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12 year old accused of raping a teacher

26 replies

happymerryberries · 12/12/2004 16:08

This is the second allegation of this type this year! What the hell is happening to society?

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saintlysecur · 12/12/2004 16:11


MarsselectionboxLady · 12/12/2004 16:18

IMO a lack of respect. We are not allowed to discipline at home, teachers are not allowed at school, the police aren't allowed to do anything without 6 weeks notice and the courts seem to favour the criminal. (me the pessimist). Too much favouring the child and not enough accountability. Sad

joashiningstar · 12/12/2004 17:16

Here, here MarsselectionboxLady...couldn't agree more!!

coppertop · 12/12/2004 17:27

Shock ShockShock

fostermum · 12/12/2004 18:11

with you 100% there is no reasons for kids to respect any one,im all in favour of boot camps my self,after going through the legal systom with many teens, haveing at least 6 final warnings from the police,the rules of ASBO'S broken with in hours of being set,community service given doing what the child enjoys(graffieting)walls it seems that some one needs to start taking action,at school children play up to be sent home,so put them in a room where there is nothing to damage and make them stay till home time,i know i seem hard but ive seen so many kids go down the wrong path just looking for some one to care enough to discipline them,they need boundrys to push against but they make them feel safe

happymerryberries · 12/12/2004 18:18

From your name, fostermum, I bet that you know exacly what can happen if people don't care enough to step in and stop kids [Sad] [Angry]

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IwigitcouldbeXmaseveryday · 12/12/2004 21:21

As someone working within the legal system, I'm in favour of a return to teachers being allowed to discipline unruly kids. Some of them I see at Court would be better off in a far flung detention centre than walking the streets.

I remember one case vividly. A friend of mine was prosecuting and when he requested a remand to custody, the 15 year old slob stood up in the dock, and shouted, "you can't do that. The offences aren't serious enough!"

Do you know, the little bastard was right!

We've gone way too far namby pambying them. Time to start reclaiming society.

fostermum · 13/12/2004 00:03

yes i see every day what can happen,children learn the law and what adults can and cant do before they learn to read and write and people go on about what awful kids they are,as soon as they learn that its the kids way of shouting "hay stop me,show you care and say no,coz if you loved me you would want me to be safe" the sooner we will turn a corner,all the kids get is parents telling them to go and play so they dont bother the adults, teachers expelling them coz the disrupt the school,pushing kids away like that confirms what the child thinks,no one wants me, they need to be held tight,told that there loved and shown by setting them limits that they can live and feel safe in there ends the sermon for to night sorry if i go on a bit

Hulababy · 13/12/2004 08:38

:( What a terrible story - again. What kind of society do we live in???

ernest · 13/12/2004 14:58

I notice in england, so many desks have signs warning the public about anti-social behaviour "abusive or threatening behaviour against staffwill not be tolerated etc etc' you see this at passport control coming into Uk, you see it at the tolls eg at Dartford crossing, where basically you just have to throw £1 into a bucket for goodness sake. you see it so often, but it's almost like it's expected.

I've not notices such signs in other countries I've visited. The UK really does seem to have become a society that is rude, aggressive, threatening. If some kids were mucking about in the street, how many adults would challenge them? My guess is none, because they'd be scared to, and that's just terrible. Kids (and adults who should know better) often behave terribly because they know they won't be taken to task.

Too much about personal rights and too little on responsibilty. Parents too scared or too weak to say no to their kids, who grow up thinking the world owes them a living.

Just spending half an our in say Waterloo station or any tube station is enough to depress you for the rest of the day. My dh thinks I'm old fashioned, but if that means treating people with respect & wanting them to do the same to me, then yes, I suppose I must be.

rant over, sorry

Hulababy · 13/12/2004 15:01

You are right ernest. A number of the kids I teach know everything about their rights and nothing about their responsibilities.

galaxy · 13/12/2004 15:04

"Just spending half an our in say Waterloo station or any tube station is enough to depress you for the rest of the day"

I should send this to my employers who are demanding I go from working from home to working from London and can't see the difference it will make to my morale

Caligulights · 13/12/2004 15:18

I think these signs you get everywhere about threatening staff etc., are quite counterproductive. In a way the presence of these signs actually normalises bad behaviour, as if it's expected. Which I guess it is, depressingly.

IwigitcouldbeXmaseveryday · 13/12/2004 15:19

I well remember a former client of mine, who would bring her teenage son with her to briefings prior to her divorce. The little waster was so rude, arrogant and know it all, I had to withdraw from the case as I could no longer tolerate his presence. I wasn't that keen on her, either. Everytime I asked for some respect, she just smirked and did nothing.

So, unusually for me, I cast her adrift.

ernest · 13/12/2004 15:33

That's exactly what I mean, Caligulights. They basically state that abusive behaviour is almost normal & to be expected. I just flew last w/e & noticed it immediately when I arrived back in UK, but hadn't seen a single similar sign anywhere else.

God knows how you'd turn it around. It's like 80% of the population's standards have dropped to little over scum level Sad

galaxy, I really hope for your sake you can avoid it.

Gobbledigoose · 13/12/2004 15:34

Me too Galaxy - I hated travelling in London with a passion and am so glad I'm out of it. Stressful and depressing isn't in it.

happymerryberries · 13/12/2004 16:16

I find it very hard when I go into classes and teach kids who have no intention of doing any work. Not that they find the work too hard, they just don't want to do anything, at all. They all think that they will walk our of school and have a high paying job while they put no effort into anything. They all think that collages and universities will be falling over themselves to give them a place. They find it almost impossible to understand why, when they get they hand full of D and E and F grades at GCSE we refuse to let them do A level. They honestly think that the world owes them a living. And people falling over themselves to excuse this sot of behavior is the very last thing these kids need. They are often rude, lazy and idsruptive and they need a metaphorical kick up the backside.

Thus ends the rant.... can you tell I had a bad last lesson Sad

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MarsselectionboxLady · 13/12/2004 16:26

Now that reminds me of something a certain Prince said.....

fostermum · 13/12/2004 18:29

happymerryberries they dont expect high paid jobs they dont have to expect they know the dole is waiting, nice bit of council housing,benifits for everything,but in there corner i think some of the things that they are taught are useless,and boring and they know they will never use them,maby if school was arranged to cater for todays life they may want to take part a bit more

happymerryberries · 13/12/2004 19:02

The thing is though, even when you arrange for them to, say go to collage on day release, to study vocational stuff that they say they are interested in, they still do no work. I've got a lad in my class atm who was expelled from collage (and that takes some doing I can tell you) and is now back in school for what passes for full time in his case. Ironically he is doing very well with me, and should get a grade B at GCSE. He is quite a bright lad. I don't think that he will tho, because he generaly can't be arsed to do any work.

In the end I honestly think that they want an adult to step in and sort their lives out. They would chew broken glass before they would admit to this Smile but in the end they want someone to give a damn. Even if they fight you all the way.

If it is done well then I think the vocational education reforms, if properly planned and funded would do well by these disafected kids. With my cynical head on I see it as another big cop out in the making. We are already doing some GNVQs with kids and we offer applied science which is much better for some kids, and most of them do better with it that the straight 'academic' GCSE.

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fostermum · 13/12/2004 19:08

it could almost be the same child.mine got expelled from every where,finally college,although thats all he had ever wanted,the trouble is if they dont feel worth anything or that they can do anything,often told this continually by parents and sociaty,why should they true at school,college ect and just prove everyone right,the thing is how do you make a child that has no self esteem think anything else when thats all they have heard

color · 13/12/2004 19:08

totally agree with you hmb re chewing glass. Greater majority I feel do need/want someone to take them totally out of their situation and get them on the right track for years I always thought this. They can't be seen to want help and they can't be seen to get and appreciate help why can't the powers be see this instead of messing about with schemes that centuries have shown have very little effect? It is so frustrating to have to put up with rubbish from people who are just making society so awful. (Yes I know some of those people in some countries are the very cause of it) sorry rushing and rambling now

fostermum · 13/12/2004 19:10

i had a child who refused point blank to put his shoes on,he was 12,everything had been tried, when it got down to the nitty,gritty, dad had always told he he would do it for him after all he was to stupid to get them on the right feet!so why try?

Hulababy · 13/12/2004 19:28

Agree with everything you are saying again hmb!

OPur school does do some of these voactional/aternative curriculum courses for pupils. In these cases the pupils (Y10/11) soend 3 days either at college or in a work place, and the other two days in school.

In school these pupils study core subjects - we call it Flexible Learning. They do English, Maths, ICT and some other things - not 100% on it all. I do the ICT stuff woth them. In ICT they are not doing an approved, certificated course. I'd like to change this thogugh for next year - didn't even know we were having this class 'till I got me timetable in September! They are not doing GCSEs in English or Maths either - they do some other quaification.

At college some are doing vocational courses and these take place either partially or wholey with a work placement. Typical vocational stuff is child care in nurseries, brick laying, joinery, plastering, etc. They also do some form of certificated courses along side this in that field.

However, when in school these kids still don't want to be there and still do not work. I spend the whole lesson forcing these kds to do some work and try and get some learning to take place. But it is a struggle and I fight them all the way. We wil get some learning done, but it won't be easy and I will have to force them all the way.

When challenged these kids just have no reasons for why they feel they should work in school. They tell me they don't need school qualifications - their uncle/dad/frienmd will give them a job, or they'll do on the dole. They seem to have no or little ambition at all. I find that really hard to understand, but have to work through it and keep challenging them and pushing them. I actually find it very sad that a 14 year old can have no desire to achieve something :(

happymerryberries · 13/12/2004 19:43

Fostermum, I think that part of the reason that the boy is doing OK at the moment is that he gets treated just the same as everyone else in the class. He is in with his intelectual equals, he is expected to do well and in class he does. He gets praised just like the rest and bollocked just like the rest if he doesn't come up to scratch, and I make it quite clear to him (and all of them) that I excpect the very best from them.

But in the end he may well fail because no-one give him the same push at home.

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