Unemployed used as unpaid staff at Jubilee event and expected to sleep outside

[HRHEightiesChick]

This story about unpaid workers doing the security at the flotilla event yesterday is bad. They were misled about not being paid, and had to sleep out in tents or actually outside 'under London bridge' was suggested to them. This is Workfare in action again, I believe.

'There is talk saying that they had to provide their own camping gear?'

Not sure where I heard it, thats why I thought I'd ask here

'Yes Claig, a whole 4 hours sleep to be followed by a full day working on their feet'

That is probably similar to the some of the people who camped out overnight to watch the parade.

It was a one-off historic occasion with millions of people involved. They were probably forewarned that they would need to get some kip on the coach and be prepared for a long day to ensure that things went smoothly.

claig if you want to be pedantic - what actually happened was they had to sleep rough.

If it had gone to plan, they would have had a few hours sleep on a coach (if you can sleep on a coach).

Then the night after they pitched tents in a wet field in Essex.

The sleeping arrangements aside, my point was I fail to see how this "experience" would have helped me when I was 6 months unemployed myself.

Claig - why is it 'very sad that young people have to volunteer to work for free to get work experience?'

It sounds perfectly normal to me. Work experience is often neccesary because so many people have no experience of work, so what are companies supposed to do? Just employ people for the sake of it so that there is less unemployment without any thought as to whether people are suitable for the job or not?

The people in this article were all offered pay in addition to their benefits. They were not expected to need any accommodation so that's why non was provided. The thing was badly organised, but it wasn't some sort of plot to exploit people and that them like shit for fun.

being sent miles away to sleep rough and work in these conditions wouldn't have helped me at all

While you of course deserve help, i find that attitude quite frustrating. It's not all about what you can get, it's also about how you can still contribute to society.

There are plenty of people that wouldn't need to be forced to work for free if they were unemployed, they would do stuff voluntarily. Those people are probably going to be a much more attractive prospect for future employers that those who just wait for free training to come their way.

"probably"

and "probably the event company charged a good whack for each of the people they provided, and made a fat profit out of it.

and "probably" the events company treats its workers with such contempt that it doesn't prove toilet or washing facilities, and they end up getting changed in the open air.

"That is probably similar to the some of the people who camped out overnight to watch the parade."

But they were there out of choice.

I'm staggered you can't see the difference.

"While you of course deserve help, i find that attitude quite frustrating. It's not all about what you can get, it's also about how you can still contribute to society."

Excuse me, but I do expect training to be of benefit to me. Otherwise it's a futile exercise all round!

And you are now making assumptions about me based on the scant knowledge that I once was unemployed for a period.

I'll go tell the places I have volunteered in the past (of which there are many!) that actually I didn't do it to help out, actually I'm only out for myself, shall I

I find your comments extremely offensive and narrow minded.

They arrived at 3 a.m. and had to start at about 5 a.m. Would you have gone to sleep. I wouldn't. I would have had a coffee and chatted to teh rest who probably didn't sleep either for those 2 hours.

Lots of us used to travel abroad by coach and had to sleep overnight and wake to get the ferry and then sleep again. When we were young, we couldn't afford the air fares etc.

'Then the night after they pitched tents in a wet field in Essex.'

Listen to the BBC interview that I linked earlier. They didn't have to sleep in a wet field. That is the spin of teh masters of the craft. There was dry sheltered accommodation available and 2 or 3 chose to pitch a tent, against advice from company staff.

'I fail to see how this "experience" would have helped me when I was 6 months unemployed myself.'

These people are not as fortunate as Lord Prescott. They want to get this SIA certificate so that they can find work. They were prepared to go through this, having probably been told what to expect and that they would have to sleep on the coach, because it was a way to get their SIA certificate paid for by this company, which would enable them to work for 3 years in the security industry.

Why wouldn't these people choose to be there too if it was giving them valuable work experience that could lead to future employment three?

And I said training should benefit you, or whoevers doing it. But personal benefit shouldn't be a persons sole motivation for doing anything.

Read my post, I did not make personal assumptions about you at all, so maybe it's you that needs to stop assuming that you know what I am thinking.

But why couldn't they have been paid for that work experience?

I love your repeated use of the word "probably," claig, about things that you don't know.

I think you're probably just making things up to probably put the most favourable spin possible on a bunch of probably profiteering scammers who probably treat their employees with contempt and probably exploit and degrade them and probably treat them like scum, while probably charging the public body a commercial rate which is probably calculated as if they were paying a living wage to the probably trained and experienced people which public safety probably deserves and probably has a right to expect.

"But personal benefit shouldn't be a persons sole motivation for doing anything."

Sorry but can we please pause a second while I PMSL. Oh the irony!

Our whole system of capitalism is built on the notion that "greed is good" (to quote Margaret Thatcher of course)

or to quote Adam Smith, who invented this whole idea of capitalism, about 250 years ago

the "pursuit of self-interest was a far more reliable way to ensure that the public interest would be served than any alternative".

'Claig - why is it 'very sad that young people have to volunteer to work for free to get work experience?''

Because rich companies profit from their labour and it is unethical. Just as I think it is unethical for politicians who can claim for bath plugs and other expenses on the taxpayer to employ young interns on no pay.

'But why couldn't they have been paid for that work experience?'

I wonder how much money the charity paid the company. They are using taxpayer money and my guess is that they are not spending it willy-nilly. My guess is that the margins are thin.

If they got a csis card and if it was a question of a grumpy coach driver, then -meh, these things happen. But I'm not convinced...

'Please answer the points I raised upthread.'

Can you repreat the points, I can't find them.

Weren't they paid £1.5m?

So they didn't pay the slaves staff
What did they spend it on?

lambethlil. listen to the BBC interview. The story is not as it seems. Political capital is being made out of it.

news.bbc.co.uk/today/hi/today/newsid_9726000/9726250.stm

It's shit being exploited because you have few choices available to you.

I have done, and would do again, crap jobs for low pay.

I wouldnt do a seasonal job with terrible conditions for no pay on the possibility I may get some temporary minimum wage work for 3 weeks in the summer. And I don't want that to be the only option for anyone else.

It could be any of us bussed in to do this shit if we're a bit unlucky. I don't have a city and guilds in stewarding, so I suppose this could easily happen to me if I was made redundant and couldn't find another job.

'Weren't they paid £1.5m?'

What for one night's work for 220 employees?

This is nothing like MPs expenses. Young people are often sent out to do work experience, because it helps them get a job, not because it give large rich companies profits.

Work experience students quite often cost companies, as a paid member of staff has to take time out to train them when it woudo probably be more cost efficient for them to just do the job themselves.

According to the BBC article, they were offered pay.