being a mum/mom in the US - this makes me want to express solidarity

[hatwoman]

I was actually quite moved by this article in the Grauniad. I wonder if mn hq could put a link (an official one on a banner) to their website . It really makes me angry that a country like the US can be so backwards.

SofiaAmes - it can't have been all that bad if you lasted 7 years. I can make a similar list to yours, I've been in the UK for 13 years. But then I'd be leaving out lots of very good and positive experiences too. Re the weather, it's getting better all the time, what with global warming and all

Well, I do have to agree with some of the points Sofia brings up Fri 09-Mar-07 07:58:41.

My husband is Scots, my children are, too.

But in all honesty, it would come as no shock to me if those children bolted like colts out of a paddock the second they turn 18.

Agree with quite a bit of Sofia Ames' post as well- although I like rain and loathe sunshine, so I don't mind the weather.

5 years we've been battling for servies for ds1- simple stuff that should be provided by health and education- and where do I keep having to buy in services from? yep - the States. Utterly ridiculous. And when there is someone providing a world class service on the NHS for very difficult to treat children- what do they do? Make it so impossible for him to work here he has to bugger off to the States. Great.

The lack of maternity leave etc surely has to be put in the context of the American working culture. ie limited holidays taken etc.

tbh I feel a bit sad that some of these posts reflect a which is better US or UK approach. never ever occured to me - as the article says there's plenty of issues that fall short here in the UK (I'm one of the first to jump and down about maternity health care) why do people think I used the word solidarity? it's a word that's about expressing support, empathy, it's about common desires and, to an extent values. Point scoring over the US and antagonism towards Americans couldn;t have been further from my mind.

There'll never be a perfect system anywhere, we all have to work around imperfect ones to the best of our ability, but I do completely concur with those posters who recognise what an amazing contribution to women's lifestyles great service (private and public) makes. Examples of best and worst practice can be found in every country - maybe we should collect a list of personal bests and see what light that throws some light on what we would like to see improved in future?

I'm with you, SofiaAmes. I'm sick of people slagging the USA when they've never even been there. One of my friends believes all the crap she's read and heard, thinks it's one of the worst places in the world to live (!) and can't understand why I love going - and she's never set foot in the States. Also agree with you that the way they make you feel in the UK for having the nerve to take maternity leave and for having the cheek of all cheeks to want part-time work when you've got small children - stinks.

Droile - by the sounds of it you'd have lots in common with the MomsRising campaign, which I see was set up by American mums, living in USA, who want to improve things for other mums there. Is that more acceptable, I guess they know what they're talking about, not just something they read in The Sun.

I have no objection to people in their own country/culture trying to improve their own circumstances, but I will never understand why so many people think they know what's better for someone else. Ironically isn't that one of the main criticisms of Bush and Americans is that we are always trying to tell other people that our way is the best way. Of course, having said that, I do think our way is the best way....for us! Perhaps we don't feel the need to rise up and protest about our lack of vacations, because we like our lives so much that we don't need 6 weeks vacation from them!

(By the way Cristina, I lasted 7 years not because it wasn't so bad, but because that was the best thing for my husband. It was that bad. In fact so bad that when it came time for my children to start school, I moved back to the usa before my husband could come.)

I see your point, Sofia. Of course, I do!

I think the BBC has a lot to answer for, tbh.

Part of my expat life is taking criticisms of my native country. I accept that.

But I cannot conceive of hating an entire class of people just because of their nationality, and so I fail to see why this is so acceptable here in this one instance.

I would have never ever made such gross assumptions about British people without ever having set foot in their nation. Indeed, I think you'll find it's beyond the scope of a lot of Americans' imaginations to do this.

It's more like an, 'Okay, they'll do it their way, I'll do it mine.'

The point scoring thing, too.

Oh, America is so interfering.

K. And England hasn't been?

Yeah, okay. But whenever you try to bring that up, it's a no-go zone.

Jimjams and Droile, if I remember correctly (please excuse me if my too-many-children's-birthday-parties-brain is a bit addled) you both have sn children. My impression is that things are a bit easier here both in terms of availability of people/dr's to perform services and the services you can get through the state. I have made good friends with the mother of an aspergers child here, and she seems really happy with what is available for her son. He is in her/our local mainstream state school (with full time aide provided by the state) and we met because he is in the afterschool program (minus his aide-because they are happy to make the extra effort themselves) and is friends with my ds. She works full time and really doesn't seem any more harrassed than any other mother of 2 young children. My understanding is that there is at least 1 sn child in all the classes.
Maybe you should move out here jimjams!! We even have a few places in california where it rains a lot. You could go and work for my father....he needs someone smart to write his grants.

I have an SN child, too, Sofia - dyspraxia. Am just now starting research into how this disorder is approached in the US, as my children and I are dual nationals.

So far the support we've received has been very good, but this is also Scotland.

I hardly dare join in, but have to say that I'm finding Colorado an incredible place to live (Expat I may find that tougher when I have to start working). It is an incredibly child-friendly place though - far more so than Scotland where my children were born. I appreciate I have a lot to learn here in the US, but that's half the fun of living here in my mind. Our health insurance provides incredible service - I know I pay a premium but that includes out of hours and emergency - consultants available immediately for referrals and oncology treatment which is amazing. I know someone recovering from Breast Cancer. So this English Woman is embracing US life. I'll let you all know when I run into issues I don't like, but so far it's a million times better than Blair's Britain. Sorry. And yes I'll be glad when Bush is out too.

Is there a tongue-sticky-outty thingy emoticon, ali ?

I miss CO sometimes so much. My Boulder.

I think of how my childrens' lives would be there. How if we went back there, how they'd be so welcomed.

I know they may take off. I have to prepare myself for this. I know their Scottish accent would be welcomed far better than in some parts of the UK. That's just the truth of it.

Who knows? Maybe if they do, we'll follow them.

As if, Expat . I know you miss it. Can understand why you left too. Funny isn't it that I trade in Scotland for your neck of the woods. Ds1 has got via Open Enrol into a fabbie school for 07/08 so I'm chuffed, very lucky too. Even with how my life's turned out I know this is where I want to be. So hey, at least you'll always have another port of call to visit.

I've been living in Michigan for just over three years and on the whole I really like it here, DS was born here and the whole pg / doctor / birth experiance was great. My DH has a good job which has great insurance and if we lived back in the UK I would'nt be able to be a SAHM.
On the other hand my brother (who lives in the UK) had a brain tumour about 18 months ago, the medical attension he has recieved has been excellent. If he had been in th US, I'm sure he would have had just as good medical treatment but he would have had a $100,000 bill at the end of it as he was unemployed at the time of his diagnoisis (sp?).
The UK and USA are very different countries, they share a language and thats the end of the similarities. I don't think it's right to compare the two on these issues, both systems have thier plus points and there down sides.
Can't we just all get along?

You're absolutely right, Ivor. They're very different places, worlds apart. More than you can imagine until you have lived in both countries. Let's just get along!

hey I love the english, I'm on my second (and hopefully last) english husband....! Though (she whispers) the first one was an essex boy and poor little american me didn't know any better. Now I've got a northeasterner and as long as I regularly purchase Newcastle United paraphernalia....he's happy. I got him a registration for his car here that says NUFC GO. It only cost me $40 since it's meaningless here, but as anyone from that part of the world knows, I have accumulated enough brownie points with that one to last the rest of my life.

expat, I think you will find that how sn are dealt with varies wildly from state to state (a bit like from one european country to another, or as you mentioned from scotland to england). Let me know if you need any help tracking things down, ordering books etc. from the States. Happy to help. And my dh goes back and forth regularly, so is able to ferry things if necessary.

I have taught in the US (private & state special ed schools) and have to agree that, sadly, SN provision really does vary dramatically from state to state, even school district to school district. If you're lucky enough to have good provision then well done!

It really shouldn't be the battle it often is (in both the US & the UK)

Interesting to read all of your comments. I've paid special attention to those who compare quality of life between the two countries.

Starting in late July, Dd and I will be living in America for 1-2 years. I've left all doors ajar here in case we can't stand it there (flat will be rented out rather than sold, dd's school promises a place if/when we come back etc). We're happy here other than obvious things like tiny/cramped flat that costs a fortune, general cost of living that means we do without extras others routinely have. But, I really can't complain as we are in a fortunate situation and within reason, can mostly do the things we want if we budget carefully.

We'll be reclaiming our house in the US which is worth about the same amount of money as the London flat and is 5x larger, on a quiet street (dd will be able to 'play out'), and has a decent size garden. DD will either be in a very good state school (state primary in our area is great, middle/upper school are dodgy), or in a private school that costs 50% less than her current school fees. Of course, in America she won't be going on school trips to the Natural History Museum/National Gallery, etc, but she'll have a school with wonderful facilities (including the sorts of playing fields you'd never have in London because of property prices/lack of space).

There's no question that our physical life will be more comfortable, easier and less expensive. What concerns me most is how I will find the people and their attitudes. What has everyone else experienced in that area?

I'll leave you all to it. In my opinion social policy which allows women only 2 weeks maternity leave and an average of 2 weeks paid leave a year is very backwards. That's the word that hurt but that's how it is IMO. You can counteract with the amazing lifestyle as much as you want. I haven't lived in the USA but have visited, going again in May. I haven't lived in China either but I think I can discuss about freedom of speech there, even if I miss some subtle context or another.

Regarding children with SN, I'm on en American email list and the situation doesn't seem all that rosy, some quite appalling practices in fact. Good ones as well, of course, but not all rosy.

Regarding children with SN, I'm on en American email list and the situation doesn't seem all that rosy, some quite appalling practices in fact. Good ones as well, of course, but not all rosy.

still {sad} at how people have taken my original post and ignored my subsequent one. In particular I am sad at "But I cannot conceive of hating an entire class of people just because of their nationality, and so I fail to see why this is so acceptable here in this one instance." finding its way on to a thread that was about supporting mums and parents in a different country. same for the "gross assumpations" who has made gross assumptions? and who is trying to tell someone else what's best for them? (which in itself assumes that all Americans want the same thing - it's not true that Americans are all happy with their vacations and that they're not protesting...) the link was to a website set up by americans. The only assumption I made was to credit them with a reasonable amount of accuracy in describing their experiences.

Of all my time on MN I don;t think I have ever felt quite so upset. I can't believe I that an expression of solidarity with an organisation of mums who are unhappy with and trying to change their circumstances has turned into this {sad} {sad} {sad}