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Cameron is repeating the housing benefit myth

19 replies

ttosca · 25/06/2012 09:36

Having long abandoned the pretence that "we're all in this together", David Cameron is preparing yet another raid on the welfare budget. In a speech today, he will announce plans to abolish housing benefit for under-25s and will indicate that the government is considering "time-limiting" Jobseeker's Allowance and restricting payments for large families (specifically, limiting child benefit to three children, although this proposal will not be mentioned in the speech).

As previously signalled by George Osborne, the cuts are designed to save the government £10bn but so far Cameron hasn't chosen to focus on the alleged savings. Rather, he has argued that the plans are necessary to reverse a "culture of entitlement". In his pre-speech interview with the Mail on Sunday, Cameron claimed that housing benefit "discourages" young people from working:

A couple will say, 'We are engaged, we are both living with our parents, we are trying to save before we get married and have children and be good parents.'

But how does it make us feel, Mr Cameron, when we see someone who goes ahead, has the child, gets the council home, gets the help that isn't available to us?

One is trapped in a welfare system that discourages them from working, the other is doing the right thing and getting no help.

With these words, Cameron is perpetuating the biggest myth about housing benefit: that it is a benefit for the unemployed. The truth is that just one in eight claimants is out of work (not a statistic that you'll find reported in most papers). The majority of those who claim housing benefit, including the under-25s, do so to compensate for substandard wages and extortionate rents. A recent study by The Building and Social Housing Foundation showed that 93 per cent of new housing benefit claims made between 2010 and 2011 were made by households containing at least one employed adult.

It is meaningless of Cameron to claim that the housing benefit budget is "too large" without exploring why. The inflated budget, which will reach £23.2bn this year, is the result of a conscious choice by successive governments to subsidise private landlords rather than invest in affordable social housing. Yet rather than addressing the problem of stagnant wages and excessive rents, Cameron, in a bid to appease his querulous party, has chosen to squeeze the already squeezed.

That he should do so by abolishing housing benefit for under-25s is particularly egregious. Of the 380,000 young people who claim the benefit, a significant number do so because they have been thrown out by their parents. As Shelter notes, "Last year nearly 10,000 households in priority need were recognised as homeless after they were thrown out by their parents. Many more won?t have shown up in the statistics and will have resorted to sofa surfing, hostels or at worst the streets."

Others may be unable to live at home after their parents divorced or downsized or, as Petra Davies previously noted on the site, may have been rejected due to their sexuality. As she noted, around 25 per cent of the young homeless population in urban areas is lesbian, gay, bisexual, or transgender.

But such objections will do little to deter Cameron's drive to shrink the state. With his latest attack on the working poor, he has finally outed himself as a compassionless Conservative.

www.newstatesman.com/blogs/politics/2012/06/cameron-repeating-housing-benefit-myth

OP posts:
threeleftfeet · 25/06/2012 09:58

How long till we can vote them out again?

What I don't understand is how the people who support these kinds of policies don't see how it will affect them

Putting aside compassionate arguments for a minute (as they don't seem to have any) - if we restrict access to housing and benefits for large sections of society, while also cutting support to those charities that help them - there will be more homelessness, more broken homes as families can't afford to live together, more health problems (e.g. depression) more social problems (e.g. drug use and crime), which will make this country a worse place for everyone.

It's such an insult to young people as well. As you only say 1 in 8 people on HB are actually out of work. But Cameron wants us to believe they're all lazy feckless individuals, laughing while they claim their benefits from "hard working people" when in fact they are the hard working people! They just happen to be on low incomes. Where's the faith in our young people? What are they doing to help them realise their skills and talents?

EightiesChick · 25/06/2012 10:01

I don't know what he expects people to do if benefits are just removed - live on the streets, I guess. There will be more riots and things will get worse, not better. True colours coming out. I feel very bad for young people right now.

EightiesChick · 25/06/2012 10:02

And it's three years before another election. Sad

CogitoErgoSometimes · 25/06/2012 13:02

"Of the 380,000 young people who claim the benefit, a significant number do so because they have been thrown out by their parents."

I personally know a family that have quite fraudulently 'thrown out' two of their children simply to get them into emergency accommodation and then a place of their own. The family is very close and there is no problem with overcrowding. They had to do it this way, they told me, because it's how the system works and it's how everyone else does it.

That's the problem. What starts out as a system to help those in genuine need get accommodation quickly turns into a scheme that can be exploited. How we make distinctions is debatable but I think the PM is right to ask the questions.

threeleftfeet · 25/06/2012 13:23

Right to ask whether we should stop HB for all under 25s? Really?

How could that ever be a good path to take? It's so obviously flawed on so many levels!

He's most definitely not asking the right questions IMO!

Some of the right questions might be

  • how can we insure working families can access decent affordable housing? (don't forget most HB claimants are working)
  • what can we do to create employment opportunities?
  • what can we do to ensure people have a decent living wage?
  • how can we ensure that housing is a right not a privilege for people in this wealthy country?
  • how can we best support our young people to ensure they have the best chances to utilise their skills and talents?
edam · 25/06/2012 13:27

There's another thread running on this already so you may not get a huge number of replies here. I agree with you, btw. MPs are in no position to lecture anyone else on finances, given the expenses scandal and the fact that they are the ones responsible for creating tax loopholes that allow multi-millionaires to avoid paying the billions of pounds they owe. AND the fact that this is a cabinet of multi-millionaires - none of them have a clue what is is like to worry about whether you can keep a roof over your head.

dancingmummy · 25/06/2012 13:27

He's horrific. The more I read about the the mre I believe he's actually trying to kill off the lower classes through starvation. When I was 18 I had to claim housing benefit to subsidise my wage- there was no question of me living with my disabled mum in her 2 bed flat! Wages don't increase in line with house prices & rent prices, and wages aren't distributed proportionatly(sp?) throughout companies, thus a family with 2 working parents could easily require housing benefit! It not fucking rocket science Cameron! But hey ho what does he care?

EdithWeston · 25/06/2012 13:28

I listening to most of his speech.

He didn't outline any plans.

He did throw out a number of areas for debate, about what was the purpose of benefits and areas where there are apparent anomalies between the current aims (as stated by all three parties) and the actual circumstances where claimants get the money.

He said some measures were phrased deliberately to be provocative, because he wants lots of contributions to the debate. Looks like he's succeeded in that.

edam · 25/06/2012 13:29

this is the other thread

AKE2012 · 25/06/2012 13:33

Cameron and his supporters just think

Benefit claimants = scroungers

Council house occupants =benefit claimants

some people just dont have a grasp on the reality.

ttosca · 25/06/2012 19:00

What I don't understand is how the people who support these kinds of policies don't see how it will affect them

That's because the very rich tend to be shielded from the realities of the way the vast majority live. Tory votes who live in the shires are unlikely to encounter the many problems caused by poverty, homelessness, joblessness, hopelessness, health problems, drug abuse, etc.

I don't know what he expects people to do if benefits are just removed - live on the streets, I guess. There will be more riots and things will get worse, not better. True colours coming out. I feel very bad for young people right now.

Let's hope there are riots in the streets. Democracy obviously isn't working. The only thing that has ever improved the conditions of working people is collective extra-Parliamentary action.

OP posts:
CogitoErgoSometimes · 26/06/2012 17:09

"Let's hope there are riots in the streets"

Let's not, eh? No skin off your nose I suspect because you prefer to agitate from a distance, if I remember rightly. Don't even live in the UK?

ttosca · 26/06/2012 19:20

I live in the UK.

Which is more harmful? Riots will may have a real effect in stopping the sociopathic policies of the Tories, which are destroying lives and immiserating thousands or these policies themselves?

Usually, in riots against governments, it's mostly property which is hurt.

The Tories, on the other hand,are wrecking the economy, putting people out of jobs, denying them educational opportunities, threatening the welfare net of the unemployed and disabled, and generally making life miserable for anyone who isn't rich. They are sociopaths.

Sociopaths belong away from society, where they can do no harm - preferably in jail.

If a riot manages to change the political situation, it would save a lot more lives than it harms.

OP posts:
HappyMummyOfOne · 26/06/2012 22:44

"As you only say 1 in 8 people on HB are actually out of work"

Even if that is the true stat, i'm guessing there is a very high percentage claiming because they either work part time, have one adult at home or have more children then they could afford to support. Whilst they may be paying a little tax, they will be taking more out of the system than they are putting in.

Whilst the proposal seems ok, it could backfire when people simply have a child to get round the rule. Our teen pregnancy rate is high enough already.

CogitoErgoSometimes · 27/06/2012 07:18

"it could backfire when people simply have a child to get round the rule"

That's why the rules need to change at a more fundamental level. There are so many ways to get around the rules at the moment that they have become the normal, accepted practice.

edam · 27/06/2012 11:16

Yeah, because having a child is so easy and such a tiny commitment for the rest of your life, of course people do it at the drop of a hat to get round the benefits rules. Hmm

SueHeck · 27/06/2012 11:24

You'r ebeing exceptionally naiive if you think many don't, edam.

I agree with cogito here, we need debate and reform, glad DC seems to have the courage to open up the discussion to begin with.

How do people think society managed even forty years ag before flats for teen mums were handed out like sweets? hmm? Society mananged by trying not to get pregnant with no husband and no means of financial support firtly, and you lived with family unitl you'd saved enough fo ryour own place.

Many married couple slived with parents for years, god knows why so many peopel think that's unaccapetable and that the good old taxpayer should contnue to pick up the bill for other people's shortsighted choices.

It's simple. You leave school, you train or get a job. You save. THEN you find a home and start a family.
You can do it the other way round but WTF should I and everyone else pay for you?

FartBlossom · 27/06/2012 11:41

sounds ideal edam if only homes were affordable. Many people would never move out of thier parents as they would never be able to afford either the high rents in private lets or the deposit for a house. I think this needs to be looked at before benefits.

YoYoYoItsTillyMinto · 27/06/2012 11:50

but the current problem is MC people have fewer children because they cannot afford to. lowering rents wont help them & the consequential house price cash will screw them (& everyone else) over further.

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