80 year old Dog Walker murdered by 12 years olds

[Realdeal1]

Pictured: Dog walker, 80, 'kicked in neck and back by group of children in park attack' just 30 seconds from home - as three girls and two boys, aged 12 to 14, are arrested for murder | Daily Mail Online

What is happening to this world

I know. Just awful 😞

What on earth!!

Its beyond words that poor man

They need a decent sentence because they have launched a targeted attack and killed a man. Absolutely disgusting.

And the police have self reported so obviously this man was already known to the police maybe because of asb by one or more persons.

What vile little horrors, lock them up and throw away the key. There's no rehabilitating people who do this, it's a waste of time.

That poor, poor man and his family.

Jesus wept 😔 what is wrong with these feral children? Was this a racially motivated attack?

Were the kids smoking weed or drinking or something? It's hard to believe kids as young as 12 could do such a thing.

MIND YOU!

Saying that.

I do recall a few years back, walking along the street not far from where I live and there's a sort of paved section that's very wide that opens up into a courtyard. The council along with some local residents had planted a small bed of flowers, including Lavender, daisies, geraniums, etc with a small crab apple tree in the centre.

So I'm walking past and two boys looking to be around 10 - 12 are running around cussing each other and playing rough tag and door to their house is open but no adults outside. That was fine, but then they ran right over and jumped up into the raised bed and were trampling down the newly planted flowers that people had taken so much time to plant so I said, 'hey guys, watch out for the flowers, you're breaking them'

Who told me to open my mouth?

I got an earful of nasty adult-level verbal abuse, told to do crass things to my mother. One of them - the rudest - deliberately kicked one the flowers and then jumped up and down on it and told me, he'd do what he wants and I can come and try stop him then.

I said 'Your mum must be proud, I wonder what she'd say if I told her the things you're saying to me'

To which, of course I got an arm pointing to the house with the open front door and told to go on and try if I'm brave, because his mum don't care. 'Please come' was his reply.

You know what I had a sinking feeling because I knew, I KNEW he was right and I'd be abused again or worse. And I was being verbally abused by kids young enough to be my grandchildren.

I was actually disturbed. I remember my childhood. If one neighbour had complained about me it would have been game over for me. But not now. Times are rough.

So you maybe this isn't so surprising after all. However I stil think drugs may be involved in some way.

That poor man. Thinking of him and his loved ones. I have no words really xx

I would also jail their parents- no decently raised kid would dream of doing anything like this. There is absolutely no excuse.

At this stage the children are innocent until proven guilty. The police have released four of them and are now only holding a 14-year-old boy.

I'm so saddened by this 🥺 it's just terrible.

I would also jail their parents- no decently raised kid would dream of doing anything like this. There is absolutely no excuse.

this is a Western liberal democracy.

you can’t just lock up people who haven’t been convicted of a crime.

Ethan Crumbley’s parents were imprisoned for his abhorrent crime. Maybe this is the only way we can get substandard parents to step up and actually parent their children.

I am a teacher in a low SES school. 95% of the students in my class have parents who
just don’t give a f**k about their child, their child’s education or their child’s behaviour. Yet will still defend their child’s actions. What message is that sending to the children? It’s about time parents accept responsibility.

I’ll elaborate on this. 3 of my students set an empty house alight during the Easter school holidays. The parents told the police that their children did it “because they’re bored and there’s nothing for them to do”. No parent would accept it was even remotely wrong for their 9 year old sons to be roaming the streets at 2 in the morning or burning someone’s home to the ground. Parents (some, thankfully not all) seem to quick to find excuses for their child’s behaviour rather than actually parent their children…

Decently raised kids seldom do things like this. If they do, they’re more likely to show remorse. Decent parents wouldn’t defend their child’s illegal behaviour.

There was a couple in Michigan, America who were recently jailed after their son went on a high school shooting rampage. Though I confess I don't know all the details, they were convicted to 10 - 15 years each for not taking action and being blase over prior warning signs regarding their sons mental health. The whole family is now in jail. Both parents already spent 2 1/2 years in prison before sentencing and both have another 7 1/2 years to go before being considered for release.

The question is should more parents be found culpable for not taking action if information has been brought to them about their child's anti-social behaviour previously (police, school) and they have not taken action to correct or support the child before they go on to commit a serious crime?

It's a legitimate question, though an uncomfortable one.

X posted

It sounds like he has previously reported concerns to the police, perhaps, and nothing (or not enough) was done.

Horrible, horrible case.

Ethan Crumbleys parents gave him the gun he used to kill with and failed to supervise him with it. That's a whole world of difference from this kind of case.

This is horrific and it may be the parents of the children involved are at fault, but you can't prosecute someone if they havn't committed a crime.

They were not convicted for that. They lived in a very pro-gun state where convicting for supplying a gun would be seen as an infringement on gun ownership rights (crazy, but that's some parts of America for you).

There weren't even any 'safe storage' gun laws in that county at the time. Even buying him a gun in their name wasn't strictly illegal. Other children have killed when parents haven't secured guns properly, and they haven't been charged.

Instead, they were convicted under the same laws businesses responsible for negligence over accidents they they could have foreseen are sued for. They didn't pay attention to warning signs about their son's mental health and behaviour even when the school alerted them.

Judge summing up did not mention the gun but their failure to intervene and help their son.

*that they

That’s not true, why are you making things up to suit your narrative? They were convicted because they ignored signs of his deteriorating mental health, where he expressed he wanted to hurt and kill others.

They failed their duty as a parent and innocent people died.

The parents of these young children have failed their children, and an innocent man has died.

I am a parent to four children (though two are adults now), I am responsible for them. It is my duty as a parent to know where they are, ensure they are aware of right and wrong, and to ensure they receive adequate consequences if they make poor choices. But these kids didn’t make a poor choice, they murdered a man, who was just walking his dog. They knew what they were doing was wrong, but I suspect like many kids these days, their parents have always found excuses for and defended their children, so the kids get away with more and more. It escalates and then something like this happens. As someone pointed out up thread, “good parents” don’t have young children who murder people. The parents need to be held accountable in some respect, whether that be parenting classes, having other children removed, prison or something…

This is absolutely horrifying.

Hopefully the investigation will find out exactly what happened.

It is possible that that parents were aware of, and had flagged issues with their child's behaviour. If so, it is unlikely that they would have received any help unfortunately. We just don't know, it's all speculation atm.

It's a fair point to query whether parents could be prosecuted. Current legislation might not permit this but laws can be changed.

Failing to have proper control over your dog is an offence. If your dog escapes from your garden and attacks someone - you might be liable, whether you were present with your dog at the time or not.
Could failing to have proper control over a child be an offence?
Like any offence there would be defences, mitigations etc.

The difficulty is the laws want it both ways - children don't have the same rights as adults. A parent or guardian is afforded certain rights on behalf of the child.
Its difficult to then take the line that children are entirely responsible for their own actions.