Well done Ed Miliband for speaking out about the Daily Mail's article on his father

[claig]

The Daily Mail used a low tactic of accusing Ed miliband's father of hating Britain.

I think it was a nasty thing to do. Just because someone is a Marxist and may criticise some aspects of the country or its instiutions does not mean that they hate Britain.

I was just thinking about you nancy , what is your view on all this?

At the risk of sounding like an echo , what a thought provoking and interesting post limited. That certainly doesn't sound like a pleasant environment to work in.

Another round of applause for Limited ... from somebody who fell foul of the tabloid think machine. She has understated it.

flippinada it pays the bills. Newsdesks are fantastic and terrifying.

There is a great deal of solidarity and fun when you're in pursuit.

On reflection, sometimes that's right and sometimes it's wrong.

It's heady; I admit it.

But I object to people who have no idea saying it's fair. Because it's not. It is what it is and they don't know what they're talking about.

I can well imagine it being a high stress job with awful lows and amazing highs limited.

I know next to nothing about journalism so I'll shut up about it now!

Having said that. .in my non journalistic opinion, this has backfired on the DM quite spectacularly.

Whatever people think of Alistair Campbell, folk pay attention when he speaks...and his
petition (just started today) already has over 29,000 signatures.

I think it is a mistake for Campbell to get involved. He will swing a lot of people's sympathy back to the Mail and some people will start to think that this is becoming political with attacks on the Mail.

McBride is very smart, and even though he is quite disliked, he has accepted he did bad things and is open and honest about them, and he has advised Ed to do the following

"Damian McBride, the former spin doctor to Gordon Brown who worked with Miliband closely at the Treasury, said it was "certainly brave and not without risk" for him to take on the Mail. "He almost certainly does have significant public support on this, but the danger is in taking social media as a reading on how the public feel generally about newspapers," he said.

"He should take it out of the Mail and make it more of an issue of how we do our politics in Britain and elevate it to that level. The more it becomes a war the more it is corrosive because it is very difficult to restore those relationships."

www.theguardian.com/politics/2013/oct/02/daily-mail-ed-miliband-row-press-regulation

At the moment Ed has the sympathy of Daily Mail readers, but it won't last long if they keep seeing Campbell on their TV screens.

If it becomes a polarised political battle, then my guess is that the Mail will win it.

Ed had the moral highground when he stood alone against the Mail.

But when you see Kinnock, Campbell, Clegg etc laying in to the Mail, then I think the tables may turn.

I think Gove will come out a winner on the Tory side, as he has defended the Mail more than some of the other Tories, who seem to think that kicking the Mail is safe for them to do.

I have mixed feelings about Campbell. He was a bastard as a spin doctor but he is very knowledgeable about both politics and the media, so he is worth listening to. He writes and speaks very well.

Of course Gove is defending the DM...his wife works for them!

Petite that pretty much sums up my thinking too. Very ingredient and astute but not someone you want to get on the wrong side of.

Petite, he is worth listening to, but he does not appeal to non-Labour voters. He is a huge liability to Labour for non-Labour voters.

Frankly, no matter what Campbell says about McBride, McBride has had the guts to accept that he did bad things and therefore in non-Labour voters' views, he has to some extent redeemed himself.

Ahem. I mean intelligent .

'Of course Gove is defending the DM...his wife works for them!'

Yes, and rightly so, and his wife is a very good columnist. I like her new column. But, I think Gove is very clever and is playing the long game, just as he did when he was at Leveson. He knows that when the dust settles, the Mail will still be standing and reaching millions of readers every single day and that is real power.

Unlike Lynton Crosby, who appeals to nobody at all, except perhaps himself (and even that's debatable).

I wouldn't know about that, claig. I don't read the Daily Mail.

Lynton Crosby is very smart, he does not appear on our TV screens. He doesn't write novels and publicise them or appear on our screens to campaign for charitable causes or anything else. He remains in the shadows, just like the very smart McBride also used to do.

Im no expert limited but I've read flat earth news... And from this have derived a wee bit of insight into the world of journalism. How time restricted journalists are, how the whole industry revolves around commercial interests rather than truth telling.. Articles driven by political propaganda/agenda are only one part of it (according to Davies) and I have to say he presents a far more succinct description of the industry than you.. "Tory boys/girls" don't have absolute sway incidentally.. Certainly not at the guardian, independent etc... As a dedicated journalist you must know that..

Ps I didn't say at any point that this was "acceptable" so kindly don't infer otherwise eh?!

That's you told limited. By someone who has read a book, no less.

In fact someone on the news informed Campbell today that Peter Oborne says that he will dig out his own notes on Campbell and publish them next week. Once the story turns to Campbell, all the moral highground has been lost. They say Campbell was a good spin doctor, but putting himself near the centre of this story and calling Dacre a coward, is a huge mistake in my opinion. McBride has far better advice.

"His [Campbell's] personal conduct was far, far worse and more demeaning than any Daily Mail journalist.

It is well known that it was Campbell who started the story that John Major tucked his shirt into his underpants. He set out to humiliate and ridicule Major in an incredibly unpleasant and personal way. He once related in print that Mr Major, when prime minister, had tried to engage him in friendly conversation on the official VC 10 during an overseas trip. Campbell boasted that he cut him dead: "Oh sod off prime minister. I’m trying to do my expenses."

Mr Campbell denied John Major an ounce of the respect to which a prime minister is entitled, even from the most hostile commentator. On one occasion Campbell (writing for Today newspaper) called Major "the piece of lettuce who passes for prime minister." On another occasion he called him "simply a second-rate, shallow, lying little toad of a man".

This kind of conduct and language certainly does not square with Mr Campbell’s statement that "I respected politics and I respected politicians."

blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/peteroborne/100239575/alastair-campbell-treated-politics-with-more-contempt-than-any-daily-mail-journalist/

Never said I was an expert flipp but I'm entitled to an opinion eh? This being a discursive forum n'all.

Hasn't prevented you from contributing either I notice....

Im no expert limited

No, you not.

Of course you are entitled to your opinion - as you say, it's a platform for discussion.

I think having years of experience in an industry probably trumps reading a book about it though, authoritatively speaking.

I think that Moistenbint1 has expressed a view that is shared by many non-Labour voters. Watching Campbell on our screens attacking Dacre will not win any hearts and minds of non-Labour voters and may soon do exactly the opposite. Most voters rightly sympathised with Ed, but I don't think it will last if the likes of Campbell carry on being interviewed.

This is a fight between Ed and the Mail, and if Ed wants to appear strong to the public, he should fight it on his own without the help of people like Campbell, because Campbell is Labour's Achilles Heel.