am wrong.