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Yet another article re: why mothers should return to work

1000 replies

boogiewoogie · 02/04/2007 11:03

Just snatching a couple of minutes during a coffee break, will come back. What do you think of this?

OP posts:
Anna8888 · 05/04/2007 09:55

I was replying to SunnyJim, you do realise?

Eleusis · 05/04/2007 09:56

You want your DD to see animals mating and giving birth? You are weird. Just plain weird.

Anna8888 · 05/04/2007 09:57

eleusis - I wouldn't like a dog indoors particularly - personally I think it's cruel to keep dogs, cats etc mainly inside - like I think it's cruel to keep humans mainly inside

We are all animals and we all need to roam and have our freedom...

Anna8888 · 05/04/2007 09:57

Yes, I want my daughter to see how animals behave. She is an animal - I am an animal - you are an animal...

suejonez · 05/04/2007 09:58

ummm... being in work does (generally) assume a degree of literacy... but I could only see your "SJ" on the preview and had to open the thread to see who you were reffering too.

Mild witticisms are so wasted when you have to explain them...

Eleusis · 05/04/2007 10:02

No. There are different classes of species on my planet. Humans do not (and should not) behave like say grizzly bears. I can see you wanting her to learn about animals and their behaviour, but I think wanting a 3 year old to abserve mating and birthing practices is weird. Maybe I'm just a city girl.

Eleusis · 05/04/2007 10:03

Go back to work Sue.

Lazycow · 05/04/2007 10:04

Actaully Pixel I agree with you. However I will go back to my favourite topic of risk assesment (unpopular though it is on this very emotional thread) I personally work because I hope it will reduce the my economic vulnerability. I completely understand that this is no guarantee but to not give myself that buffer would make me feel unacceptably vulnerable.

Obviously if I were happy to be a real woman though I'd be OK with vulnerability [hmmm] so I shll go back to being a masculine ball-breaker who can't be a real woman because I want to work in an economic sense (I know being a SAHM is work too - I've never disputed that)

suejonez · 05/04/2007 10:04

thanks Eleusis - are the west london crew going to stalk me until I stop posting and do some work?

Eleusis · 05/04/2007 10:07

Oh yes, good point Lazy Cow. Being career driven is perfectly feminine. Ther is more to being a woman than being a mother, just as there is more to being a man than being a father.

Eleusis · 05/04/2007 10:08

Sue, I too ought to be working... best go. I have an irate supplier. Must tend to them.

Anna8888 · 05/04/2007 10:08

eleusis - yes, you probably are hyperurbanised. Lots of humans are.

FairyMum · 05/04/2007 10:11

Anna, most of the children in our nursery behave like animals and my DS2 even bites like a crazy dog when angered. I think your DD would thrive!

sunnyjim · 05/04/2007 10:14

I'm not keen on DS being in daycare on a farm for a few reasons:
1, in order for that to happen we would have to have a huge lifestyle change invovlng a move. He'd also have to either live in the middle of sodding nowhere or he'd have to be driven to nursery and I kinda like th fact that we can walk to his nursery and his friends live nearby.
2, a REAL farm is a working environment with tractors and balers etc being noisy all day long. I don't want DS in daycare in that situation
3, assuming its not a working farm there will still be risks from animals. unless the animals are more or less pets? Now I do expose DS to animals, mud, muck etc but I prefer to do it on my terms.
4, nursery to me is a safe environment with HIGHER standards fo H&S and cleanlines than at home, a farm doesn't match up to that.

and animals mating - fine if he sees it but I'm not going out of my way. DS isn't an animal he is a human, what would he learn from watching animals mate? that isnt' how humans have sex, we dont' come into heat, we don't bear litters of young.
I want him to learn about love, trust, respect and fun in sex, and that doesn't include showig him a smelly dog humping a poor bitch or drakes raping a mallard hen in the lake by holding her head under the water!

Oh and he wasn't BF and even if he was i really wouldn't want him to equate that with a cow or sheep stood in a field with no other job than to chew grass and give milk to her young before being killed for meat? I kinda want him to see me as mum and a cool human being not a milk machine?

(not saying BFing mums are milk machines - making a comparison with cows)

Anna8888 · 05/04/2007 10:15

FM - oh dear... what I like about my daughter being at home and out and about in the city is that she has lots and lots of space to run around and burn off all energy so she doesn't feel the need to bite, scratch, scream, pull hair etc

It's very obvious when she hasn't spent enough time in open space in the day as she does then sometimes get a bit violent in the evening...

Eleusis · 05/04/2007 10:18

Oh, I must admit DD does crawl around on the floor claiming to be a "baby lion". It drives me crazy sometimes, but I'm okay with this so long as she doesn't want to know about how to make more baby lions. Some things can be learned later in life.

Anna8888 · 05/04/2007 10:20

SunnyJim - oh well, we have TOTALLY opposed positions on this one. I love my daughter spending time at my parents' in the countryside where every spring we see drakes and mallards mating on the patio and baby ducks hatching a few weeks later. I love it that when she looks at books she points out the cow's udder and then points at my breasts and understands the link perfectly. I love it that my stepsons (9, 11) talk perfectly openly about sex and conception and that we all talk about the characteristics all the children have inherited from their parents, even though the boys and my daughter have different mothers.

Anna8888 · 05/04/2007 10:20

sorry, meant ducks

Eleusis · 05/04/2007 10:22

Oh for ducks sake... you are hypourbanised. (especially for a transplant Parisian)

FairyMum · 05/04/2007 10:26

Anna, it was tongue in cheek. I cannot think of anywhere better for young children to burn off energy than nurseries. Ours does have lovely open spaces, lots of toys and little friends to play with. Also, I dont buy your claim that all nurseries in Paris are as crap as you describe. I doubt working parents in France are that different from working parents in London. Surely they want whats best for their children too. I think SOME SAHMS want to believe that nurseries are bad for children. Its their way of adding value to themselves. I am a SAHM and have saved my children from a horrid faith in nursery.

Anna8888 · 05/04/2007 10:28

FM - actually, nurseries here are VERY different, as are schools and universities and many other facets of life.

Perceptions of what is "best" are very cultural, as I presume you know, since you are Swedish.

FairyMum · 05/04/2007 10:46

I expect the waiting lists in Paris are long for good nurseries, but that they do exist. Or are you saying that all French parents who work are happy to leave their children in these places. They must have a lot of social problems in France then as I thought most French women worked.

yellowrose · 05/04/2007 10:48

well actually in "the good old days" most children would have been brought up on farms and seens lots of animals screwing and giving birth. nothing wrong with it. it is not NATURAL for a child, esp. a small one to be indoors all day, esp. not when it is lovely sunny weather outside. my son never wants to leave the garden. i gather most decent nurseries have gardens or something outside, which is fine.

yellowrose · 05/04/2007 10:51

talking of nurseries, what do you lot make of this: this

I know it is The Sun and I heard about it on "The Wright Stuff" this morning, which makes it sound even worse, but I will google and try to find the actual report somewhere else and come back soon !

yellowrose · 05/04/2007 10:58

this

this is more detailed

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