Fran Lyon to keep baby

[ElfPolarBear]

Looking for a link
Not sure whether she's coming back
Fantastic news IMO for Molly and Fran

Happy New Year, Fran and Molly!

What brilliant news

Surely family court procedures need to be more open? SURELY?!

I agree Hunker, something should be done about Family Court procedures

I wouldn't come back if I were her, until any children she has are at least secondary school age and therefore hopefully out of the reach of SS - at that age they're given a say in where they live.

The whole bloody thing has been a disgrace and it's not good enough that they've backed down. There should be a public enquiry as to how they came to enact this whole fiasco in the first place.

Fran, hope the future stays bright for you and Molly. Good luck to you and well done for not letting the bastards grind you down!

Hallelujah! What a christmas gift.

Sorry you've been through all this Fran, but Happy New Year!

Well... it is not as if the Northumberland Council has backed off (with them asking for whomever is taking care of Fran now to contact them). She would be mad in returning, they would continue to hunt her down even if it is just not to accept their messing up.

Have to say I find it a disgrace that a woman has to become a fugitive in order to have a chance to demonstrate she is able to take care of her baby. It seems like a bad Tom Cruise movie (do you remember that one about preventing crime before it happened? although some way those prophets seemed to have more of a clue than the persons involved in this case!)

Have to say it seems fishy to me.

From

'we will take your baby away at birth and you can't do anything about it'

to

'Oh. You did something about it. No, it's ok, you can keep the baby, just come back to the UK (where you are subject to our authority) If anyone knows where she is, please tell us, we're not going to do anything......'

a thousand times

Great news. Hope you ok fran if you lurking, so sorry for you having been put through this. Agree it would be madness to come back.
I had a very bad time as a teenager, depression, suicide attempts etc (alot of teens do) and no one ever suggested this may mean I may harm my dc, it is ridiculous. I recently saw a social worker, nothing to do with me but to try and decide wheather my abusive xhusband can see the children or not, after her spending on hour with me and the children she said my boys were lovely and it was obvious I had done a good job bringing them up on my own, I nearly cried. Proof that problems as a teen does not equal bad mother. Wish you all the luck in the world fran

not true apparently

and the baby could still be taken away and brought back to the UK without Fran's consent.

waannaBe, Thats awful, especially when Fran has committed no crime. Surely extradition is something for criminals, not babies.

I think Fran should keep a very low profile for the next five years at least. Sad though as I imagine she has friends and relatives in the UK.

I've been thinking about Fran, because her baby must be just about due. I hope she is OK.

How dare the authorities say "she is still under their care". What kind of care is it that persecutes a young first-time mother? Their cruelty and hypocrisy are just unbelievable.

What do they want? If they have the psychologist report that Fran is no danger to her baby, why are they still pursuing this ridiculous case?

To state that they want Fran to get in touch "so we can be sure she and her unborn child receive the help and support that they need". Ha!

Like you have provided help and support for the last 9 months you mean? I think that Fran and Molly can do without your support.

Fran, I wish you and Molly all the best for 2008.

I don't believe the baby could be brought back without her consent actually, because that pre-supposes that whichever country she lives in, is run by the same sort of arseholes which run social services depts and would agree to the British state kidnapping the child.

Extradition treaties are quite complex legal agreements - you have to have a very good case to enforce extradition on someone and that case generally must be on the basis that the person you are trying to extradite has committed a criminal offence and will be standing trial with a good chance of being found guilty. That would not apply in Fran's case and I can't see a European country (assuming she is somewhere in Europe) countenancing a baby being kidnapped by lunatic social workers. They may actually take the European right to family life seriously.

but Fran wouldn't be extridited, (sp?) the baby would be made a ward of the courts and could be removed from Fran in the country she is in and returned to the UK.

it does happen, remember that 13 year old girl that married some guy out in turkey about 10 years ago? she was made a ward of the courts as she was a minor and was returned to the UK even though her parents had consented to the marriage.

I worry about the future for Fran, motherhood is very hard the first time around and the pressure she will feel under to be perfect will be immense. What if she suffers with pnd? Even if not the early weeks of sleepless nights and raging hormones make most women find life hard going at times, she is going to find it hard to confide in anyone when life gets tough.

I feel hugely guilty for the feelings I had at times when I couldn't face getting up in the night again, or a constantly crying baby. Imagine how that would be in Frans situation.

Hmm i don't know wannabe, I guess it would depend on what country she is in and what kind of agreement they have there in this sort of circumstance (although this sort of circumstance is so bizarre and so far thank goodness, unique, that it would be presumably a legal puzzle).

Little Bella, how can we know it is unique?

This story is terrifying for so many of us, precisely because we don't know that. If Fran had less time left before the SS involvement, her baby could have been taken and she might never have been allowed discuss it.

We don't usually know anything about the circumstances under which babies are taken from their parents. And SS are either hiding behind secrecy in the Fran Lyon case, or there really is more to her story* than we know. Either way this is a ludicrous situation.

I have a horrible suspicion that SS dug their heels in so firmly because there have been many precedents of cases like this, so they are convinced that their mad intervention is just routine action in their course of duty.

Fran has proven herself to be exceptionally articulate and resourceful. I guess SS have never been so firmly challenged and publicised before. Most young, vulnerable single mothers with troubled backgrounds would not be able for such a battle, or for living indefinitely as a fugitive in a foreign land.

no matter what, I can't imagine how SS could justify taking a newborn on the grounds that its mother might* develop MSbP. Or how they can use a letter from a paediatrician who never met her and qualified his advice to support their case.

I imagine that whatever European country Fran has fled to would have its own social services. Surely if Molly was to be taken into care then Molly would be placed in foster care in whatever country she is residing in.

Just as Northumberland County Council passed care to Birminghamm, then whatever country Fran is social services would look after her. Fran would be subject to whatever laws of the country that she has picked. (I guess that Fran has chosen carefully)

For example in many middle east countries UK custory law is ignored and the father is allowed to keep the child. Even if the mother has been awarded custory in the UK because of Islamic law.

ARGH!!!! I thought this might actually be over and the only thing I was waiting to hear about was the safe arrival of Molly!!

The thing is this article is full of inaccuracies as well - Fran had moved to Birmingham before she left, so why are Northumberland still 'responsible' for her?

Also she was diagnosed with BPD when she was a teenager and this has since been withdrawn - she has NO mental health diagnosis - this was confirmed by THREE independent experts she had to go and see to get reports for Northumberland.

And it implies that the rest of us who still have a BPD diagnosis are ALL dangerous prospects as parents - also not true.

What is true is that Fran has got a home, a midwife, professional support to try and get over the trauma of what's happened, a new social network and friends and family who care about her DO know where she is - surprisingly this doesn't include Northumberland Council!!

I know everyone here knows this but I am just SO angry. ARGH!!!!

Upwind, good points.

That makes perfect sense - SS must have been convinced they would win, and they must have had something to base that on.

Mind you, that is rather assuming that they are ruled by logic not hysteria. Which is a major assumption and not one I'm willing to make about Social Services anymore.

I can't help feeling that this is now about social services 'winning', rather than about any actual concerns for the child.

It's like they feel Fran has defied them and must be punished and a message sent to others that social services have the power.

Yes I also get that feeling. The last thing Fran needs is yet more worry and threats.

Hekate that is my feeling too- they don't often get challenged in such a public & articulate way as Upwind says, so I strongly feel this a matter of public "face" or not wanting to appear defeated. Whatever they do now they are looking like the complete ar**holes we all know they are.

Doricgirl please give her our love, I know you are a RL friend hope all this guff worrying her or is she being as calm as ever?

(please don't answer that if you'd rather not!)

ISN'T worrying her I mean??!

Good Luck Fran, I hope Molly's entry to the world is all you wanted it to be.