Brown to double tax on gas guzzlers???? (esp. SN)

[PeachyClair]

Now, before you get on your 4X4 high horses hear me out LOL!

We just bought an old second hand espace with the smallest engine they make, 2L. We have three kids, but because of SN two cannot be seated together- thereby the old configuration wasn't working for us.

The only alternative we would have to the MPV is two cars, which would be ancient polluters as we only ahd £1K to spend anyway (last car was written off by a garage)

The Government seems to want to encourage famillies- tax credits, etc etc etc- but when you have one you get hit!

I have no problem with sports car and luxury vehicles being hit, but we're really worried as they don't make a smaller car engine than the one we have in MPV- and we have no idea how we will finance this. DH ahs to have a car for work, we can't use buses because of the SN- and the nearest supermarket is 5 miles away.

we don't qualify for DLA mobility as the boys can walk, albeit never alone or in a safe manner, and they attack each other in the car.

Just seems that since we had SN kids we've been atatcked on every side- childcare, cars, eduation- for a situation we would never have ever chosen

Thanks Mildmannered. The Diesel rates are £115 / £180 for older cars, but I can't remember what they were last year!

Peachyclair - your 2litre Espace still wouldn't be in the gaz-guzzler band if it were newer, but it would be in the £205 a year band so you'd be paying £30 a year more.

Peachyclair - I also drive an Lreg car, I didn't mean that 'luxury' meant how much it is worth, but 'luxury' as in very big and expensive to run.

I couldn't afford to run a 'people carrier style vehicle' as they do seem to use a lot of petrol and can be high on Insurance etc. This to me equals luxury! I also do not need one. I have one son, and drive a sport coupe style car (Nissan 200sx). It is reliable and cheap to purchase at £1500!

I am not here to make digs at your family, but I don't see how a smaller family driving a 'sport car' should have to pay more on the road to someone who drives a 'people carrier' size vehicle. We don't use the car to commute as we can walk to work, so it isn't used every day, and ds isn't at school yet. I plan to walk him to school anyway.

I believe it is only vehicles after a certain year which will pay more duties anyway. Not an L reg!

No it isn't us, however I can't see we have an alternative but to run an MPV, so I don't think we should pay extra for wehat we didn't choose- that's all. In actuality our MPV costs less to run (esp. in insurance, bizarrely) than our older 1.6 proton. We didnt expect that but its true.

I also walk to Uni / school, dh cannot as it is 50 miles there and back- a but far. He works nights (so no buses) on an out of town industrial estate (so no trains). And as they stagger their shitts, there's no sharing wither, Believe me, I wish there was! With bridge tolls it costs us a fortune!

As soon as we can we're getting a smart car which we will use whenever its 2 or 1 of us in the car, and keep the MPV for family trips. I will have to be commuting for a year (PGCE) so it will be by far the greenest methiod. But its not going to work for the boys is it? Thats the thing.

You can only do your best.

And to me, someone with a large family and SN kids who drive the lowest sized engine in the class they need is doing their best.

As it happens, we might get help when DS3 gets his formal diagnosis in June (fingers crossed) and he might get mobility DLA (DS1 gets higher rate care but no mobility)

The big increases in vehicle excise duty are to cars in band G which only includes cars bought since March 2006 and with CO2 emissions of 225g/km so there are some people carriers which will escape this even when purchased new now.

• And as they stagger their shitts -

OT, can I just say that's one of the funniest typo's I've ever seen...

I must admit I was very surprised when I realised that the 1.6l Zafira was in the top bracket for the current tax. I bought it because I thought it would be the most 'green' people carrier with a small engine.

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have just been horrified to find that my very ordinary estate car is in Band F

It's not exaactly an enormous gas guzzler ( 1.8), just a practical car for a family of 4.

essebee
\link{http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/4834480.stm\VED bands)

essebee
VED bands

Iota is it new?

4 yrs old - Dec 2002

thats pants, I reckon there are going to be alot of people stung by this, i was considering selling my galaxy ths morning until i realised because of its age it not affected.

just been rifling my files - tax was £165 last yr, £190 this yr - think Gordon is putting it up to £200 next yr. I must admit I thought £190 was a bit steep when I renewed it.

actually i'm sure ours is £200 a year anyway, we pay around £100 every six months so it must be

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It's just another way of the government to make up a new tax really.

I watched a program recently about co2 and green house gases etc. It was basically saying that the Government is using 'the whole green house gas thing' as a way of making more money out of us. How true.

BellaLasagne & Eve,I totally agree with you about this government hating the countryside.I know countless people who ran up huge overdrafts waiting for the single payments to arrive.

My dad uncle & bil were all talking about the 4x4 tax yesterday.We have sheep & cattle & rely on a k reg defender to get over the muddy fields to feed them & do the shepherding.I don't know if that will be classed as a 'luxury car' by GB.

Peachclair,it is just plain wrong that you & other families in a similar situation are to be penalised like this.This government makes me so angry!

They'll be taxing fresh air next.......

Surely it's not beyond the wit of the government to make a distinction between people who genuinely need a bigger 4x4 vehicle and those who don't? I see lots of mums driving disgusting, environmentally unfriendly vehicles on the school run each day. (They are also extremely child unfriendly - have you read the statistics about injuries/death if you get hit by one of these??)In my opinion these people should be hit massively through taxes - just a shame that £400 probably won't make much of a dent in their husband's salary. Of course some people need a 4x4 for perfectly legitimate reasons - but they're in a minority.

BellaLasagne,that is exactly what I say to dh.Perhaps GB should also try,beard tax,red hair tax,extra tax on anyone over a size 16,pet tax.Also it is a long while since window tax was abolished.Perhaps he could try that one to.Oh I forgot,if you live in the country & presumeably have a nice view,you will be taxed on that too!

Bitter about this government?Me?

There is a very easy way for the Govt to find farmers and therefore give them discount on their road tax. All farmers plus any smallholders who keep sheep, goats, poultry, pigs etc have to register with DEFRA (a Govt department!) and have to complete regular returns and surveys about what they do.

Why can't the Govt do some Joined Up Thinking and use this data to offer some subsidy?

I know this wouldn't cover other busineses who would genuinely need 4x4s but come on, they love setting up Govt Agencies to manage these things...think of al the jobs they could create to manage such a scheme!!!

Cynical...moi...?!!!!