Missing MH370 thread cont...

[Pennies]

Old thread here

New thread here.

greatspoprendo apparently the police are searching the computer files on the simulator, presumably like any computer where everything in some form of memory/can be found if deleted
they want to see where his simulated flights went to according to sky news

Usually in a hostage situation the hijackers want as much publicity as possible - otherwise it's all a bit pointless. However, if the plane has been hijacked, to manage to make it disappear is a far scarier prospect for the public. I would imagine authorities are way ahead go what we are hearing about in the media. Whether it is a hijacking and they are on their tail, or it has crashed in the ocean.

Have never heard of this before but the US accidentally shot down an Iranian passenger plane in 1988 after incorrectly identifying it as a fighter plane en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_Air_Flight_655?Vincennes

I don't buy the hijacking at all at the minute, just seems so far fetched to have heard nothing etc. for some reason I feel it's looking like the pilot is involved. All other options seem too far fetched to have gone onto far with no other news. If it was a plane in America I'd be more likely to believe it. I expect if it was a hijacking, it was definitely one that's gone wrong. I'd be amazed if anyone is alive at this point :(

I think it was mentioned that Myanmar was a black hole in terms of radar. Not much coverage. It was on the last thread. But I could be wrong. Was certainly discussed though.

I still don't think it was suicide. Just wondering if someone got control of the cockpit again and put the plane into the ground/sea rather than let it be taken by hijackers. But then why stop searching over the ocean? Although Australian forces might be invoked as Tony Abbott suggested they might be used to search. So they haven't discounted the possibility of the plane heading that way it seems.

Involved not invoked stupid phone

It is all just so very sad.

It's awful to say that the pilot had anything to do with it before there is conclusive evidence. At the minute he should be considered a victim as much as any other person on board. I'm fine how his family feel hearing this? Just awful.

Thanks livingzuid - so it seems possible that the plane went that way. The next question is, how good is Chinese radar/ATC over Tibet and Xinjiang ?

Place marking

The thing is they all obviously know more than we do so if they are considering the pilot - and I believe suicide is a big no no for Muslims (not talking terrorists as such) then it's not something they will consider lightly. In the other cases of pilot suicide the home countries of the pilots refused to accept it in their own investigations because it goes against religion etc. thus in the Egypt air case the investigating bodies came to different conclusions.

Though actually they haven't mentioned pilot suicide, more just considering he may be involved. News conference starting now......

*How must his family feel hearing this?

Morning chaps and chapesses - 11 or 12 pages since I last came on and Ihave a very few minutes now before I talk with my sister (significant to those who saw another thread

I've only skimmed those pages but read quite a few things that are interesting and made sense and a lot of other things that are... erm. Well, yes. I won't be rude.

Let me just, once and for all, state very clearly and calmly and in bold (sorry for shouting)

You cannot land a 777 on a grass strip.

Whoever keeps coming back with that one, please kindly stop. It is rubbish. No current jet airliner can land on a grass strip. None. Not one. This one is really starting to tee me off! Youneed solid pavement and I posted a link from Boeing that showed what type of pavement it needs.

Also, the logisitics of targeting a specific group and/or specific cargo - when Al Qaeda planned 9/11, they took years over it. They probed & tested US security multiple times. They entered flight schools as ab initio students and worked up to being able to fly Boeing 757 and 767s. They targeted specific flights on a specific day to bring together one co-ordinated attack on multiple targets with multiple aircraft. This would seem to indicate that AQ do not rush their attacks; plan meticulously; and wait until the optimum time. Presumably these 20 American-employed electronics engineers were all going somewhere together for a reason. If it was known that Malaysian was a common via point for their travel on previous occasions, it's not rocket science to hack the GDS (Global Distribution System - the system that all airlines and travel agents use to actually make reservations on a certain flight on a certain day). If the agnecy used was known and you had even one or two names, then you would know when and where those people were going to be. Similar story for the cargo manifest - the consolidator (of which it sounds like we have one who posts here) may be known to the hijacker(s). What I'm sayng is that AQ plan with military precisiona dn that they have had 'sleepers' in the past that are just activated when needed. Their logistics are extremely good; their network and influence is extensive. They could pull something like this off.

That said, I don't necessarily believe it to be the case. I'm simply pointing out that their capabilities and patience go beyond 'event planning' and more into 'military invasion' areas.

"Goldie do you know what 0 altitude data he's referring to? Because if that bit of information is accurate, then his logical conclusion looks right."

Not really. The only 0 altitude indication I'm aware of is the ADS-B data sent on the last communication, but that could simply be the system being turned off.

Stop place marking!! It's so rude, just bookmark like everyone else :-(

question: i get that passengers couldn't be offloaded at 20,000 feet as doors couldn't be opened without depressurisation BUT can the cargo hold be opened at 20,000ft? is it a separate 'chamber' that can be opened without effecting the cabin? it's just that this would fit rather well with my if it was the gold theory of ditching the cargo contents at agreed coordinates.

25 countries now involved
sky news have a special prog at 10am and report at 1130

11 countries' lands being looked at

pilot & co-pilot did not ask to fly together

I was on the other thread goldie thanks for taking the time to stop by and update. Hope it goes well :)

I saw your other thread too Goldie - hope it goes well with your sis.

Fucking hell, 11 countries, that's a lot of land

One other comment before I have to go.

A lot of people have been going on about the 45,000 feet thing. I'm a bit dubious about that.

As you go up in altitude, the air becomes thinner. You rely on air passing over the wings to generate lift. The less dense the air, the less lift you generate. The aeroplane at the beginning was still quite heavy (with fuel). It would not have been able to climb to 45,000 feet at thst stage because it simply could not generate enough lift. If ithad tried, it would have stalled (stall on a plane is not like stall in a car - it's nothing to do withthe engine. Stall simplymeans there's not enough air passing over the wings to stay in the air any more).

A really, really good practical example of this is the Air France crash.

The pilot tried to climb out of trouble - he put the aircraft in a climb and put the engines to full power. The aeroplane would not climb. It stalled and carried on stalling more or less all the way down til it hit the Atlantic.

I think that this plane is in the same situation - i.e. too heavy to climb to 45,000 feet no matter how much power you put on. In any case, 45,000 feet is above the maximum cruising altitude approved for the 777. Even so, the aircraft would likely stay pressurised but I don't know if it could maintain the normal cabin pressure in the cabin (the cabin is pressurised to the equivalent of 8,000 feet). I suspect not but I don't know because it's never been done to the best of my knowledge.

I also read someone mentioning a theory about the doors being opened at 25,000 feet to 'get rid of passengers'. That isn't possible if the aircraft hasn't suffered a decompression. The doors won't open much above about 14,000 feet. Aeroplane doors work like a plug. As the aeroplane climbs, the pressure outside drops. The pressure inside is maintained at 8,000 feet. The pressure inside pushes the dorr into the aircraft structure, like a plug, and seals it. No human being could open that door above about 14,000 feet (they're designed to be opened at that height because some airports in the Himalayas are that high).

Got to disappear now for a bit.

Hope somebody asks what cargo was on board

"i get that passengers couldn't be offloaded at 20,000 feet as doors couldn't be opened without depressurisation BUT can the cargo hold be opened at 20,000ft? is it a separate 'chamber' that can be opened without effecting the cabin?"

There is a hatch to get into the hold from the cabin, but you can't open the cargo door - they work the same way as the passenger doors. And the rpessurisation is the same all the way through the aeroplane. The holds aren't separately pressurised - that's next to impossible to do as the cabin floor would buckle (it's the same as blowing up a balloon - the aeroplane always wants to make a cylinder when it's pressurised and it's damn near impossible to stop it)

yes i read there are access hatches to front and aft cargo holds on 777's and that that is quite unusual compared to other passenger planes of that size. wondered if there was any relevance. so cargo hold exterior doors can't be opened. is there anyway to get yourselves and cargo off of a plane at 20,000ft if you don't give a damn what happens to the plane and passengers afterwards? and is there any way to survive exiting a plane at 20,000ft?

thanks for answering my q btw

Where has the suggestion of gold come from as I've not read that anywhere but here?

Possible plane was on ground when signals sent, does this mean landed or crashed?!

Why has nobody asked about the cargo!!

I think the gold thing is speculation but no idea really