Channel crossings - what is the solution?

[Snog]

Clearly asylum seekers crossing the channel in inflatable boats is a very bad thing. What is the solution though?

Short term we provide safe alternative routes.

There are already multiple safe routes to emigrate. Routes that are actually also cheaper than the pay a human trafficker £3k to stick you in a rubber dinghy and push you off into an ocean.

In addition, most of these migrants are being offered asylum and benefits to start a life in the countries they pass through, but they stubbornly refuse them. Turkey, has, France has been. Germany too. Mexico has to all the migrants fleeing Central America and pass through to go to US. But, no not good enough. These migrants insist on going to U.K. or US.

Quite frankly sick of their idiocy and prejudice.

@jgw1
Indeed, how different it could have been if they had been supported and integrated when they arrived in this country.

What a disgusting comment to make. Do you know nothing about the Liverpool women’s hospital bomber? He was welcomed and he was hosted and housed by a British family who befriended him and did everything they could to help him build a life there. But you seem to think the British are somehow to blame for him choosing to detonate a terrorist bomb? Nice bit of victim blaming.

@canyoutoleratethis exactly this:

Of course that approach suits us, an island nation located to the north of the countries people are fleeing from, with lots of lovely ‘buffer’ countries in the way. But how is that fair to France, Italy, Greece, Germany etc? We end up with none, and they have to take them all because of geography? The answer is we all take a share of those in need and open up safe routes for our proportion.

Heard this so much recently and it seems very convenient that this is the most “logical” answer when it suits us best.

[quote PlanDeRaccordement]@jgw1
Indeed, how different it could have been if they had been supported and integrated when they arrived in this country.

What a disgusting comment to make. Do you know nothing about the Liverpool women’s hospital bomber? He was welcomed and he was hosted and housed by a British family who befriended him and did everything they could to help him build a life there. But you seem to think the British are somehow to blame for him choosing to detonate a terrorist bomb? Nice bit of victim blaming.[/quote]
People are very skewed.

[quote PlanDeRaccordement]@jgw1
Indeed, how different it could have been if they had been supported and integrated when they arrived in this country.

What a disgusting comment to make. Do you know nothing about the Liverpool women’s hospital bomber? He was welcomed and he was hosted and housed by a British family who befriended him and did everything they could to help him build a life there. But you seem to think the British are somehow to blame for him choosing to detonate a terrorist bomb? Nice bit of victim blaming.[/quote]
They were allowed to work?

@MarshaBradyo

Re Macron uninviting us I agree with pp it’s reactive petulance and probably because he doesn’t want a solution

Instead of giving any thought or care to those innocent people who lost their lives, our PM chose to politicise this for his own gain by tweeting a letter for fuck sake - hardly a man seriously looking for a solution. It’s a move straight out of Donald Trump’s playbook and Macron is right to tell him to stick it - if Boris isn’t serious enough to negotiate like a grown up, then he shouldn’t have a place at the table. His ‘suggestions’ in no way try to deal with the substantive problem, and that is how can the UK facilitate safe passage for migrants wanting to come here. It made us look like the joke we unfortunately increasingly are with this clown ‘in charge’

I disagree Can

The door is closed to discussion and even if suggestions were off we’re further away from solution due to Macron.

Due to Macron but not due to Johnson?

PlanDeRaccordement

There is a difference between having a right to emigrate, then choosing to emigrate and also in doing it legally or illegally and even then by the most stupid means available. If these human beings don’t have the brain cells to understand that rubber dinghy plus ocean is risking almost certain death by drowning, then that’s their problem. Not mine or anyone else’s. We are not obligated to protect the stupid from their own stupidity.“

You are disgusting.

Listening to R4 it did go through formal channels and acknowledged before SM

If we had refused to meet I’d say the same.

The only way to get closer to resolving it is to meet.

How do you return from this and move forward?

Cancelling is a dead end.

We could stop doing business with the countries that are so corrupt that people feel forced to cross continents and get into rubber dinghies
Several decades too late for that....

Be honest about what a miserable place the UK is to live....only that's not true.

There is a great welfare system, health care, civil rights, etc.

you want to live there, why shouldn't they?

As @DuncinToffee says, refugees/asylum seekers do not have to claim asylum in the first safe country they reach. It is also wrong to assume that France is a safe country for all asylum seekers. There is evidence of asylum seekers not being treated as they should be under French law, particularly unaccompanied children.

The answer to this is to process claims much quicker, Germany do it in about 6 months. The issue here is that we take years, then all these young men have in one way or another 'settled' here. The 'settling' needs to be disrupted. It is widely believed that they come to the UK because of speaking English and having family. The fact is that many do not speak English. As regards family, I personally don't think this can be used as a reason, many people over here do not//cannot live near their family (ok I know it's still in the same country!).

This isn't going away, in fact, the issue is going to get worse. The UK is at tipping point, as is Europe. Originally 'asylum' meant political asylum now it means 'I've come from (name a country in turmoil) or I'm gay/lesbian, or something else. No papers, no proof, no nothing.

There is evidence of asylum seekers not being treated as they should be under French law, particularly unaccompanied children.

Well you could say the same for the U.K.

@Noeuf

www.unhcr.org/uk/uk-immigration-and-asylum-plans-some-questions-answered-by-unhcr.html

This makes interesting reading on the UK’s plans.

Thanks for sharing this.

I wonder what exactly is considered to be a 'safe and legal pathway' by the UK government for asylum seekers, since Britain is an island?

Safe and legal routes to the UK

www.amnesty.org.uk/files/2021-01/Amnesty%20International%20UK%20-%20Safe%20and%20Legal%20Routes%20Briefing_0.pdf?WhIQYO9iEgCBfpjkGelCevE0CagCsEHD=

twitter.com/politicsjoe_uk/status/1464535733058818052?s=21

Lord Kerr with facts in the House of Lords yesterday

NonnyMouse1337

Noeuf
www.unhcr.org/uk/uk-immigration-and-asylum-plans-some-questions-answered-by-unhcr.html

This makes interesting reading on the UK’s plans.
Thanks for sharing this.

I thought so - can’t imagine the criticism will change much. We’ve just landed Shamim Begum in a country she’s never been to so offloading a few harmless refugees won’t be a problem if we’re happy washing our hands of an actual threat.

The ability to apply legitimately for asylum online from wherever these people are. This would save a lot of money and be able to facilitate more staff in the U.K. carrying out appropriate checks and considerations for or against asylum being granted.

ID cards and stricter working laws against people who come here illegally.

Many many people who cross are simply people who could live better lives in the U.K. rather than those desperately fleeing persecution, the problem is when too many people come here, local peoples services are stretched to the bone, healthcare systems can't cope, police and other services can't cope, cultural differences create problems (and yes I know sometimes can be a good thing) schools in England have been forced to just cope with it, and too few tax payers to non tax payers can cause a complete imbalance in the system resulting in everyone suffering more.

Stopping their ability to work will help stop some from encouraging everyone in their families coming here. This is often why they come here, the black market. There is a black market in most countries but the U.K. is particularly bad because of the lack of ID cards making it easier to get away without any fear of prosecution.

Oh and of course deport those deemed illegally here. That would definitely help curb some of the people crossing illegally and spending a lot of money only to be sent straight back home.

Most asylum seekers come through Europe where they are perfectly safe. They are economic migrants. If they simply towed them.back immediately every time they came in dinghy's, they would stop coming. They can apply legally from Europe to come to UK.

Human beings who’ve committed no crime should have the right to choose where they want to live

Really, I wonder how that would work out worldwide

Anyone involved in the (very lucrative) people smuggling trade should be prosecuted, including potentially for manslaughter.

That includes the French police for standing by and doing nothing to stop it. They're playing a role in endangering lives.

I can understand why they come here. France, unlike here, treats all homeless - asylum seeking migrant and French national equally badly. No hotels just tents.

Nobody (migrant or British/French national/anyone else) should be left homeless- but unless and until we deal with our own public health housing and homelessness emergency, we cannot take unlimited new migrants. We should take a share because we need to help if we can but France needs to do its bit too.

Now if we were to invest in mass social housing build (plus improved infrastructure) things could be different. We might be able to accommodate more. (We'd also need a more even distribution of resettlement/social housing build - to include the more affluent shires.)

But really the best solution is working on negating the need for migration in the first place. The majority of people don't actually want to flee their homes, their families, their communities. Migrating out of desperation - including economic - is very different to having a wanderlust.

Human beings who’ve committed no crime should have the right to choose where they want to live

If only! I wish somebody would let Singapore, Japan, or New Zealand know. I'm still waiting for my residency visa.

@Tealightsandd

France, unlike here, treats all homeless - asylum seeking migrant and French national equally badly. No hotels just tents.

If you don’t mind let me just correct you on that.

Yes there are tent encampments, more of which in a moment, but OTOH organizations such as Emmaus and the Red Cross organize/set up shelters for the homeless in general and especially in times of severe weather local authorities set up/open up facilities to get homeless off the street.

There are hotels/hostels available to those who are going through the official process of seeking asylum in France - there is one in an adjacent village to us.

What obviously needs restating is that there is a bloc of migrants who have zero wish to make themselves known to the authorities and will try to stay off the radar, possibly because they have no wish to get involved in the French system when they have no interest in staying in France permanently…many of those are in the tent encampments near the north coast.