If you force a woman to touch male genitalia - is she being abused?

[bkgirl]

I read this story about a muslim lady refusing to wax male genitalia. Regardless of religion, is acceptable force anyone to do this with the law acting effectively like a weapon? windsorstar.com/news/local-news/transgender-woman-files-human-rights-complaint-against-windsor-spa
Where do we draw the lines? In addition, what if the beautician was 16 or 17?

Even a non Muslim woman is allowed to say she doesn’t want to have to touch/see a penis if she doesn’t want to and I hope this legal case makes that clear and doesn’t focus on the religious aspect.

Clara sorry not you although reading it back I can see how it might read like that sorry! 😶

Even a non Muslim woman is allowed to say she doesn’t want to have to touch/see a penis if she doesn’t want to and I hope this legal case makes that clear and doesn’t focus on the religious aspect

I would hope so, but the right to self ID as a transgender is enshrined in Canadian law, so it will be an interesting case.

Given that waxers train differently for male/female waxing, I personally would be saying that I'm not qualified to wax this particular organ. If she's not happy doing it then that would suggest to me she's not qualified anyway... how could the trans women win?

I know Canada has different transgender laws but I’d be suprised if they go as far to force a woman to handle a penis. Will certainly be an interesting case.

If the person had had an operation and had their penis removed and some form of reconstructed vagina/vulva I’d think that in Canada they would likely win their case. But when in possession of a penis I hope they won’t.

I think she would have understand the remit of the job when she took it. If she was uncomfortable with any element maybe she shouldn't have taken the job.

But the remit of the job is waxing women. Businesses are allowed to limit the services they offer based on sex, provided there is a valid reason. What reason is more valid than this?

Now where it gets complex is if the transwoman has a gender recognition certificate, because the law that frames it mixes up gender and sex. I'm not sure there has ever been a case that resolved the tension between the sex exemption in the equality act and the gender recognition act.

Sorry, I didn't make myself clear. I was responding to the comments on the Facebook page about how it was discriminatory for there to be no person on duty at the waxing salon to defuzz said cock and balls!!

Just realised I'd assumed the wrong Windsor for the location- so my comments about the GRA are irrelevant.

@Candyflip and do you think it's appropriate for children to wax female nether regions ???

Thanks for discussing it so nicely. :) I guess we will have to watch and see what happens.

natgt the OP mentioned the NSPCC statistics to highlight the numbers of girls who have been sexually abused and will live with that for the rest of their lives. If they are then expected to wax “lady” penises it could be triggering, but this particular trans woman is only concerned with their own rights. Although there may be young people working in beauty salons, no one is actually saying that children are actually waxing either men or women.

There was a similar case in Melbourne last year: www.starobserver.com.au/news/salon-that-refused-trans-woman-waxing-stands-by-its-decision/151326

It's all about validation

I really, really hope that the business wins this one. Why is it that pharmacists are generally allowed (caveat - I don't know about in Ontario) to refuse to dispense chemical contraception, but women in the kinds of roles and professions where they would expect only to have to touch women's bodies have to touch men's genitals when they don't want to? Besides this, waxing male genitalia is an acquired skill that not all therapists have and nor should they be expected to have. Things could go terribly wrong if an untrained person did it. The TRA in this case is a misguided narcissist wanting validation and a public hissy fit in my view.

I hope the case gets lots of publicity and causes people to think about what's happening.

Wow this is ridiculous. The (potential) customer is clearly just looking for trouble. Identify as how you like and such but a penis is a penis you can't just pretend it's a completely different piece of anatomy.
They haven't said they won't wax a trans person's back, leg, chest, or whatever, but that they don't have anyone who waxes balls. It's hardly a human rights abuse.
More power to the beautician and her employer for standing their ground.

In my local beauty parlour which does do waxing, there are trainees who are under 18. I have no idea do they carry out waxing. Indeed, they sprung to mind when I read this article and tbh having suffered sexual abuse as a child myself and since the stats show it's so prevalent. In all honesty, to this day - if anyone (even including my own kids) grabs my wrist for example, I feel like throwing up. I would be fully retraumatised if I was forced to look at or touch male genitalia of someone I wasn't in a consensual relationship with.Honestly, I cannot express how appalling this would be.

A local transgender woman claims she was denied services based on her gender identity and gender expression and is seeking $50,000 for “immense harm to my dignity.”

Validation, money and the opportunity to give a big stir.

I think going in and asking for a brazilian wax when not offered to your body type and then kicking up a fuss in the media is self-harm to dignity.

But this really boils down to whose rights and dignity count most a transgender or muslim person? Although I suspect that insurance (aka money) will be the determining factor if it goes to court.

I think the muslim/religious side is irrelevant. A christian, buddhist or atheist etc could feel every bit as distressed as a muslim. I am glad the lady concerned was strong enough to say no.

I know Canada has different transgender laws but I’d be suprised if they go as far to force a woman to handle a penis. Will certainly be an interesting case.

I don't know in this case but female corrections staff in Canada have been told they will be expected to conduct intimate searches on transwomen prisoners or face disciplinary action unless there is a cannot remember exact wording conflicting reason. Which I think means they will force atheist women but not force Muslim women. I'd be converting, myself.