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Chris Kaba

291 replies

RaceWithChyna · 22/09/2023 20:49

The police officer who shot Chris Kaba has finally been charged with murder. It took a while after investigations had to be held but I’m glad the CPS decided to charge the anonymous police officer.

Before people start, yes he’d been in jail. Yes, he’d apparently drove towards officers at an attempt to get away. None of this means he deserved to be killed with an immediate head shot. To make matters worse, he wasn’t even the person they were after. They only realised it was someone else after the fact that he was dead.

I hope the family get the justice that they deserve.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-66865099.amp

Photo showing a smiling Chris Kaba.

Met officer to be charged with murder of Chris Kaba - BBC News

The 24-year-old was shot dead during a police operation in south London on 5 September 2022.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-66865099.amp

OP posts:
Thread gallery
15
qunari · 05/03/2024 14:26

CagneyAndLazy · 05/03/2024 14:20

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-68441013

Well no surprises here.

Exactly as we knew/suspected.

What has that got to do with Chris Kaba?

CagneyAndLazy · 05/03/2024 14:51

qunari · 05/03/2024 14:26

What has that got to do with Chris Kaba?

There are other links to the case I posted if you Google.

Sorry but I'm being vague for a reason. Please ignore if it makes no sense.

qunari · 05/03/2024 15:09

CagneyAndLazy · 05/03/2024 14:51

There are other links to the case I posted if you Google.

Sorry but I'm being vague for a reason. Please ignore if it makes no sense.

Edited

Vague for a reason? WTF is even the point of posting then? 🤔

CagneyAndLazy · 05/03/2024 15:16

qunari · 05/03/2024 15:09

Vague for a reason? WTF is even the point of posting then? 🤔

As I said, ignore if it makes no sense to you. It will be obvious to others, including the reason for it being vague.

Enjoy your day.

prh47bridge · 05/03/2024 15:17

I have no idea why the poster is being vague.

The men who have been convicted were accused of plotting to murder Brendon Malutshi with Chris Kaba. Of course, the fact they have been convicted does not mean Kaba was guilty - he wasn't on trial. Even if he was guilty of this offence, that does not mean the police officer who shot him was not guilty of murder.

qunari · 05/03/2024 15:31

prh47bridge · 05/03/2024 15:17

I have no idea why the poster is being vague.

The men who have been convicted were accused of plotting to murder Brendon Malutshi with Chris Kaba. Of course, the fact they have been convicted does not mean Kaba was guilty - he wasn't on trial. Even if he was guilty of this offence, that does not mean the police officer who shot him was not guilty of murder.

@CagneyAndLazy why not just say that?

24HoursFromTulseHillEstate · 05/03/2024 17:30

Kaba was the suspect gun man.

prh47bridge · 05/03/2024 19:18

Even if he was the suspected gun man, and I don't see any reports of that in the press, it doesn't change anything. It does not mean he was guilty - he was not on trial. And it doesn't automatically justify the actions of the police officer who shot him.

24HoursFromTulseHillEstate · 06/03/2024 00:12

prh47bridge · 05/03/2024 19:18

Even if he was the suspected gun man, and I don't see any reports of that in the press, it doesn't change anything. It does not mean he was guilty - he was not on trial. And it doesn't automatically justify the actions of the police officer who shot him.

No.

But it does explain why the police thought he might be armed, as they knew, they said at the time, even as the seige was happening, that the car was identified as one used in a firearms incident the previous day.

But I agree, what may or may not have been his involvement in Hackney and what transpired in Streatham are separate and must be treated strictly on what happened.

24HoursFromTulseHillEstate · 06/03/2024 00:26

prh47bridge · 05/03/2024 19:18

Even if he was the suspected gun man, and I don't see any reports of that in the press, it doesn't change anything. It does not mean he was guilty - he was not on trial. And it doesn't automatically justify the actions of the police officer who shot him.

It was in the press at the time that CK was one of the men suspected of attempted murder at the Oval Space in Hackney… and then during the recent trial they have not named him but said the suspected gunman was deceased….
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-68441013.amp

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-11392487/amp/Chris-Kaba-suspected-five-men-nightclub-gun-attack-days-earlier.html

Probably this should not be posted, explicitly.

Old Bailey

Two men convicted over gang shooting - BBC News

Another man, alleged to be the gunman who carried out the attack, died before he could stand trial.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-68441013.amp

Oblomov24 · 14/10/2024 18:43

Court case as in the London news tonight.

I just can't see that there was any justification at all for shooting him. But I bet police will get away with it.

prh47bridge · 14/10/2024 20:00

Oblomov24 · 14/10/2024 18:43

Court case as in the London news tonight.

I just can't see that there was any justification at all for shooting him. But I bet police will get away with it.

It is getting coverage on the BBC news as well.

To get a conviction, the prosecution must convince the jury that the defendant did not believe that there was an imminent threat to his own life or that of his colleagues, as he maintains. That will clearly be difficult and there doesn't seem to be much coverage of the prosecution case, if any, so it is difficult to assess their chances. However, it is true that juries tend to favour the police.

Poppyblush · 14/10/2024 20:30

Maybe the police acted legitimately.

Oblomov24 · 15/10/2024 06:07

"A police officer can only open fire if they honestly believe that it is necessary to protect themselves, their colleagues, or the public. It does not matter if that belief is mistaken - as long as it is honestly held the officer is not committing a criminal offence. To get a conviction in this case, the prosecution needs to convince the jury that the officer concerned knew that opening fire was not necessary to protect anyone but chose to use deadly force anyway."

See, there are just so many things in that prh47 but that just don't sit well with me.

1)"Honestly believe". I mean what does that even mean.

2)"It does not matter, if that is mistaken". It matters to Me. On principle. It would matter to me if it was my son. If my son was killed.

  1. To get a conviction, they need to prove ... no. That burden of proof is too far fetched, too far in the other direction, for my liking. It's too extremist. They should only need to prove ..... I'm not sure what, but something less.

Proving that this case is on a hide to nothing.

How? How can this be ok? Any of it? If it was your child?

So there's a previous crime, admittedly. And the police then think that this person is a notorious killer. And they're chasing him. And he's shot. In the head. Not in the leg to stop him eg running off. But in the head. Not the shoulder.

"I thought one or more of my colleagues was about to die."

Of what? How was your colleague gonna die? What exactly was the threat? Had he driven off, hit a policeman, at low speed, he wouldn't have been that hurt would he?

He aimed at the "central body mass" to "incapacitate". Well he's a rubbish shot then isn't he? Trying to hit body, but hit head?

The car was stationary. He's been boxed in, by police cars front and rear. Car then hadn't gone above 12 mph. So no threat to anyone really.

I don't believe a word this policeman says. It's racist, murder! With intent.

I reckon with a really good barrister they could break the policeman. It'd be a 'A few good men' moment. Wink

Shame. Of course there will be no prosecution. But at least it will comfort the family that the police's disgrace, yet again, yet another disgraceful case, is now being revealed,

Oblomov24 · 15/10/2024 06:17

center mass is still being taught in marksmanship training.

Plus, They are still told to aim low.

So the torso. Not the head.

Oblomov24 · 15/10/2024 06:27

@BirdBox12

"if you carry on driving when told to stop then expect to be shot."

Shot? Dead? Is that the rules?

Oblomov24 · 15/10/2024 06:57

The dashcam video of the car is 4.03 minutes long.
How fast do you think he's driving? At 2.12 he stops at a main road. 2.34 at traffic lights.

Then we see the pictures of imposed gunner. And the layout of the road, when the car was stationary.

Chris Kaba
Chris Kaba
prh47bridge · 15/10/2024 09:40

"Honestly believe". I mean what does that even mean.

It means a belief that is genuinely and reasonably held. If a belief is unreasonable in the situation, it is not an honest belief.

"It does not matter, if that is mistaken". It matters to Me. On principle. It would matter to me if it was my son. If my son was killed.

I understand where you are coming from, but that is the standard in law.

Imagine you are an armed police officer called in to a hostage situation. The hostage taker has a gun, is pointing it at one of the hostages and threatening to shoot them. You would reasonably believe that the hostage's life is in danger, so could shoot the hostage taker. If it subsequently turns out that the gun was a replica or did not have any ammunition, your belief would have been mistaken. Does that mean you are now a murderer because you shot the hostage taker? If it does, you could never shoot a hostage taker in this situation because you could never be certain that the gun was real and was loaded.

This applies to everyone, not just police officers. Imagine you are a hostage. The hostage taker has a gun, is pointing it at one of the hostages and threatening to shoot them. You find an iron bar and hit the hostage taker over the head with it, killing him. Even if it turns out that the gun was a replica or did not have any ammunition, you are not guilty of murder because you genuinely and reasonably believed that the hostage taker was about to kill someone, even though that belief was mistaken.

To get a conviction, they need to prove ... no. That burden of proof is too far fetched, too far in the other direction, for my liking. It's too extremist. They should only need to prove ..... I'm not sure what, but something less.

Not far-fetched at all. That is simply what is required to prove guilt beyond reasonable doubt. Are you suggesting a lower standard of proof for convictions? If so, for everyone or just for police officers?

So there's a previous crime, admittedly. And the police then think that this person is a notorious killer. And they're chasing him. And he's shot. In the head. Not in the leg to stop him eg running off. But in the head. Not the shoulder.

Hollywood has a lot to answer for. In a stressful situation with a hand held gun, even if it has an accurate laser sight, it is difficult to hit someone as precisely as you think. You may be able to get shots within a 6 inch circle at 30 yards in training, but that doesn't mean you can do it in a live situation. For that reason, police are generally trained to aim for the middle of the torso. That gives them the maximum chance of hitting the person they are targeting, and minimises the chances of them missing and accidentally hitting someone else. Of course, if you are shooting at someone sitting in a car, you may only be able to aim at their upper torso and head unless you are very close to the car.

"I thought one or more of my colleagues was about to die."

If I was defending him, I could give a number of explanations as to how he might have reasonably thought this. However, I am not expressing any view on his guilt or innocence.

You clearly don't accept that he reasonably believed that anyone was about to die. If the jury agree with you, the prosecution will have met the burden of proof you described as "far-fetched". They will have shown that he did not honestly believe that opening fire was necessary to protect anyone but he chose to use deadly force anyway.

Of course there will be no prosecution

There may be no conviction but there is clearly a prosecution.

Oblomov24 · 15/10/2024 17:03

I know prh, I know.

But some of that isn't applicable. You talk about a hostage, a gun. He didn't have a gun. They may have suspected he might. But what was the actual risk to them at that point. He's inside his car. What is the risk of him shooting them through his car windscreen with a gun they think he might possibly have.

Look at the parked cars. He practically can't drive off can he, he can't run them over, hit them with his car.

CagneyAndLazy · 16/10/2024 09:24

Some of the coverage of this case in the media is appalling.

I saw a BBC News video captioned "Police following Chris Kaba's car..."

Zero mention of the fact it wasn't Kaba's car it was a STOLEN car - being driven by a known violent criminal - used in a gun attack 24hrs previously.

Incredible that so many on here fall for this 'journalism'.

CagneyAndLazy · 16/10/2024 09:27

The car was stationary. He's been boxed in, by police cars front and rear. Car then hadn't gone above 12 mph. So no threat to anyone really.

I don't believe a word this policeman says. It's racist, murder! With intent.

Absolute bollocks.

It wasn't stationary. It was being rammed backwards and forwards, in an attempt to get away, by a known violent criminal.

BluebellsareBlue · 16/10/2024 11:24

KateyCuckoo · 23/09/2023 07:49

Yes I agree, the officers should expect and accept being driven at, why would you do such a job and not expect to be recklessly endangered?

This has to be a joke surely?!?

prh47bridge · 16/10/2024 12:35

CagneyAndLazy · 16/10/2024 09:24

Some of the coverage of this case in the media is appalling.

I saw a BBC News video captioned "Police following Chris Kaba's car..."

Zero mention of the fact it wasn't Kaba's car it was a STOLEN car - being driven by a known violent criminal - used in a gun attack 24hrs previously.

Incredible that so many on here fall for this 'journalism'.

There is zero mention of the car being stolen for the simple reason that the police have never described it as such, therefore presumably it was not stolen. It was, however, believed to have been linked to a firearms incident the previous day.

His only conviction was for possession of an imitation firearm with intent to cause fear of violence. He was not a suspect at the time he was shot. However, six men were subsequently charged with conspiring with Kaba to commit murder and GBH.

KateyCuckoo · 16/10/2024 12:55

BluebellsareBlue · 16/10/2024 11:24

This has to be a joke surely?!?

Thank you for asking me, 13 months later!

If you had continued to read the thread, instead of rushing to be offended, you would have seen my other comments.

Oblomov24 · 17/10/2024 05:30

@CagneyAndLazy

"He tried to get away by revving forward and then reversing into a police car, but ended up wedged between parked cars, the court heard."

But Mr Little told the Old Bailey that the car was stationery at the time of the shooting and the victim posed no lethal threat, saying: “That account is false, we say, in parts, and exaggerated in other parts.”

So it was stationary, at the time of the shooting, as I stated. Which you disputed?