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Penelope Leach attacks Gina Ford, apparently

39 replies

emkana · 09/05/2004 12:34

here

OP posts:
bloss · 09/05/2004 12:41

Message withdrawn

emkana · 09/05/2004 12:44

There you go, bloss - here's the article in full:

May 09, 2004

Queens of baby care in clash over tough love
Judith O?Reilly and Jon Ungoed-Thomas
Parents risk ?mental harm?

WHEN it comes to bringing up a baby, they are the giants. But now Penelope Leach, the author and child psychologist, has launched a scathing attack on the theories of fellow expert Gina Ford, claiming they could undermine a child?s development and even cause psychological damage.
Leach came to prominence in 1977 with her book Your Baby and Child. Her strategy of being very responsive to a child?s demands ? dubbed ?baby knows best? ? was adopted by a generation of mothers.

Two decades later Ford, a former maternity nurse who lives in Edinburgh, published The Contented Little Baby Book and asserted that a baby certainly did not know best. She recommended a strict regime which she said would result in a happy baby and stress-free nights.

It was a challenge to the more liberal views of Leach but the book rapidly notched up sales of more than 250,000. At dinner parties across the country, parents would congratulate themselves on balancing their hectic schedules and family life with the help of Ford?s strategy.

Ford?s schedules, which parents say are ?military? in their precision, cover every aspect from the exact time to open the ?blackout? curtains of the baby?s room to the number of times a day the baby should be fed. Mothers were advised not to cuddle their baby whenever they felt like it.

Leach, a psychologist, has revealed serious concerns about Ford?s advice. In an article on behalf of the Association for Infant Mental Health, she warns that Ford?s theories could ?distort? the relationship between parents and their baby.

She is careful not to name Ford in the article in the association?s newsletter, but warns that a regimented upbringing ? including ?controlled crying? where a baby is left in its cot despite its protests ? can undermine the child?s sense of ?secure attachment?.

She writes: ?The security of an infant?s attachment to mother and the sensitivity of her care go together. Stress, including the stresses that lead to insecure attachment, damages an infant?s capacity to learn and may in extreme cases damage it for ever.?

Leach?s views are endorsed by the association. Paul Barrows, its chairman and a child psychotherapist, said he was concerned that too regimented an upbringing might undermine a child?s sense of its worth.

?It might be good if you want them to fit into some very structured system like the army, but not if you want to foster individuality or imagination,? Barrows said.

Ford, who has no children of her own and has been described as a cross between Jean Brodie and Barbara Woodhouse, said last week that she was disappointed by the article and disputed its conclusions.

?I?m a great admirer of Penelope Leach and there will always be different schools of thought, but what I find totally ridiculous is implying the parents who follow my books are damaging children,? she said.

?My book is strict on the parent, but it?s not strict on the baby because the baby?s needs are being met. I say in my book that I would be horrified if any of my babies cried more than five or 10 minutes a day. This isn?t about denying a baby food or love.?

Ford is not wholly convinced by Leach?s theories. ?Mothers not only have to cope with the family, they have to cope with work. We must move forward and help them with this,? she said.

?There was this huge gap for more than 20 years where mothers were told they had to use their instincts, pick the baby up, let the baby sleep in bed and do what it wants. It can be very tiring for the parent and also may mean the child doesn?t learn the right sleep habits.?

Shelley Kerr, 32, a mother of two who lives near Ashford in Kent, follows Ford?s advice. She says it does not affect her relationship with her children.

Kerr, who has six-month-old Oscar and three-year-old Amelia, said: ?My son still has an enormous amount of love and an enormous amount of cuddles, but a baby needs routine. Especially with a baby, it?s a lot of guesswork, trying to work out what they want.

?The people I?ve heard speak negatively about Gina Ford or her book are people who haven?t done it. They?ve heard about her, maybe flicked through the book and thought ?Oh God, that looks like hell?.?

Abby Flanagan, 37, from London, said she tried to follow Ford?s theories when her son was born. ?It didn?t suit me at all,? she said.

?It just wasn?t the way I wanted to bring up my child. I had a few friends that did do it and, yes, they did have contented babies but, no, they didn?t have much of a life.?

Leach, who has two grown- up children, wrote Your Baby and Child to help to convey to parents that the relationship with a baby was one of ?negotiation and compromise?. It has sold more than 2m copies in 29 languages.

Ford has had more professional practical experience of baby care than Leach, working as a maternity nurse for more than 12 years. She now runs a consultancy for parents who use her strategy.

Leach said last week that her article had been prompted by the concerns of other professionals. ?When I meet child minders who tell me, ?I have had to alter my entire daily routine because I am not allowed to take this child off the premises between 9.30am and 10.15am because he has to be in a dark room to be asleep for particular minutes of the day?, then I think, heavens to Betsy, it has all gone a bit far.?

OP posts:
eddm · 09/05/2004 13:14

That's a bit hard on GF (no experience of her routines, sounded like too much hard work for me when I read the book). Seems as if PL is trying to do GF down and say 'I'm the only parenting guru in the village!'. For heaven's sake, when will these experts learn that they aren't perfect and stop handing down advice as if it is God's word and mustn't be questioned and anyone who follows a different path is WRONG?

GF, as far as I remember, doesn't suggest you leave your baby to cry for ages or when they are genuinely distressed, or that you shouldn't cuddle them! She may not suit everyone but she strikes me as someone who is trying to help mothers balance the all-consuming needs of babies with the realities of having to run a home, cope with other children and go to work.
We are all grown-ups capable of making our own decisions about which parenting guru to follow, if any. Or throwing all the books out of the window...

bloss · 09/05/2004 13:55

Message withdrawn

kiwisbird · 09/05/2004 13:55

I'm with Ms Leach all the way... I read your baby your child with DS (now 10) and we never had so much as one tantrum. He slept through pretty much when he was good and ready, and fed at night til about 14 mths off me!
I read GF out of interest and aside from allowing a baby to settle itself very early on in life and black out curtains, she has done nothing for me!

hercules · 09/05/2004 14:02

Havent read miss leach but the article below pretty much summarises what i think of gina ford although i'm sure gf doesnt intend it.

zaphod · 09/05/2004 14:22

I also got PL's book when ds1, now 10, was a baby, I refer to it as my bible, and was lucky enough to meet her at a childcare conference, and say how much her book had helped me. I think with your first child you need all the help you can get, wherevever it comes from.

tigermoth · 09/05/2004 21:39

Penelope Leach's book was the only child care book I ever flicked through. Looks like I Should have read it cover to cover though. My sons still had plenty of tantrums - kiwisbird I am well impressed you and PL got your son through toddlerhood with no tantrums at all

now I must read that article.

aloha · 09/05/2004 22:17

Oh poo to you Penelope Leach. Her books did much more to make me feel inadequate than Gina Ford. She was full of romantic guff about how babies will be entranced to watch you peel potatoes. Ha! She never met my son. I felt dreadful that he would cry instead of gurgling happily in the kitchen. And what's so 'gone to far' and 'damaging' about giving children regular sleeps FFS? My son is so very much happier with a regular routine. If I break it, it is very much a selfish thing to do for my sake (ie I want to be out somewhere at his naptime) because he sure as hell would be happier in his bed. Anyway, there are independent studies showing that babies who have a a routine gain weight better than those who don't. I do find this sort of stuff - ie if you have a routine that suits your child you are practically a child abuser - extremely tiresome. How difficult is it to be at home for 45 minutes between 9.30 and 10.15??

aloha · 09/05/2004 22:19

My son, who is three in September is a very happy, healthy and extravagantly loving little boy who doesn't have tantrums either (so far!) btw.

bloss · 10/05/2004 02:44

Message withdrawn

hmb · 10/05/2004 06:37

And hasn't PL said at some time that with motherhood you have to 'keep giving until you drop', or words to that effect?

To my mind balence is all. A happy baby and a happy mother. Both my children were happier with a routine (and I didn't read GF before I had them and still haven't)

And having a tantrum free toddler is often just due to luck. Dd and ds were raised the same way. Dd could tantrum for Britain, and ds had about 3 mini tantrums, saw it didn't get him anything, and stopped. Nothing to do with how he was reaised in mt experience. Same thing, dd eats anything, ds is very picky. I'd put dd'd diet down to how she was weaned (ie my good work). Loada crap, did the same for ds and he is the chicken nugget king If you have the great good fortune to have a tantrum free child just thank your good fortune

serenequeen · 10/05/2004 06:41

completely agree with you, aloha. that potato peeling comment really got on my nerves too! now that ds is older and we are having playdates, it is absolutely the norm to arrange things around naps - given the controversy around GF it can't possibly be because all the parents were GF-ers.... so why is it acceptable now but seen as (paradoxically) either (1) ridiculous neurosis and control freakery not to "just make your baby fit in with you" or (2) some kind of child abuse when as a baby your child has a routine that suits you both?

tigermoth · 10/05/2004 09:51

Not everyone wants a factual baby book. Some of us want to be lied to

I loved the fairy tale feel of Penelope Leach's writing. I spent most of my pregnancy in a slight shock of denial, and just did not want to read about the practical side or focus on the problems. I get palpitations when I read any text book.

PL's writing made me feel more maternal and dewy eyed. I needed that purple prose and realised it wasn't going to be like that for me, but wanted a dream to hold on to. I spent 5 days in hospital after my son's birth, getting the nurses to take me through the practical stuff.

MrsDoolittle · 10/05/2004 10:01

Isn't it possible that we are all somewhere in between?

Piffleoffagus · 10/05/2004 10:03

As with all parenting its about what works best for you at the time, ds never had tantrums, nothing to do with PL although I totally followed her philosophy, this was 10 yrs ago btw, baby routine visonaries such as GF and whisperers were not around then (!!) The only other alternative was Dr's Spock or Green, now Chris Green is pretty cool and highly sensible! A good compromise.
If I can fluke no tantrums with dd (18mths) then I'll take the credit myself I think!
What I meant below was that I agree/identify with PL far more so than with GF, because its right for me, can see how GF would be helpful too, despite my personal view of her method
Right back to being an earth mother
LOL
xx kiwi

bloss · 10/05/2004 10:19

Message withdrawn

aloha · 10/05/2004 10:28

Also PL and Gina Ford have written completely different books for different purposes. GF wrote a book about what sort of feeding and sleeping routines suit babies in her experience, for other mothers who want guidance as to a routine. It isn't a comprehensive baby book, like Penelope Leach's or Miriam Stoppard's. The single best bit of practical advice that I got out of a baby book was to put my son down for a sleep two hours after he woke up - and that was a GF tip. Worked like a dream for us. And I looked out my Penelope Leach last night and in her own way she is just as certain and bossy as GF - 'Your baby WILL enjoy X or Y". I agree with whoever it was who said that PL sounds determined to be the 'only parenting guru in this village'. But it's the attack on mothers supposedly causing damage to their babies by giving them naptimes that is upsetting for many women and annoying for even more.
My son needs a drink at 10am every day, otherwise he gets scratchy and upset. Sometimes I forget, and suddenly he starts to whine or cry or behave irrationally, and I look at my watch, and hey presto, it's 10am and I rush off to get him a drink. Nothing to do with GF at all, but proof that a routine is often child-driven and nothing to do with parental needs. Why can't PL accept that some babies are just different? Bandying extreme and judgemental terms around like 'insecure attachment' and ?damaged forever" without any evidence at all is outrageous IMO. Also what's all this "It might be good if you want them to fit into some very structured system like the army, but not if you want to foster individuality or imagination." Well I bet my son who has a regular daily sleep and regular meals and drinks, but who makes up stories and poems and plays elaborate games in which he is baby crocodile and I am mummy crocodile and we eat magic seeds and bask on rocks (pillows) is more bloody imaginative than Mr Barrows.
Grrr.

aloha · 10/05/2004 10:30

And what on earth has having regular sleeps and meals got to do with imagination anyway??
Oooh, here goes the blood pressure!

serenequeen · 10/05/2004 10:40

bloss, i agree with you about the contradictory criticism - i was trying to make the same point.

aloha - sending you serenity vibes...

Piffleoffagus · 10/05/2004 10:44

Isn't it awful to think that parenting advice has come down to market share arguments?
Perhaps we should boycott the lot and go back to Mother Knows Best, an oldie but a goodie!
Deep breathing Aloha, you are spectacularly and eloquently passionate about things, tis lovely to see!

sponge · 10/05/2004 10:54

You'd have thought that being well rested was a prerequisite for being well behaved, creative, imaginative, or anything else that requires a bit of concentration, rather than hindering it.
The only time my dd is fractious, badly behaved, whiny etc is when she's tired, and her concentration goes out of the window then.
And there's nothing peculiar to children in this - I can't concentrate properly or tackle anything that requires a bit of original thinking when I'm tired.
From what I've read of GF her approach is mainly to do with establishiong regular and sufficient feeding and sleeping and we all need those things. Although her methods might be a bit regimented for some and need a bit of adapting to your circumstances the basic idea must be a good one.

aloha · 10/05/2004 11:05

Thanks for the vibes SQ and all! Deep breath. Calming thoughts...

bloss · 10/05/2004 11:25

Message withdrawn

susanmt · 10/05/2004 13:38

I never read PL (sounds just as well really, as I never bother peeling potatoes!! ) but what GF and those who follow her have to accept is that not all children can follow this routine! I tried it with my dd1 and those who have read GF threads I've contributed to before will know that her authoritiative tone coupled with my PND totally floored me and put me in a mother and baby unit - all bacause my daughter wanted to sleep 3 hours after she woke up, not 2. If the tone of her book had been gentler, than I would not have worried so much, and therefore would not have got into such a state.

If only all these so called parenting gurus would realise that every baby and every parent is different, then thre would be a lot fewer worried and/or actually damaged parents and children out there!