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Original poster

WTF Rishi Sunak abolishes Alevels

101 replies

Icedlatteplease · 04/10/2023 20:01

Just what our kids need!!!.

It's hard enough to get maths teachers to GCSE let alone A levels. Most kids get the maths they need for day to day live by the start of secondary. Forcing kids who hate maths to remain in classrooms longer than they already need is wasting resources that could be better used on kids who actually want to do the subject

It's an absolute Joke. First time in my life I'll be voting Labour

OP posts:
Canisaysomething · 04/10/2023 21:25

What piece of veg do we think will out live Rishi? He’s got to go.

Finteq · 04/10/2023 21:26

Icedlatteplease · 04/10/2023 21:17

See I hate this. Failing GCSE maths absolutely does not mean you fail maths.

In real life you can use a calculator for anything maths related. Noone cares if you can't remember the seven times table because you can use a calculator. If you want to know the area of a circle with diameter whatever, you put the question into Google and it will give you the answer. Same for pythagorus and trig.

The way we study gcse maths is completely irrelevant to modern life. You can absolutely do maths and fail GCSE

Although its interesting you mention SEN. Actually the lower sets are often packed full of both diagnosed or undiagnosed SEN. Often kids with ADHD ( diagnosed or undiagnosed) who absolutely can do maths and are actually quite good but find everything about a traditional classroom impossible. Improving SEN intervention especially for dyscalcula would do wonders.

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Even if you have use of a calculator you need to know how to use it.

When shopping you need to know of £5 per kilogram is cheaper or more expensive the 45p/100g. Although a lot of products have price per ml or g, a lot of the time they mix units so its price kg for some products and then price per grams. Or price per 100ml or price per litre.

iIs buying 3 single peppers at 59p each is better value than if buying a 3pack for £1.70.

Is buying a 3 for 2 offer at £2 per 400g of cereal cheaper than buying one big box of 750g at £3. ( You cant just check the label to find the price per 100g cos it doesnt take the offer into account).

Even if you have a calculator if you don't know how to convert the different units you've got no chance. Maths isn't just knowing how to use a calculator to work out 8x7.

And that's just in a supermarket.

Needmorelego · 04/10/2023 21:28

@Icedlatteplease I really hate teens being told they have "failed" maths if they get below grade 4 (or is it 5?). They haven't failed at all - it's a cruel lie they are told.

Original poster
Icedlatteplease · 04/10/2023 21:30

JustAMinutePleass · 04/10/2023 21:10

Seeing it already. As manual jobs get replaced with AI more data analysts and data scientists are being hired to ensure the algorithms are working properly. As nobody builds AI algorithms (you buy them) you check their performance through data. For the work currently required as a data analyst you need, as a minimum, A Level maths.

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We do not have the maths teachers. We do not have the maths teachers to teach to GCSE. If you can teach to A Level you can earn way more doing maths so it will be even harder to get enough teachers.

We are losing potential data analysts and maths teachers because Actually we need more middle of the road kids going into maths. The exact kids we are losing by insufficient teaching resources at GCSE.

Actually arguably we need more builders plumbers electricians proper practical trades. The loss at this level to AI has already happened. AI is going to hit anything maths/data related in the next 10 years. Computers simply can do it better. In the trade based subjects we are already starting to see tutor shortages (same problem if you can do it you earn more doing than teaching). We need kids in the workplace earlier not later

OP posts:
Hmmph · 04/10/2023 21:38

I believe that Maths in the most.popular A Level choice. I am not sure we need to force more kids to do it.

Also wasn't it the Tories who go rid of AS Levels...?

And I agree about apprenticeships. I looked at Degree level ones, and there are far too few in far too limited areas.

Original poster
Icedlatteplease · 04/10/2023 21:39

Finteq · 04/10/2023 21:26

Even if you have use of a calculator you need to know how to use it.

When shopping you need to know of £5 per kilogram is cheaper or more expensive the 45p/100g. Although a lot of products have price per ml or g, a lot of the time they mix units so its price kg for some products and then price per grams. Or price per 100ml or price per litre.

iIs buying 3 single peppers at 59p each is better value than if buying a 3pack for £1.70.

Is buying a 3 for 2 offer at £2 per 400g of cereal cheaper than buying one big box of 750g at £3. ( You cant just check the label to find the price per 100g cos it doesnt take the offer into account).

Even if you have a calculator if you don't know how to convert the different units you've got no chance. Maths isn't just knowing how to use a calculator to work out 8x7.

And that's just in a supermarket.

Edited
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Most kids can use a calculator out of primary. 🙄🙄🙄

If seen kids who struggle and fail to do this kind of sum in the classroom, do it instinctively in real world applications. It's way easier and less prone to human error to use a unit converter on Google that it is to convert manually

Believe me kids who score 1s and 2s if doing a gcse maths paper independently can easily do a far significantly higher proportion of the paper by typing the maths question into Google (some kids can even just take a picture of the question).

Terror of maths is a far bigger problem than latent maths ability

Meanwhile we tell kids that failing to learning their times tables will mean they Will never be good at maths....

It's beyond shit

OP posts:
Piggywaspushed · 04/10/2023 21:39

I've just worked out how we abbreviate this.

It's A BS qualification.

Sure is.

Original poster
Icedlatteplease · 04/10/2023 21:41

Piggywaspushed · 04/10/2023 21:39

I've just worked out how we abbreviate this.

It's A BS qualification.

Sure is.

Omg how did they miss that!!

OP posts:
Original poster
Icedlatteplease · 04/10/2023 21:45

Needmorelego · 04/10/2023 21:28

@Icedlatteplease I really hate teens being told they have "failed" maths if they get below grade 4 (or is it 5?). They haven't failed at all - it's a cruel lie they are told.

I seriously hate this too.

I seriously hate we limit kids chances to succeed because they don't get some nebulous grade in something that they will possibly never use, and certainly never use without calculators/computers being able to do the hard graft.

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DynamicK · 04/10/2023 21:47

Bendysnap · 04/10/2023 20:34

Spending two years doing just three subjects (or even four) is ridiculous - the rest of the world has moved on from such an insane system where you need to narrow down your interests aged just 16.

I agree with this. Ridiculous that kids choices are narrowed down at 16. Many of them don't know what they want to do then end up doing foundation years 2 yrs later to change path.

Finteq · 04/10/2023 21:50

All I know is I loved Maths and chose it at A Level.

But I hated English. And was so glad I didn't have to do that crap anymore. If I had been forced to do another 2 years- it would have been really demoralising.

Boomboom22 · 04/10/2023 21:51

I do disagree that any kids with a 6 or above need to do maths in context, they should already be ok with this level of maths. 5 or below yes that would be a good minor maths option. Really they just mean slightly reduced a level content with 3 a levels and 2 as levels. It is not a new qual at all.

Titsywoo · 04/10/2023 21:51

Icedlatteplease · 04/10/2023 21:02

Yes me too.

DD(17) wants to work, she hates the idea of student loan debt, and has ADHD so really finds in class study a real challenge.

But at predicted a's and bs finding apprenticeships of an equivalent standard bloody impossible.

All I can do to persuade her not to drop out and work her weekend job indefinitely.

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Yes this is the issue. DS is highly intelligent but was fed up with the education system and wanted to get out there and work. Apprenticeships are not set up for people who are already highly skilled - DS could easily have gone straight to level 4 (or above) but they wouldn't allow it. The training provider said DS has to complete the course in a minimum of one year and one day - we asked is that because you get more money and they said yes. It's shameful.

Boomboom22 · 04/10/2023 21:53

You can def go straight on to a degree apprenticeship from a levels, I have students who have done this. Very competitive!

Boomboom22 · 04/10/2023 21:53

As in apply in year 12 Jan onwards to start in July of year 13.

Original poster
Icedlatteplease · 04/10/2023 21:57

Boomboom22 · 04/10/2023 21:53

You can def go straight on to a degree apprenticeship from a levels, I have students who have done this. Very competitive!

Where do you find them because we have looked and have no idea.

OP posts:
Qilin · 04/10/2023 21:58

Bendysnap · 04/10/2023 20:34

Spending two years doing just three subjects (or even four) is ridiculous - the rest of the world has moved on from such an insane system where you need to narrow down your interests aged just 16.

Based in the fact that this new system is based in 5 subjects, but everyone has to include English and Maths - for many students it's still only 3. But likely at a lower level than A level currently, because even with a few extra hours - they simply won't be able to fit it in 5 subjects to the same standard.

And goodness knows where the extra teachers will come from. Many schools can't staff the current subjects, even at gcse and ks3 level, let along at sixth form!

Shouldistayorshouldi · 04/10/2023 22:02

Glad they’re getting rid of the ridiculous, draconian things. Not a fan of sunak or tories in general but some excellent points made today RE 20mph roads, sex being biological, and scrapping a levels

Original poster
Icedlatteplease · 04/10/2023 22:04

Qilin · 04/10/2023 21:58

Based in the fact that this new system is based in 5 subjects, but everyone has to include English and Maths - for many students it's still only 3. But likely at a lower level than A level currently, because even with a few extra hours - they simply won't be able to fit it in 5 subjects to the same standard.

And goodness knows where the extra teachers will come from. Many schools can't staff the current subjects, even at gcse and ks3 level, let along at sixth form!

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Yes exactly this

OP posts:
WrongSwanson · 04/10/2023 22:07

Piggywaspushed · 04/10/2023 21:39

I've just worked out how we abbreviate this.

It's A BS qualification.

Sure is.

I think this just underlines how much the Tories are using their dying days to wind everyone up while they slash and burn tbh

Boomboom22 · 04/10/2023 22:12

They are not scrapping anything, it is a rebrand of a and t levels with 2 as levels.
Much like the ebacc at gcse just means taking 5 specific gcses from a bucket.

Mustreadabook · 04/10/2023 22:13

Bendysnap · 04/10/2023 20:34

Spending two years doing just three subjects (or even four) is ridiculous - the rest of the world has moved on from such an insane system where you need to narrow down your interests aged just 16.

But if there are 5 subjects and 2 of them - english and maths - are compulsory, then you are still only studying 3 subjects that you want to. If you can't read, write and math to a sufficient level after 12 years of school, and you don't want to, I doubt that 2 more years will help.

Sodullincomparison · 04/10/2023 22:14

I’m happy to bet that this won’t happen.

  1. money for training all teachers to deliver this before?
  2. who will be designing a new assessment system? Some ministers are very close to some examining boards.
  3. accreditation for schools to deliver this?
  4. where will all the maths teachers come from?

i could write this all day. Just wondering why anyone with an educational brain thought that this was a current priority in
the current educational climate.

oh dear oh dear.

Original poster
Icedlatteplease · 04/10/2023 22:15

Boomboom22 · 04/10/2023 22:12

They are not scrapping anything, it is a rebrand of a and t levels with 2 as levels.
Much like the ebacc at gcse just means taking 5 specific gcses from a bucket.

That still doesn't answer what exactly will be on the curriculum for those who are already in the position of retaking gcse.

Or who will teach it. Just another headache for college attendance

OP posts:
Original poster
Icedlatteplease · 04/10/2023 22:16

Sodullincomparison · 04/10/2023 22:14

I’m happy to bet that this won’t happen.

  1. money for training all teachers to deliver this before?
  2. who will be designing a new assessment system? Some ministers are very close to some examining boards.
  3. accreditation for schools to deliver this?
  4. where will all the maths teachers come from?

i could write this all day. Just wondering why anyone with an educational brain thought that this was a current priority in
the current educational climate.

oh dear oh dear.

Exactly this

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