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The Grillo case (AKA Nigella & Saatchi)

461 replies

BerylStreep · 13/12/2013 14:14

So the last thread on the Grillo case is full.

I have taken the liberty of starting a new one here for people's thoughts as the case unfolds.

OP posts:
grabagran · 20/12/2013 20:29

Absolutely. Saatchi uses litigation as a form of conversation, according to Lawson. He threatened to sue her for the lost money if she didn't give evidence. Even his former accountant was accused of stealing from him after complaining about working 19-hour shifts.
If I'd been married to him I'd have taken anything I could get my hands on.

BeCool · 20/12/2013 21:18

I'm not a fan of the Grillos and their drug use defence was dreadful. But I bet they actually stole very little if anything from CS.

CS was happy with their spending. These women did all but wipe the arses of other members of the household day and night. They worked hard and were totally at beck and call of people who wanted what they wanted, when they wanted it, regardless of cost or inconvenience to any paid staff.

I bet they were at the receiving end of some fairly dreadful behaviour. All this reference to 'family' means they were exposed and subject to the same level of abuse as other family members but without the riches. I believe it likely they were told to buy themselves presents or treat themselves to a trip to NY or Berlin by way of compensation for all the shit they put up with with a smile. And their loyalty in sticking around for so many years. That is priceless to difficult people big the sisters didn't stay there would be an endless stream of pa's and the issues surrounding that.

The sisters were caught between rock and hard place. CS clicked onto them as the source of a massive stick to beat NL with in the spectacular fallout after the Scott's debacle.

The drug defence was either done out of pure desperation when they realised how bad their situation was, or someone made it worth their while to make those claims.

It would be unfair if a man of his wealth and legal resources were to take a civil case against the sisters. How would they be in a position to fund a defence? Watching that space.

That's my take on it.

grabagran · 20/12/2013 22:07

It's the job of a defence lawyer to get his clients to get the gloves off as the result of an adversarial justice system and Lawson giving evidence for the prosecution. Personally I wouldn't have used the "buying the Grillo's silence about the drugtaking" angle, I would just said that she was in la-la land so much she authorised everything but simply couldn't remember. Also, had I been Nigella, I would have refused to give evidence and if Saatchi then sued me for the missing £560k (which he threatened to do), expenditure which apparently I had authorised, I would have written him a cheque immediately.

lalalonglegs · 20/12/2013 22:36

Deborah Orr has summarised the dynamic between the Saatchi-Lawsons and the Grillos very concisely here.

These sentences really nail it though:

"The verdict is sensational, but not, perhaps, surprising. The moral of the tale is this: "Don't give people credit cards, fail ever to check the statements before paying up, then become outraged when it turns out that the credit cards have been used."

"The fact that this is a lesson that few people other than Charles Saatchi are likely ever to need to learn is, of course, the essence of his problem in court. Why would a jury have sympathy for, or feel indignation on behalf of, two people who arranged their financial affairs in a way that is absolutely inconceivable to nearly every other person on the planet?"

merrymouse · 20/12/2013 22:49

I agree re: credit cards.

They weren't exactly nicking silver candlesticks or even concealing their expenditure by spending cash.

It was all itemised and sent to Saatchi every month. He had every opportunity to query it.

nauticant · 20/12/2013 22:51

That Deborah Orr piece is terrific and is by far the best thing I've read about this.

It's a well-needed antidote to the lobbying that celebrities should have the right in court to do a counter PR job against evidence which undermines their "brand".

AgaPanthers · 20/12/2013 23:03

"Limited period said, on page 8, that if she had taken somebody for the best part of three quarters of a million pounds, she wouldn't have bought handbags.
I agree with her. A terrible investment."

That's one of the most ridiculous comments in this thread.

I searched google for 'convicted from stealing from employer', these were the first three I found:

"An Emmett woman is heading back to prison, convicted of a similar crime that sent her to prison in the 1980s.
59-year-old Sonia Branch was sentenced Tuesday to four years in prison for stealing more than $1 million from her employer - High Desert Wall Systems in Caldwell.

Branch was sentenced Tuesday to a 20-year sentence for four counts of grand theft. Four of those years are fixed, 16 indeterminate. She will also get about a half a year credit for time served.
She is also ordered to pay full restitution, but few involved in the case expect that to happen.
"I don't think we'll get anything out of it,” said Freeman. “I don't think there is anything left. I think it's all gone.""

"A Dublin mother of two who embezzled almost €190,000 from two employers including the National Concert Hall has been remanded in custody pending sentence next month.

The court heard that although Mary O’Toole (44) had severe financial pressures at the time due to mounting debt, she spent the money on tarot reading hotlines and “nonsense” internet shopping."

"A Cheektowaga woman convicted 17 years ago of embezzling $120,000 from her Buffalo employer pleaded guilty Tuesday to stealing nearly $92,000 from other city-based companies where she worked as a bookkeeper.

She said Leach was arrested when she returned from a trip.

She said Leach took lavish trips around the world four or five times a year."

People that steal tend to squander the money on crap, end of.

merrymouse · 20/12/2013 23:03

I don't think people are supportive of Nigella because they are worried about her brand. I think they dislike seeing a woman and her children having her dirty laundry washed in public so that her vindictive ex can take his revenge.

Golddigger · 20/12/2013 23:07

larrygrylls "No one likes being ripped off, no matter how rich.."
I think I am right in saying that cs commented somewhere that it was only money.

Golddigger · 20/12/2013 23:08

The rich do things differently to other people.

ThatIsIt · 20/12/2013 23:20

I feel so sad for NL and her children.

Golddigger · 20/12/2013 23:24

She lost, big time.

BeCool · 20/12/2013 23:33

I'd love to know how the defence came to have a copy of CS's email to NL

Spockster · 20/12/2013 23:35

Can anyone explain why the sisters are not bring pursued for for the tax on all these benefits in kind? Did SC pay their tax on the cc purchases as well?

merrymouse · 20/12/2013 23:40

Yes, becool, I read that until that e-mail turned up they weren't going to allow the 'bad character' argument.

BeCool · 20/12/2013 23:43

Exactly!
Weapon.

nauticant · 20/12/2013 23:55

I'd love to know how the defence came to have a copy of CS's email to NL

Apparently it was provided to the court by Nigella's legal team.

limitedperiodonly · 21/12/2013 00:11

People that steal tend to squander the money on crap, end of.

True agapanties. But if I was to steal, I wouldn't.

End off.

BeCool · 21/12/2013 00:12
Shock
limitedperiodonly · 21/12/2013 00:37

That Deborah Orr piece is very good lala.

I didn't see it like that before, but I think she's right.

It's not the same, but it reminds me of a situation I was in that I'd forgotten until reading that.

I used to work somewhere where we had a low basic wage and a good production bonus.

In the first week I was shown by a colleague how to make up expenses. I was more than happy to do it, but if I hadn't, I'd have been rocking the boat because my expenses would have been vastly lower than everyone else's which would have made them look bad and so they would have mistrusted me.

Everyone knew roughly what their made-up expenses limit was. Some people got more than me, some people got less. Our boss knew we were making it up, but nothing was ever said. It was all a bit of a laugh. Some people did actually write down: 'Drinks with Mickey Mouse.'

Then one week I annoyed him and my expenses were rejected without a word. That was a massive chunk out my weekly wage. But I instantly knew that couldn't say anything because he'd ask me to justify it, and of course, I couldn't.

I was defrauding the company and I'd been doing that week-on-week for well over a year. It was gross misconduct for me and a handy method of control for him.

claig · 21/12/2013 00:39

According to the Daily Mail, the Grillos' father was a member of the Ndrangheta

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2527290/Mafia-past-Grillo-sisters-father-Mob-member-Michele-jailed-15-years-brutally-kidnapping-fashion-designers-sister.html

claig · 21/12/2013 01:04

Read the Daily Mail article now. The father is a reformed character, he was in the Ndrangheta when young, according to the Mail, so not really relevant.

mathanxiety · 21/12/2013 02:28

Ah so 'what's yours is mine and what's mine is also mine' is their motto and guiding philosophy.

What Deborah Orr is failing to grasp is the fact that it is not anyone's responsibility but the thief's if a window is left open and a thief climbs in and steals your jewelry, or if a woman walks around town with one of those backpack style bags containing her money, or if a wallet is carried in a back pocket and a pickpocket reaches in. It may well be stupid to do all of the above but nobody who gets robbed is stupid to the point where the thief is not guilty of theft by reason of the stupidity of the person whose money is stolen. And I bet Orr herself would press charges if she was cleaned out even if she had left the window open. I can't imagine anyone smacking themselves on the forehead and saying 'Duh. My fault entirely', in any case where they have been robbed, no matter how great the temptation their personal belongings presented to a person who took advantage.

And just because you do it once ,or ten times, and get away with it doesn't mean it's not theft every single time. It would be theft if it was a carer stealing from an old lady in a home and it was theft in the Saatchi/Lawson case. Common sense my arse.

They themselves presented themselves as family in so far as they knew everything about the household. Orr can't have it both ways in her characterisation of calling them 'family' as paternalistic. They saw themselves in that light.

The problem with employing people in your own household is not one of master and servant and the tendency to baulk at this. It is pure laziness and failure to manage, and there are lots of really, really bad managers out there, in all walks of life and not just the domestic workplace. Working in a private residence doesn't mean you are a servant any more than it makes your employer your master if you are working in finance. Methinks Orr has watched a few too many Downton Abbey reruns, given the picture she appears to have of how things were done in the era when homes with servants was the norm above a certain income bracket. TV series set up the contrasting worlds and all the rest of the drama that goes into Upstairs Downstairs and Downton because otherwise it would be more boring than watching paint drying.

The reality is that in days of yore households were often minutely managed by many families. Result -- the money and the family silver stayed in the family and nobody got ripped off in the process of ordering goods or services. And there were friendships too, and bonds between employer and employed, and still stuff was not stolen. Perhaps the big difference between that sort of picture and the one presented of the Saatchi/Lawson menage was that people understood the difference between Mine and Yours, right and wrong, give and grab.

The Grillos rightly objected to peonage, or debt bondage. It is illegal because it is slavery by another name. Nothing to do with Hegel or co-dependency whatsoever, (and that section and its references is risible).

You cannot insist that someone is in your family, then cry fraud when they behave as if they are.

Oh yes you bloody well can. These were not children of 6 and 7. Orr fails to do the Grillo sisters the honour of treating them as grown adults.

The whole article is a patronising piece of shite.

Eastpoint · 21/12/2013 04:12

I prefer this piece by Geoffrey Robertson QC

Witness vilification

mathanxiety · 21/12/2013 04:27

Many excellent and very pertinent points raised there.

(And I agree, the question of how CS got access to the private communications of the Grillos and their lawyers is one that needs answering and the matter of this private communication being broadcast around the web should also be investigated.)