Pauline Cafferkey could be struck off

[vanillaelderberry]

here

I really sympathise with her. Must be horrendously stressful.

IF she acted dishonestly she could have personally been responsible for hundreds, thousands of deaths, immeasurable cost and disruption. Again, IF guilty she should also be taken to task by the legal system. What she did previously is irrelevant to this.

What has she done? Is there a link?

Why did they not take the initial high temperature more seriously?

From the link in the OP:

Cafferkey’s temperature was high, so PHE’s staff were alerted, said the volunteer, who wanted to remain anonymous. Her temperature was taken six more times, but eventually, the volunteer said, Cafferkey was told she could board her flight to Glasgow.

If that is true then surely the person/s at fault is the person or persons who had been alerted to the high temperature and then let it repeatedly be taken again, and eventually acted on the lower temperature, and not the first one?

Humans lie and break rules all the time. For example nicking a pen from your employer, driving faster than the speed limit, pulling a sickie. In most jobs a case of gross misconduct might lose you your job, but not necessarily your career. There are lots of skilled jobs which people's lives depend on where employees are not punished as harshly as nurses. Why should nurses be more on a pedestal than other human beings?

I imagine that stress and tiredness lead to poor judgement. Maybe Pauline's emotional needs were not looked after properly. It must have been hard being miles from your family and facing dying people everyday. Even the most professional of nurses might crack under the strain.

I don't think the punishment of striking a nurse off for life should be used too freely. A formal warning is enough. I think that having Ebola and knowing that you have exposed your loved ones to Ebola is enough of a punishment.

I strongly suspect PHE cocked up in her initial screening and this is their way of deflecting blame. The NMC have a history of conducting witch hunts while other professionals get a slap on the wrist and walk away.

Irresponsible.... Totally

She absolutely should be struck off! Of course she should, it wasn't the flu fgs!

Humans lie and break rules all the time. For example nicking a pen from your employer, driving faster than the speed limit, pulling a sickie. In most jobs a case of gross misconduct might lose you your job, but not necessarily your career. There are lots of skilled jobs which people's lives depend on where employees are not punished as harshly as nurses. Why should nurses be more on a pedestal than other human beings?

That's not necessarily true, really. In an employment lawyer and am aware that a reference stating that an employee has been dismissed for gross misconduct will make it fairly hard for most people to get another job

Re: why are nurses held to an allegedly higher standard. Any profession that requires the trust of the public and/or carries a certain amount if responsibility, requires honesty. My DH is a dentist, I'm a solicitor. It was made explicitly clear during our training that any acts of dishonesty, however small, would lead to dismissal and a report to our respective regulatory bodies. I have no problem with that and think it's perfectly reasonable

"That's not necessarily true, really. In an employment lawyer and am aware that a reference stating that an employee has been dismissed for gross misconduct will make it fairly hard for most people to get another job "

There is a difference between hard to get another job and impossible. I know someone who was fired for gross misconduct because she failed to call in sick. She did manage to get another job, but she had other references.

The burden of proof for firing an employee for gross misconduct is not that high if the supposed gross misconduct happens during the probation period. Other than maternity, employment rights don't kick in for the first two years. You can fire an employee because you don't like them during the probation period. Personality clashes are often a cause of employment going wrong.

My mother had a friend who was a midwife and diagnosed with bipolar. Her manager tried to make out that she was incompetent and not fit to practice. There is an issue with malicious behaviour by senior nursing managers to get rid of people they don't like.

www.suspension-nhs.org

Dismissing an employee because you "don't like them". Is not the same as dismissing an employee for committing an act of dishonesty amounting to gross misconduct. and referring then to their professional body.

The long and short of it is that if you have a professional registration, an act of dishonesty (however small) will most usually lead to being struck off that register

I cannot comment on the midwife example, as I don't know the facts of the matter but the facts to be determined here are fairly narrow and have nothing to do - as far as I'm aware - with any alleged malicious behaviour by senior nursing managers.

Plenty of people exhonourated by professional bodies, but the 18 months of hell is too much. Senior managers in the NHS vary and unfair dismissal does happen in the NHS. People do get bullied by managers in lots of employment settings.

The bully in the NHS has more weapons at her disposal.

Whatever you think of Pauline Cafferkey the details of her case should never have been published on the NMC website. Even the NMC have apologised to Pauline's legal representatives. Why is it that high standards of conduct is only for minions who put their lives at risk. You can bet that the idiot who leaked the details of Pauline's case will not have their career wrecked.

If it's true then she should be struck off. Imo they should also review training and consider psychological profiling for medical professionals who volunteer to work overseas in emergencies.
Pauline Caffeykey has consistently acted in a manner that could have posed a risk to others - from going to a general hospital when she first fell ill to visiting schools when she felt ill during her second illness.
Either her training was woefully inadequate or she ignored it.

"Pauline Caffeykey has consistently acted in a manner that could have posed a risk to others - from going to a general hospital when she first fell ill to visiting schools when she felt ill during her second illness."

Really. It's not as if any knew that Ebola could flare up again. The early symptoms of Ebola are just like flu. I imagine that if Pauline had no idea that her slight headache was Ebola. Hardly anyone else has had a flare up if Ebola months after the original infection. Usually people die.

I am shocked at quite how judgemental this thread is. I just hope Pauline is treated fairly.

Really I have worked in overseas emergencies. I know the risk assesments and procedures. I have had colleagues come home and be taken ill. Hence my comment that if she followed the guidance she was given then her training was completely inadequate.

If true it was a stupid mistake but the fact is she helped save a lot of lives, risked her own life and nearly died herself. That's enough of a punishment IMO. She should get some sort of caution/warning.

That "stupid mistake" could have cost many more lives. If she mislead people about her symptoms, and boarded a flight knowing she might have Ebola, then yes she should be struck off.

The early symptoms of Ebola are just like flu. I imagine that if Pauline had no idea that her slight headache was Ebola

Wouldn't you be extra cautious though?

Are you suggesting that Pauline should check herself into the Royal free every time she had a slight headache for the rest of her life? Having a recurrence of Ebola like happened to Pauline is extremely rare.

"Are you suggesting that Pauline should check herself into the Royal free every time she had a slight headache for the rest of her life? Having a recurrence of Ebola like happened to Pauline is extremely rare."

Actually, yes if I were her care team I would be recommending pretty much that (isolation for tests, Royal Free if test results are concerning). It may be rare, but it happens to her.

IF she acted dishonestly she could have personally been responsible for hundreds, thousands of deaths, immeasurable cost and disruption

No, she wouldn't. Ebola spread so quickly in Liberia, Guinea and Sierra Leone largely because of inadequate health care in those countries. We have 280 doctors per 100,000 people; Guinea has 10. It also spread because of the initial dearth of knowledge about it and about how to avoid it - obviously by the time Pauline Cafferkey became ill the world had become much better informed. Of course one death would be too many, but let's not scaremonger and exaggerate.

Why the hell would she cover it up if she thought she had ebola?! Surely she'd want treatment asap after watching so many people die agonising deaths.

Ebola was spread by certain cultural practices like mourners set a funeral washing the body. Ebola is not air bourne, it's spread through bodily fluids like sweat, blood, faetes, vomit, spermicide etc. In west Africa there is not just a lack of doctors, but a lack of money to pay those doctors. Many Ebola victims are nursed at home in the slum they live in. The slums have no proper sewage and maybe very crowded.

I don't believe Pauline would choose to put her family's lives at risk. Would a nurse really want to risk their loved ones dying of Ebola?

I feel the issue was lack of organisation of public health England. A flight from west Africa carrying 300 people needs more than four nurses to check everyone's safety. Telling extremely tired volunteers to check their own temperatures was pure laziness.

I feel public health England should also be held up to account for their decisions on that day. (The managers of the four public England nurses, not the four nurses themselves.)

NHS Managers often put blame on to frontline staff to deflect blame from their own failings.

telling extremely tired volunteers to check their own temperatures was pure laziness

YY

'NHS Managers often put blame on to frontline staff to deflect blame from their own failings.'

Yep it's very common!

Should be struck off - in her position, any hint of a temperature she should have got herself into isolation - selfish idiot. I was amazed at the time that they didn't wait until safely past the incubation period, and some thorough screening before returning home. To risk infecting a whole other continent with Ebola - unbelievable.

I doubt she covered anything up and it was the screening which was at fault. She didn't hide a high temp, and they tested her seven times before deciding she was fit to travel.

Cafferkey had worked with Ebola patients and seen them die (horribly). If she'd had any inkling she had Ebola she'd hardly have sneaked on a plane, intending to spend a couple of days at home in bed with some Beechams and a hot water bottle would she?