Current Embryology debate, wondered what the general opinion was...

[Hopeyseggwasntbig]

bbc news link

I cannot see there being a situation where we'll end up cloning humans, is the negativity about this debate histeria? I truly hope that one day a cure for a dreadful disease is found as a result of this research.

Apparently one of the criticisms is about the research done on animal eggs, suggesting that the egg is an embryo. But unfertilized eggs are being used. Isn't an embryo a fertilized egg?

I, on a personal level, would love to see a cure for paralysis. I am totally for this research.

I am in the 'not sure but very dubious' camp. I actually can see cloning of humans becoming a reality - it is already being done to replace dead pets in the US. I can see the benefits (my mother has MS, lost very good friend to cancer etc etc), but surely if we eradicate all illness we also need to have some pretty stringent population controls in place too?

Calli I'm with you in the camp.

Tis messin' with nature & I don't like it!

The thing that worries me about all these new advances is that if one good/ethical scientist is allowed to do it for the human good, there'll be some sick bastard doing horrible/unethical/unnatural things for money using the same knowledge.

to be honest I think most people don't know much about this very complex subject (I know I don't and I've had IVF so I do know a little bit about embryos)

It's a moral minefield really.

i'm with you, Callisto and bossybritches.

Message withdrawn

I'm for it.

Correct me if I'm wrong on this, but I believe the only reason why they are suggesting animal eggs for stem cell research is because the very same religious moral objectionists say using human fetuses would be 'murder'

They intend to take an animal egg, destroy its DNA by radiation etc, insert human DNA (diploid, rather than half-set like in sperm), zap it with electricity to get it dividing, and voila you have lots of stem cells.

Usually on the side of science (though I never understand it I smile and nod politely) this time I have to say the concept makes me uneasy.

I think it is a very dangerous path to go down.

To misquote the Chaos mathematician in Jurassic Park (yes really, stay with me here..)

"You were so busy wondering if you could you never stopped to ask if you should."

My brother has Parkinson's disease and so I am in favour of stem cell research as looks like there may be breakthrough in treatment of it.

I think people who have lost a loved one to something like Alzheimer's or Parkinsons, and watched them suffer a long, painful and humiliating decline towards certain death, may have a different take on this. I'm all for it. There have always been moral oppositions to the progress of science. This is no different. I agree with CoteD'Azur.

My mother has terminal MS (just as shite as Alzheimer's etc) but I still don't think that this is necessarily a good idea. Also stem cells can be harvested from the patients bone marrow as far as I was aware so is this research really necessary?

i stayed with you twbs and nicely put

it doesnt seem right to do this and also gives the green light to more of this to be acceptable
i dont think it is acceptable or good thing
but no expert

I find it amazing that people think this will not eventually lead to cloning humans. Of course it will - science being science, someone will eventually do it on the quiet, then it will move to mainstream. And it will probably be in my lifetime. It was not that long ago that Dolly the sheep was cloned.

Personally I think it is a slippery slope that I do not want us to step onto. Humans and animals are not supposed to pro-create - therefore in my eyes this should not be happening. imho

i asked my dad how he felt about this.

he's nearly 72 and has heart disease and hypertension

he sighed and thought a bit.

he said, 'i'm not for it.'

i asked him why, seeing as it was for research into disease that mostly affect older people like himself.

he said, 'something's got to kill us all, EIS.'

am for it

this is not about cloning humans, it is about generating a ready source of stem cells for medical research without using human embryos, as cotedazur said in her post

the 'embryos' created will not go beyond the 14-day stage and will essentially still be balls of cells

and I could be wrong but I don't think harvesting people's bone marrow is a very practical way of getting a sufficient quantity of material to work on (I can't see anyone volunteering for the op for a start)

a lot of modern medicine involves messing with nature

I agree with CatIsSleepy.

What if a cure for paralysis was found, surely this benefit to 1000s of people would outweigh any risk of an unscrupulous 'scientist' attempting to clone a human. My DH has suffered a paralysis to his right arm after a hit and run just over a yr ago, if this research provided some sort of stem cell cure for this paralysis that would be amazing. Poor Christopher Reeve was fundraising for research in this area but had to deal with so many obstacles inc George Bush because of his religious views etc.

If the argument that a cure shouldn't be found -for the diseases this research is intended for- because of the risk of a population explosion, why research cures/treatments for cancer, heart disease, asthma etc?

It's an empty animal egg that stem cells are being grown in. The egg is not fertilized at all, there is no way and unfertilized egg is going to grow into an animal or human.

You can't stop man's curiosity or scientific progress. you can try to stall it but ultimately if we can do something, we will, IMO. God, we've done so much worse [nuclear weapons for example]

As far as the idea 'something has to kill us' I would love dementia and parkinsons to have just killed my mother. Instead it took away her dignity, her independence, filled her life with fear and horror for 20 years and made her suffer in a way nobody deserves. So it is not quite that simple.

ruty

i'M TOTALLY IN FAVOUR OF THIS RESEARCH.

I hate the way they keep saying that it is an animal human hybrid. It is not!!

It is a mouse ovum with the mouse dna removed and one human cell injected in to it. Then it's 'shocked' to make the cell start to divide!

It is never going to grow into half mouse half human!! The mouse ovum shell is purely a means to allow the human dna cells to multiply a few times and to obtain stem cells!!!

There is really nothing to object to. I can not understand why anybody (who knows the facts) would object.

Agree ruty.

It is an incredibly emotive subject; on one side people backing it as have seen loved ones suffer whilst others object for religious or moral reasons.

Probably before my brother was diagnosed with Parkinson's (at the age of forty) I would have been reluctant to support it so enthusiastically.

I mean I hate the way the media keep reporting it as half mouse half human, just to make people feel more strongly against the project. It's too sensational.

Our skin cells are falling off us every second. A spec of your dandruff could be used to obtain stem cells (in the right circumstances).

As a healthy adult with the use of all my limbs I would not presume to stand in the way of this research. Moaning about messing with science. Ivf and and heart surgery!?!?!?!?!?!

Yes MadameCholet - it has been reported in the media with such sensationalism, as if it is the beginning of real human animal hybrids. As has been explained here that isn't the case at all.

I'm for it. For all reasons above (making dinner so won't elaborate on my own behalf!). Find the level of alarm a bit hysterical and largely based on misunderstandings/ignorance.

Well said MadamCh0let

PotPourri - In your opinion, what does this proposal have to do with whether or not humans eventually get cloned?

The opening post mentioned it, and the fact that such developments will eventually lead to it. I think people are kidding themselves if they think it won't. ANd I am NOT cool with cloning humans.

I understand the science behind the proposals, and that they are not growing a fully formed mouse-human. But I still do not agree with it.

MadamCholet made a valid point about messing with science... but the most valid point on here I believe is the quote about being so busy wondering if we can do it, without stopping to think whether we should. It's a slipperly slope.