Do you think the EU should be funding proper boats to bring migrants to Europe safely?

[Ubik1]

Been Reading the coverage.

I think that morally we should help these people come to Europe safely where their application fur asylum can be processed properly.

We should fund boats that are seaworthy and take them to designated centres. Each country should take a proportion of migrants .

Surely that's the moral thing to do?

These are real people ffs.

Why can Europe 'not take everyone that wants to come'? Ask yourself on what basis you say that. What are the issues? Lack of space? Lack of cohesiveness in society? What?

Mind you, I'm not saying migration is ever easy--not for the receiving country and not for the migrants. But people always have migrated and always will. What you say is not a fact, it's your belief. I am (respectfully) arguing that this belief is based on racism. Not on facts. Because as I mentioned above I have never seen such 'facts' mentioned when it comes to particular migrants eg Americans / Canadians / Italians etc, those 'like us', only to 'others'.

By the way I also believe the 'flow' that you refer to can never be stopped. Human desire for a better life will always be stronger than any stops. I feel proud that I live in a country that attracts foreigners. I welcomed in the UK and was treated equally. I do not want to live in a racist fortress.

These are people by the way on that ship. Not disease carrying criminals. People with stories and lives, just like you. Ask yourself if you would want to leave if you lived in a country with no prospects.

simple logistics for a start!! Somalia/Syria/Africa/.....big countries yes? lots of people and large families?

so......if anyone enters our country for example (UK) we have a duty to house/support everyone. could we cope with a large number arriving each week? maybe double compared to now? do we have the resources?

850....really? get a grip

In an ideal world, yes people could go where they like and escape the developing world but in reality where are all the jobs, housing, education and healthcare for them going to come from? Most of them will be low skilled, mon English speaking so unable to get a job, who's going to pay the benefits?
There will always be people seeking asylum etc but by opening the borders and providing free passage the numbers coming to Europe would double, or triple at least. At the moment the only thing stopping the majority of people in the developing world is lack of money to pay the smugglers, or fear of death/arrest on the journey. Take those risks away and of course pretty much everyone will want to come, why wouldn't they? Better life, free healthcare, housing, bright lights and big cities, fresh water, etc etc,
Yes we are lucky to have been born where and when we were but you'd be a fool to think that this lifestyle would be possible with double the amount offered people to provide for.

Excluding countries at war, I don't think it's true that everyone would want to move to europe. For many, many people the ties of family and community, familiarity, patriotism, outweigh the perceived economic benefits of migration. I don't know what the solution for the large numbers of people who do want to come. Even if open borders were practically possible, they're certainly not politically possible. I wonder if we could have some sort of EU wide equivalent of the US green card lottery.

I can't see an answer to this.
We can't keep rescuing them, it encourages the traffickers to 'send' more. Europe can't take them all, we can't send them back. What the fuck are we meant to do with these poor soles?

It is a fraught issue. The idea of people drowning as those who could help do nothing feels very wrong. You could say they choose to go on the boats, but maybe you could also say they have no choice. They must be desperate. This week was tragic. The picture of the greek rescuer with the body of a drowned child was heartbreaking. The people who were locked below on the other boat; many children. On the other hand, the b*ards who deliberately put these passengers in danger, leaving ships and running them into things are doing a roaring business

The countries bordering on the med are the ones dealing with all this. I don't know if the rest of the EU contribute to the policing. They don't contribute to the search and rescue anymore, I believe. I was wondering about the situation in Calais and why France don't seem to be doing more. But of course they may be shrugging their shoulders the same way that countries not bordering the med do in relation to these maritime attempts to land. Not my problem, mate.

Of course Australia is an island, so the maritime asylum seekers is the only method they need to stop to prevent people arriving illegally to claim asylum. Even if all maritime passage was stopped, there would still be overland attempts to enter Europe and traffickers.

I worked for many years in a specialist part of the NHS. We were overwhelmed by patients during the Gulf war who were stuck in the UK from their war torn country of origin.

We were seeing over 80 patients a day and even opened over Bank holidays and weekends to try and cope. I worked 12 hours a day seven days a week for three months. I once got a day off and slept for 18 hours straight.

Their Embassies were meant to pay for their care. They paid nothing. Not a single pound.

We presented invoice after invoice.

My mum is still on the waiting list for a hip replacement after six months.

She was a nurse for the NHS for 40+ years.

She is a person ffs.

If you disagree with me. My Mum was a pioneering nurse in the 1950's/1960's who fought against the brutal treatment dealt out to autistic/Down Syndrome children in her care.

The 'Go away and forget you had a child' was looked at and revaluated due to her pressure.

To go back to the point. No. The NHS does not have the money. They do not have the money to pay for special needs adults/children or the elderly

I care deeply about the people leaving a war torn country but we cannot support them.

Look to the guys who are charging them £500 plus to leave on a leaky boat.

Also the personnel clearing out the boats do not were haz mat suits for fun.

I disagree RedChecked. I am aware of the problems by the way. But I believe that the idea that 'the NHS does not have the money' etc (even if true) has to do with decisions a society makes. Our society here in the UK is extremely unequal, with lots & lots of money in sectors of society & with a very specific tax system that favours sectors of society. So the idea that 'we don't have the money' (although drummed into us) is questionable. It depends what 'we' want 'our' money spent on.

In the end it has to do with what kind of society we want to live in.

As an aside, I would like to question the idea that all migrants are ill, criminal, disabled etc. They have lots to contribute. Think of the courage it takes to leave your country for want of a better life. I'm speaking as a migrant myself ... although admittedly not one who arrived on a boat.

And of course if you just look around you you'll realise that the UK is, at its core, a multicultural society. Look back 1-2 generations (or even further back) you'll find in so many British people that they have family members who at some point came from another country & settled here. It's one of the nicest things about Britain, I'm so dismayed by the current UKIP rhetoric that's becoming frighteningly widespread.

I don't think it's people not wanting people to migrate, that's happened since the beginning of time. The problem is the UK can't cope with the peor that are already here let alone welcome more people in
If we had 0 unemployment, a low welfare bill, an NHS that was running efficiently without waiting lists and empty houses ad no homeless then sure, we could
Cope with more people, but as at is we can't.

If we had 0 unemployment, a low welfare bill, an NHS that was running efficiently without waiting lists and empty houses ad no homeless then sure, we could
Cope with more people, but as at is we can't.

^^ This

The UK (given the tiny size of our island) has finite space and resources. I don't think we should take in any of those people on the boats. But that is just my opinion.

Small islands?

Like Lampedusa? Which is virtually receiving these people single-handedly? Yet all the locals, when they know there's a boat arriving (and people in the UK hear only about the ones that don't make it remember, not the many many more that do) rush down to the shore, with blankets, and food, and toys for the children. And this has been going on for YEARS. I think as far as small islands go, it doesn't get much smaller. Yet they continue to help.

And please remember amidst all the pearl clutching, that the scary statistics are manipulated by everyone. With the exception probably of the NGOs. Who consistently point out that immigration of any kind, legal, illegal, economic, brain drain, refugee, asylum is far far lower than any political party would have us believe.

Immigration won't be Lowe Pugh of it's an open door policy and the people in these coupes know they will be welcomed and won't get sent back. More and more people will come.

I think as far as small islands go, it doesn't get much smaller. Yet they continue to help.

It's easier to say to send them back when it's thousands of miles from you.
When it's destitute people arriving at your door I suppose you tend to do your best not to let them die of hunger or cold.

What the fuck are we meant to do with these poor soles?

I don't know. Eat them? Walk on them? The mind boggles.

My mum is still on the waiting list for a hip replacement after six months.
I wonder how many brits in Spain and Portugal are taking the place of nationals there for hip replacements too.

It would only take one person with a highly infectious disease on one boat to completely disable the healthcare system of a small island. How could you quarantine an entire island?

FGS, people with highly infectious disease travel by plane all the time in much larger numbers. Including those on British passports.
The vast majority is not the type to completely disable entire healthcare systems, in whatever size islands.

Examples of highly infectious diseases: flu, chicken pox, the common cold.

Even if you mean Ebola and that sort of disease, we are more at risk from people on planes than these boats.

How could you quarantine an entire island?
by definition, it's an island, so quite easy to isolate. Just saying.

300,000 British pensioners in Spain using their free health care, the dirty foreign bastards. I bet some of them have had infectious diseases too. It is frightening how much racist rhetoric people seem to absorb without realising.

There isn't enough housing for people we have here already, the NHS is already stretched to it's limits, schools are rammed.. but yes lets send ships and welcome banners to pick up everyone who want to come here.

soloman did those 300,000 british pensioners go and seek asylum? Did they rock up with no money, no job, nothing in hand and expect to be housed? I very much doubt it. Emigration takes a lot of planning and quite a bit of money.

These people aren't migrants though, aren't they asylum seekers? Where are asylum seekers processed? Is there plenty of rooms etc? Or are we already struggling?

And where would the children go to school? Places are limited as it is

A fair proportion of the Med-Xers are economic migrants. One survivor interviewed is a Nigerian who worked successfully in Libya for 3 yrs before he became targeted by a militia. He didn't go back to Nigeria, instead hopped on a dodgy boat to Italy.

I think I can only handle the Australian solution, now. Best of a bad lot.