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Original poster

Except it isn't in the news - government is trying to bury this

183 replies

Freckle · 05/02/2007 17:58

Was sent the email copied below. If you care about freedom and want to avoid more Big Brother heavy-handedness from this government, sign the petition.

Apparently there is only one month left to register your objection
to the 'Pay as you go' road tax.

The petition is on the 10 Downing St website but they didn't tell
anybody about it. Therefore at this time only 250,000 people had
signed it so far and 750,000 signatures are required to stop them
introducing it.

Once you've given your details (you don't have to give your full
address, just house number and postcode will do), they will send
you an email with a link in it. Once you click on that link, you'll
have signed the petition.

Democracy in action?
The government's proposal to introduce road pricing will mean you
having to purchase a tracking device for your car and paying a
monthly bill to use it. The tracking device will cost about £200
and in a recent study by the BBC, the lowest monthly bill was £28
for a rural florist and £194 for a delivery driver. A non working
mother who used the car to take the kids to school paid £86 in one
month.

On top of this massive increase in tax, you will be tracked.
Somebody will know where you are at all times. They will also know
how fast you have been going, so even if you accidentally creep
over a speed limit in time you can probably expect a Notice of
Intended Prosecution with your monthly bill.

If you care about our freedom and stopping the constant bashing of the car driver, please sign the petition on No 10's new website
(link below) and pass this on to as many people as possible.

petition
Hope you don't mind me sending it

OP posts:
breadgirl · 05/02/2007 18:12

My friend, who works for a transport planning company, told me about plans for this a couple of years ago .. we argued over it

CountessDracula · 05/02/2007 18:13

giving them your house no and postcode does give them your full address btw

wannaBeWhateverIWannaBe · 05/02/2007 18:15

there was something about this on 5 live last week.

I say bring it on. the charging not the petition...

Greensleeves · 05/02/2007 18:17

I'm not totally against it. Cars are massively overused and are environmentally disastrous. We can't just go on pretending the problem doesn't exist.

It would be even better if they hypothecated the proceeds into improving public transport, but sadly that's probably pie in the sky.

CountessDracula · 05/02/2007 18:17

I am in favour of charging too
It should stop unnecessary journeys

Original poster
Freckle · 05/02/2007 18:18

I'm not totally against charging by use, but it is the fact that the government will know where I am, where I am going, etc. all the time. If I inadvertently exceed the speed limit (which I'm sure we all do occasionally) I will automatically get a fixed penalty and points on my licence.

OP posts:
AitchTwoOh · 05/02/2007 18:19

a car is a privilege, not a right, and it's a privilege that people abuse. bring on the charges, i say.

Aloha · 05/02/2007 18:19

Charging is one thing, the government having the right to know exactly where you are at all times is quite another. I am VERY disturbed by the continual erosion of our right to privacy. It is a fundamental human right and a hallmark of a free country.

Original poster
Freckle · 05/02/2007 18:19

Surely, if they want to charge by use, they could take your annual mileage when you have your MOT and send you a bill then. If you are sensible, you will save a little each month so that the bill isn't an awful shock to your finances.

OP posts:
wannaBeWhateverIWannaBe · 05/02/2007 18:20

and so you should. the speed limit is there for a reason. and don't you think that if the government want to know where you are and where you're going they have ways of finding that out without you having a device in your car?

Aloha · 05/02/2007 18:20

No, I don't think the government should track ordinary citizens. The government is supposed to be our servant, not our master. That is totalitarianism.

lockets · 05/02/2007 18:20

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn

AitchTwoOh · 05/02/2007 18:21

anyone who has a mobile can be tracked no problem, although i do take aloha's point. but if it's a straight milometer i have no problem.

ScummyMummy · 05/02/2007 18:22

hmm. care about freedom but approve of bashing car driving (as opposed to drivers) so am not sure whether to sign...

pirategirl · 05/02/2007 18:22

Why bring it on?

Greensleeves · 05/02/2007 18:23

Hmm, Aloha does have a point there. I'm in favour of the charging, but the surveillance is definitely a bad thing.

Original poster
Freckle · 05/02/2007 18:23

We already have a milometer in our cars, which could be used to assess mileage. I really don't think we need another government-imposed device (for which they will make us pay, as with ID cards). The means to assess usage are already there. This device is just another loss of freedom.

OP posts:
Greensleeves · 05/02/2007 18:23

although it's actually the car they're tracking, not the person per se....

wannaBeWhateverIWannaBe · 05/02/2007 18:24

but this is assuming that the government want to know where you are. they don't, they want to know where your car is driving so that you can be charged accordingly. You could have more than one registered driver for your vehicle - it's the car they're tracking not the driver.

Surely you should only be bothered about people knowing where you are if you have something to hide.

Plus this could have benefits surely - if your car was stolen its whereabouts could be traced without having to have people out looking for it.

Original poster
Freckle · 05/02/2007 18:26

But it's about the gradual erosion of all our freedoms. The vast majority of people drive the same car and I'm not sure I want the government to track where my car is going anyway.

I have nothing to hide, but I don't necessarily want the government to know more about me than is necessary for them to govern sensibly and wisely.

OP posts:
Greensleeves · 05/02/2007 18:28

If it's on their website, I don't think they can be accused of burying it. If I wanted to bury something I wouldn't start by publishing it on the internet.

It's not the duty of government to put a fluorescent leaflet through your letterbox every time they make policy. It's up to you to keep yourself informed as well.

wannaBeWhateverIWannaBe · 05/02/2007 18:28

and why is it a loss of freedom? has this proposal included putting restrictions on where you are allowed to drive?

The charging is required to cut down unnecessary journeys. Too many people are too hasty to jump into their cars to drive ... to the local shops, to drop the kids off at the local school when walking would be just as easy. if people knew they would have to pay for those journeys, they might be less inclined to do so.

The tracking of where you are going is necessary to ensure the payments are adjusted according to where/when you are driving. e.g. if you're driving at peak times it will cost you more.

people want something done about climate change. cutting down unnecessary car journeys is a start on that.

Aloha · 05/02/2007 18:28

I'm sorry, but I think the 'why shouldn't you want the government to know where you are if you have nothing to hide' is a very poor and dangerous argument. Governments are supposed to serve us, not spy on us while we are just going about our daily business. It's not any of, say, John Prescott or Harriet Harman's business where I am on a Tuesday afternoon. And suppose a government was elected that didn't like you going to your Amnesty International meeting on Monday night? I think this government is getting away with murder on the question of our human rights, I really do. I am shocked that people care so little about it.

CountessDracula · 05/02/2007 18:30

I agree a mileometer reading on an annual basis would be far preferable.

Greensleeves · 05/02/2007 18:31

I agree with that too CD. Then we can penalise unnecessary car use without invading people's privacy.