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Original poster

The olympic torch and pro Tibet protests

90 replies

tinylady · 06/04/2008 13:42

I think it is fantastic that their voices have been heard

OP posts:
southeastastra · 06/04/2008 23:01

athletes have made an impact though, look at the 1936 olympics

Panino · 06/04/2008 23:02

kitten - countries can't impose sanctions. China is too big, and we rely on them for business. Which is why they got the Games in he first place.

We take the Chinese yen, then bitch about it afterwards. Bollocks.

wannaBe · 06/04/2008 23:04

but at what cost. There's no way our team should be withdrawn or be expected to withdraw. Because the next olympics will be here. And what impact will that have?

I agree the government should be imposing sanctions but the repercussions of this are twofold:

  1. imposing sanctions also affects the people on the ground, the chinese people who didn't ask for or contribute to their government's human rights policies in tibet. Is it fair to penalize the people for something they do not have the power to change?
  1. China is one of the few countries with the power to hit back hard at the countries that might see fit to impose such sanctions. Would we want to go to war with china? It's not like iraq where they can't match the strength of the US forces, they have the power.
Panino · 06/04/2008 23:09

yes, wannabe..we "invaded" the Falklands..but gave away Hong Kong...why on earth didn't we declare war on China??

malovitt · 06/04/2008 23:09

I think we take their yuan not their yen.

southeastastra · 06/04/2008 23:10

all the world's eyes will be on them during the games so will raise awareness. don't suppose that many people were interested in the country to start with.

won't worry about ww3 with china yet though

wannaBe · 06/04/2008 23:10

maybe because they have the power to fight back?

Panino · 06/04/2008 23:12

or..or..indeed their yuan...oops!

Panino · 06/04/2008 23:12

or..or..indeed their yuan...oops!

OhYouBadBadKitten · 06/04/2008 23:18

You know Panino and WannaBe - you are both right. Our government can't/won't impose sanctions - our economy is so dependent on China and they could, if they wanted, hit us hard in various ways. Thats why its down to us, just ordinary us to say in any way we can 'we don't agree, we can't condone what you are doing'

You might think that it makes no difference. But it does, sometimes its jolly slow. But we all remember Tienaman square and thats an image so many chinese protesters will hold in their heads. I think - I hope one day it will come to fruition.

In the States - Those who protested against the Iraq war are now finding that their voice is powerful in the Obama campaign. It can't change what has been done but perhaps it can change what will be done.

We can all sit back or, one by one we can all stand up and say 'Its not good enough, I want it to be different'. And then, eventually, perhaps it might be different.

And on that mini speech I'm off to bed. Sleep well all.

Panino · 06/04/2008 23:24

kitten - I'm not as cynical as it may appear. Do have quite a history re demonstrations, and they DO make a difference, for the reason(s) you say..I'm just sceptical re the impact that this protest will ahve. Sorry.

southeastastra · 06/04/2008 23:30

it will take time and the chinese are an intelligent society, now that most of them can get access to the internet things will change for the better hopefully.

the olympics in beijing have come up at a opportune moment

Pennies · 07/04/2008 10:42

What a shambles. And why were the Chinese bodygaurds all dressed up as Smurfs?

marina · 07/04/2008 10:49

Agree with everyone here (fab post Geek3, thanks) who is glad that the protests yesterday made it impossible for the Chinese Government to show footage of London without it being clear what many of us feel about the Tibetan situation.
Of course it is an international athletics competition but the Chinese have been overtly showcasing their country, lifestyle and policies in the run-up to Beijing, just as ALL host nations of the Olympic Games do. For the competitors it should be about universal ideals of brotherhood and harmony, but for the governments it IS a propaganda opportunity and always has been in the modern era.
I think I love the Mayor of Paris - have you seen what he has planned? Peaceful and to the point. I'm not comfortable with scuffles and violent clashes personally.

Original poster
tinylady · 07/04/2008 11:39

Bump

OP posts:
Original poster
tinylady · 07/04/2008 12:18

Some updates
news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/7333955.stm

OP posts:
geek3 · 07/04/2008 13:46

With regards to the Chinese people having accesss to the internet - sadly, like all media in China, it is heavily censored. For example the BBC news website was blocked recently in China to stop people seeing the reporting on the negative reactions.

southeastastra · 07/04/2008 13:49

oh i thought i'd seen a programme where some could add a 'thing' to their pc's that overrides the censorship. may have got it wrong.

TwoIfBySea · 07/04/2008 14:34

I don't have time, sadly to read all the posts so forgive me if this has already been stated...

But wasn't the time to protest when China was actually given the Olympics. Bit of a door-shut-horse-bolted scenario going on now and yesterday was just a farce that soured it all.

What am I saying, I hate sports anyway, but I feel sorry for people for whom this Olympics is their only chance to shine and you get that happening. Will we have Iraq and Afghan protestors when London host?

edam · 07/04/2008 14:36

had a chuckle at the copper on Today this morning, who admitted he was treating the people protesting about Tibet as 'protestors' who had to be corralled and controlled, but the people who were protesting in favour of China as ordinary members of the public entitled to go about their business.

Shouldn't be surprised, I suppose, the police always defend the powerful against the ordinary people (disclaimer - the police as a force, not every single individual copper).

tiredemma · 07/04/2008 14:38

I agree with Twoifbysea. Surely the time to protest to this extent was when China was narrowed down to host the Games???

A family members partner has been selected to represent GB in the paralympics, an opportunity which he should be overjoyed at receiving- he is undecided whether he should attend- how many young people get the opportunity to represent their country?

marina · 07/04/2008 14:41

TwoIfBySea, the recent escalation of violence in Tibet has occurred some time after China was awarded the Games. But China has certainly occupied and ruled Tibet against the wishes of the ethnic Tibetan population for many years, centuries in fact. The Tibetans have been trying to initiate a peaceful diplomatic solution for about...sixty years now, I think?

marina · 07/04/2008 14:43

tiredemma, I am very concerned about the situation in Tibet but personally I think the athletes who have trained hard should go to Beijing if they wish to. Unless there is a British boycott of the Games, and I doubt there will be.
I think the protesters are angry with the Chinese government, not with the competitors.

OrmIrian · 07/04/2008 14:43

"Surely the time to protest " is whenever the opportunity arises. Protests are about drawing attention to something that needs attention. Everyone was looking. Everyone saw what happened. And it isn't possible to ignore the reasons for the protests. So it was worthwhile.

tiredemma · 07/04/2008 14:45

So do you think then that those who do choose to go wont be persecuted for doing so? ( He is a lovely chap who has done fatastically well, he really is torn whether to go or not)

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